Cecil the lion's killer revealed as American dentist

[adrift]

Just to confirm, your only problem is that the animal was research tagged, and thus it was an illegal hunt.

Hunting an animal and having it’s meat be eaten, especially by the poor, is well within Catholic morality.

That can’t be her problem since it wasn’t an illegal hunt because it had a research tag. It was an illegal hunt because the place where the hunt occurred did not have a license for a lion.

 

[Murmurs]

Am I the only one that’s shocked that on this CATHOLIC forum we’re still discussing “Cecil” the Lion amid all of the injustice towards humans in the world, including 57 million abortions since 1973, Middle Eastern Christian genocide, and others?

I expected it from the media but not from fellow Catholics.

Cecil doesn’t need “scare quotes”. Insofar as we (human beings) are aware, that was the lion’s name.

Whether or not he was aware he had a name, I don’t think a lion - or any animal - deserves to be slaughtered because a dentist has too much disposable income.

But anyway, I think it is possible to entertain two things at once. The (illegal) death of a lion in Zimbabwe, or if he’d mauled every hunter and poacher who ever got near him and lived to a ripe old age instead, doesn’t change what’s happening in the Middle East, or stop (or make more likely) one abortion.

What kind of crazy logic says you can’t be hugely outraged by a privileged and arrogantly smug man who spent 40 hours torturing a wounded lion if you’re also outraged by other things?

 

[ucfengr]

What kind of crazy logic says you can’t be hugely outraged by a privileged and arrogantly smug man who spent 40 hours torturing a wounded lion if you’re also outraged by other things?

Back up…The dentist didn’t torture anything not in his chair for a root canal. He didn’t shoot the lion and then waterboard it or put it on the rack. He shot the lion and then tracked it because his initial shot didn’t kill it. I suppose he could have just let the lion go, because, it’s not like a wounded lion is dangerous or anything .

 

[ringil]

Am I the only one that’s shocked that on this CATHOLIC forum we’re still discussing “Cecil” the Lion amid all of the injustice towards humans in the world, including 57 million abortions since 1973, Middle Eastern Christian genocide, and others?

I expected it from the media but not from fellow Catholics.

It’s a news forum. I’ve seen sillier things discussed ad nauseum.

 

[estesbob]

I heard George Bush was his gunbearer and the Safar was funded by the Koch brothers

 

[Bubba_Switzler]

Whether or not he was aware he had a name, I don’t think a lion - or any animal - deserves to be slaughtered because a dentist has too much disposable income…

What kind of crazy logic says you can’t be hugely outraged by a privileged and arrogantly smug man who spent 40 hours torturing a wounded lion if you’re also outraged by other things?

As has been discussed previously in this thread, there is much more to it than this.

It is inherent to man’s stewardship of animals that they be slaughtered. That applies not only to tasty domesticated animals like cows, pigs, and sheep, but also to destructive and dangerous animals like wild pigs, coyotes, and lions. Left unchecked, lions would proliferate and overun their territories (killing each other and dying of starvation or, worse, killing and eating humans as tigers frequently do in India).

Now, given that what makes more sense? To pay park rangers to kill animals or to charge money for “arrogantly smug” dentists to kill them? Sensible people have elected for the later.

So indulge your outrage, if that tickles your fancy, but understand that you are not seeing the whole picture clearly.

 

[ringil]

I heard George Bush was his gunbearer and the Safar was funded by the Koch brothers

I can’t wait until I can use. . . .

“It’s Obama’s fault” for years and years after he leaves office.

 

[DrTaffy]

Now, given that what makes more sense? Topay park rangers to kill animals or to charge money for “arrogantly smug” dentists to kill them? Sensible people have elected for the later.

This was not a Lion that had been selected for culling by the park rangers, nor was the park financially benefitting from this. This was the Alpha male of the pride being lured out of the park by poachers. It was illegal.

So indulge your outrage, if that tickles your fancy, but understand that you are not seeing the whole picture clearly.

Pot, kettle, black.

 

[Brendan]

This was not a Lion that had been selected for culling by the park rangers, nor was the park financially benefitting from this. This was the Alpha male of the pride being lured out of the park by poachers. It was illegal.:

All indications are that a valid permit was issued by the government on behalf of the park authority to cull a male lion.

And it is precisely the dominant male that are desired to by culled. This opens up the pride to be dominated by an outside male, and thus introducing a new genetic line.

 

[Bubba_Switzler]

This was not a Lion that had been selected for culling by the park rangers, nor was the park financially benefitting from this. This was the Alpha male of the pride being lured out of the park by poachers. It was illegal.

Perhaps not that lion. Nobody here is defending the error though the details at this time are unclear.

Most of the discussion, including the post that I replid to, concerns trophy hunting generally. (About 600 lions are legally killed each year.)

 

[Bubba_Switzler]

In 2007, a book called The World Without Us turned up on bestseller lists, providing the elite with a satisfying picture of nature undisturbed by the presence of human beings. The book quotes Les Knight, the founder of the Voluntary Human Extinction Movement, as saying that humans should stop procreating so that the world can revert to a pristine state: “The last humans could enjoy their final sunsets peacefully, knowing they have returned the planet as close as possible to the Garden of Eden.”

The most self-indulgent generation in history is comically puritanical about nature. While shredding the Ten Commandments, it draws up a longer and longer list of forbidden acts against non-human things. The rich can pursue trophy wives but they must never participate in trophy hunting. Never mind if it is legal, contributes to conservation funds, and pares down dangerous animal populations.

Hunting for “pleasure,” according to the denunciations heard in recent days, is intrinsically wrong. So, apparently, all hunting and fishing industries, not to mention sports that make use of the discomfort of animals such as horse racing, are morally tainted. According to the puritanical mentality of animal-rights activism, any interaction with nature must be strictly utilitarian. A few of its proponents will grudgingly concede that animals can be killed for human survival provided that the hunters take no pleasure in the hunting.

spectator.org/articles/63685/age-sentiment-and-cruelty

 

[Midwest88]

I can’t wait until I can use. . . .

“It’s Obama’s fault” for years and years after he leaves office.

That would actually stand up more than “Blame Bush.” Seriously. And I say that as as someone who cried when Obama was elected in 2008 out of joy, and was a full-on Obama Zombie.

On Cecil: There’s too many pages to thrift through, but if anyone is wondering there seems to be controversy over whether or not Palmer, the dentist, knew that Cecil was indeed a protected lion and not a random one walking about. The story goes that the hired guides were fully aware of Cecil being protected, didn’t care, lured him out for Palmer who was ignorant of Cecil’s true stature, and figured the lion was fair game to hunt. Regardless if this is true it’s an unfortunate situation for both parties - the hunted and hunters. It’s a bit saddening but my sorrow stops there. CAF has 30+ pages on this, a lion, they never have heard of. It’s laughable, really.

“If I had a lion, he’d look like Cecil.”

 

[FollowChrist34]

What kind of crazy logic says you can’t be hugely outraged by a privileged and arrogantly smug man who spent 40 hours torturing a wounded lion if you’re also outraged by other things?

Careful Murmurs, your true inner conversion is showing through a tad here. Watch that left wing pantheistic compassion cr*p. It ain’t in the CCC. I think JP II hunted didn’t he? Uh, what, he didn’t? Are you kidding me? He wasn’t with St. Francis was he??!!

Seriously - I think God just blessed you - as one of his. Keep up the good work.

 

[Bubba_Switzler]

Careful Murmurs, your true inner conversion is showing through a tad here. Watch that left wing pantheistic compassion cr*p. It ain’t in the CCC. I think JP II hunted didn’t he? Uh, what, he didn’t? Are you kidding me? He wasn’t with St. Francis was he??!! :

I don’t recall JPII having any children either but last time I checked, that was AOK with the Church.

 

[FollowChrist34]

I don’t recall JPII having any children either but last time I checked, that was AOK with the Church.

Yes, I think opponents to trophy hunting are probably AOK with the Church too. To put it mildly. My guess is we get a star for the day. Pizza and chianti with the Pope.

Pope Francis:

Let us protect Christ in our lives, so that we can protect others, so that we can protect creation!
Homily at His Inauguration

The vocation of being a “protector”, however, is not just something involving us Christians alone; it also has a prior dimension which is simply human, involving everyone. It means protecting all creation, the beauty of the created world, as the Book of Genesis tells us and as Saint Francis of Assisi showed us. It means respecting each of God’s creatures and respecting the environment in which we live.
Homily at His Inauguration

Please, I would like to ask all those who have positions of responsibility in economic, political and social life, and all men and women of goodwill: let us be “protectors” of creation, protectors of God’s plan inscribed in nature, protectors of one another and of the environment.
Homily at His Inauguration

To protect creation, to protect every man and every woman, to look upon them with tenderness and love, is to open up a horizon of hope; it is to let a shaft of light break through the heavy clouds; it is to bring the warmth of hope!
Homily at His Inauguration

Let us be renewed by God’s mercy … and let us become agents of this mercy, channels through which God can water the earth, protect all creation and make justice and peace flourish.
Easter Message, 2013

The book of Genesis tells us that God created man and woman entrusting them with the task of filling the earth and subduing it, which does not mean exploiting it, but nurturing and protecting it, caring for it through their work.
Feast of St. Joseph the Work and World Labor Day

… this task entrusted to us by God the Creator requires us to grasp the rhythm and logic of creation. But we are often driven by pride of domination, of possessions, manipulation, of exploitation; we do not “care” for it, we do not respect it, we do not consider it as a free gift that we must care for.
General Audience, World Environmental Day

Nurturing and cherishing creation is a command God gives not only at the beginning of history, but to each of us. It is part of his plan; it means causing the world to grow responsibly, transforming it so that it may be a garden, a habitable place for everyone.
General Audience, World Environmental Day

 

[Brendan]

Yes, I think opponents to trophy hunting are probably AOK with the Church too. To put it mildly. My guess is we get a star for the day. Pizza and chianti with the Pope.

Exactly. Kudo’s to this Dentist for protecting the pride from genetic stagnation.

 

[Brendan]

qz.com/470913/cecils-killing-has-prompted-delta-to-ban-big-game-hunts-from-flights/

Good on Delta airlines for this ban.

I don’t think that it’s a big of a ban as you think it is. You can still book your flight and check your box with your lion mane trophy on Royal Dutch\KLM or any other "Skyteam’ partner.

They code share with Delta, so same flight, just a different check in counter.

 

[pianistclare]

485 posts on such pressing matters.

Imagine how the boards will light up when Pope Francis arrives.
Especially if he brings a lion with him.

 

[zz912]

In Zimbabwe, We Don’t Cry for Lions

Winston-Salem, N.C. — MY mind was absorbed by the biochemistry of gene editing when the text messages and Facebook posts distracted me.

So sorry about Cecil.

Did Cecil live near your place in Zimbabwe?

Cecil who? I wondered. When I turned on the news and discovered that the messages were about a lion killed by an American dentist, the village boy inside me instinctively cheered: One lion fewer to menace families like mine.

My excitement was doused when I realized that the lion killer was being painted as the villain. I faced the starkest cultural contradiction I’d experienced during my five years studying in the United States.

Did all those Americans signing petitions understand that** lions actually kill people**? That all the talk about Cecil being “beloved” or a “local favorite” was media hype? Did Jimmy Kimmel choke up because Cecil was murdered or because he confused him with Simba from “The Lion King”?

In my village in Zimbabwe, surrounded by wildlife conservation areas, no lion has ever been beloved, or granted an affectionate nickname. They are objects of terror.

**The American tendency to romanticize animals **that have been given actual names and to jump onto a hashtag train has turned an ordinary situation — there were 800 lions legally killed over a decade by well-heeled foreigners who shelled out serious money to prove their prowess — into what seems to my Zimbabwean eyes an absurdist circus.

PETA is calling for the hunter to be hanged. Zimbabwean politicians are accusing the United States of staging Cecil’s killing as a “ploy” to make our country look bad. And Americans who can’t find Zimbabwe on a map are applauding the nation’s demand for the extradition of the dentist, unaware that a baby elephant was reportedly slaughtered for our president’s most recent birthday banquet.

We Zimbabweans are left shaking our heads, wondering why Americans care more about African animals than about African people.

nytimes.com/2015/08/05/opinion/in-zimbabwe-we-dont-cry-for-lions.html?_r=0

 

[ProVobis]

485 posts on such pressing matters.

Imagine how the boards will light up when Pope Francis arrives.
Especially if he brings a lion with him.

As long as the lion has a name.