Connecticut school shooting: Lawmakers offer prayers amid calls for gun control

[Robert_Bay]

Political cartoons are photo-shopped images are not allowed in this forum

 

[Prodigal_Son1]

I didn’t see the post - but I will stipulate that there quite naturally MUST be the rare shooting at a gun range.  The range I go to LIKE MOST ranges, has live fire 12hrs a day 6 days a week.  There’s been 2 or 3 accidents and one day a fellow shot another guy in argument over his wife, about 12 years ago.    No mass shootings though - they wouldn’t get off 4 rounds. Either bay accident or by rare case of homicide it will happen there as anyplace else. 

But you dodged the question: Have you ever heard of mass shootings at to a gun range.

How does your argument help elementary school children? Are you proposing we put guns in the hands of 5 to 10 year old children to protect themselves?

 

[irishpatrick]

The irony, I notice, is that some say a vote supports killing of children, in reference to abortion, and the same people making the argument argue against gun control that also contributes to the death of children. It seems real pro life people would argue against abortion, and for gun control in these type instances; life in all instances and concepts.

Where was the trade off in choosing a candidate in this past election? Why not find a candidate that is fully pro life, but will make concessions on the ‘other issues’? We have an example of the gun control issue in the center of the debate right now.

People, today, are heavily agenda driven and cannot any longer see a path to compromise. One does not have to like the other side to try to make the country better.

I have been touting the development of a true prolife party, yet even those on the right are tied to their own agendas.

We will never improve our nation if we are not willing to step out of our comfort zones.

 

[scipio337]

oh for goodness sake stop coming at me with that quote from the catechism. everytime i argue with people on here i just get a barrage of the same argument over and over. the catechism speaks about self defense. no one debating anyones right to protect themselves. the argument here is over gun control. and as i have proven earlier, the church supports gun control.

Law abiding citizens use guns for self defense, not “murder”, as you previously pointed out.

 

[irishpatrick]

and you are willing to trust our gov’t to stick to their word on such a trade??
I personally am NOT willing to make such a trade. Abortion is wrong!! we shouldn’t be bargaining anything on that point!

what next, we would bargain forks and spoons to get God back in schools? Obesity has to be blamed on the fork and spoons. Lord knows for anyone to take personal responsiblity for any of their own actions in this day and age.

explain to me how me forfieting my right to bear arms is gonna keep criminals from breakin the law???

the guy was an evil person. I’m a fairly large guy, and if someone took my gun away and I still wanted to do harm to others because of my mental disposition, Im quite sure over half america could NOT stop me!!

Abortion is wrong, and for several decades nothing has changed because the RIGHT takes an absolutist position. Let me tell you, I find abortion to be just plain evil, yet I also would love to save 300,000 babies each year. If the deal is crafted well, then babies will be saved.

I never said get rid of all guns…I am saying we should agree to additional controls in order to move the nation toward a more prolife position.

 

[ringil]

Law abiding citizens use guns for self defense, not “murder”, as you previously pointed out.

And law abiding citizens should indeed be able to obtain the guns they desire, but there is no problem with universal background checks, short waiting periods, and limits on the number of guns in a given period of time.

I collect weapons myself- though not guns- and I do see the value in those who desire to own and collect firearms. I do believe there is room for sensible regulation while maintaining an individuals right to own firearms.

 

[irishpatrick]

I went to a rural VA HS populated by Evangelicals and had to sit in on their emotionally charged drivel. I didn’t want to share in their prayer and yet I was forced as it was at all of the pep rallies, games, assemblies, and graduations.

I would be furious if I discovered that my child was being forced to sit in with Protestant’s prayers.

Keep public school secular and let folks who desire a religious education for their kids send them. . . gasp. . . to a religious school.

I agree–yet I have never been able to understand what would be so wrong about giving 2-3 minutes of quiet prayer time.

We have lost all ability to make mature compromise. Giving quiet time for prayer will be ignored by most students, yet some might actually pray using prayers within their own faith tradition. That is NOT establishing a religion, it is recognizing that religion exists.

 

[centurionguard]

150 posts in this thread (and counting) since the last post in the thread about the actual shooting (Today, 3:16 pm)

Perhaps our priorities are a little misguided?

Just sayin’

Agreed. Some of what is being said in this thread sounds like an ordinary press room. Why not just sincerely pray for the brokenhearted families of all involved. That’s where the real focus belongs. Such a terrible tragedy. I don’t watch much TV. But in seeing the top bolded paper headlines this morning it has broken my heart to pieces. How can not one feel deeply for the families. Truly this is a U.S. national tragedy…a mournful day of upset.
My deepest condolences and sincerest prayers to all involved especially the victimed families. Our Father…Hail Mary…

 

[scipio337]

oh for goodness sake stop coming at me with that quote from the catechism. everytime i argue with people on here i just get a barrage of the same argument over and over. the catechism speaks about self defense. no one debating anyones right to protect themselves. the argument here is over gun control. and as i have proven earlier, the church supports gun control.

We already have gun laws. Background checks, waiting periods in many states. In this case, this crazed individual didn’t own the guns, they were purchased by his mother, who did not have them secured.

What additional “gun control” laws would you propose. Let’s not continue to speak in generalities.

 

[BroomWagon]

Meds, all or a lot of these people are on drugs that have not been totally tested as to behavior.

ACLU sued Govt. in the 1980s to let go a lot of mental patients.

Other details to consider.

 

[ringil]

I agree–yet I have never been able to understand what would be so wrong about giving 2-3 minutes of quiet prayer time.

You know, I don’t know how I feel about this, I haven’t fleshed it out in my mind.

Maybe it is OK and maybe not.

I do believe it is OK and laudable when a student, teacher, or special remebrance occurs at a school. Not sure about a regulated occurrence though.

 

[someperson555]

Law abiding citizens use guns for self defense, not “murder”, as you previously pointed out.

more specifically i talked about self defense alone. i didnt mention anything else. please dont twist my words.
if the public would not not have access to guns, there would be less gun related crime. this isnt rocket science. however as i said before, the fiight against violence shouldnt satop at gun control. that is only the first step.

 

[JohnVictor]

How does your argument help elementary school children? Are you proposing we put guns in the hands of 5 to 10 year old children to protect themselves?

LOL… look you made a funny.

If the shooter knew there were a few teachers with state training and C/C permits he would have went elsewhere… and if not the teachers would have at least had the opportunity top stop him early.

Is that so hard to comprehend?

.

 

[Gaurdian]

this is borderline blasphemy. when will you conservatives catholics realise that Jesus wasnt a gun toting, beer drinking, red neck republican. stop trying to associate politics with religion.

When will the sick, sick leftist, command and control big government worshipers realize that the root of this problem is evil. The evil of the religion of humanist/secularism. The current US regime was elected by and reelected by those who support or are indifferent to the US Government being the largest/one of the largest exporters of:

• Abortion
• Same sex unions
• euthanasia
• contraception
• human cloning

Liberals/leftist/communist/corporatist/fascist killed more people in the 20th century than hundreds of years of others.

Let us pray for all the sick souls of liberals and leftist radicals that continue to lead people away from our Divine Creator.

 

[someperson555]

We already have gun laws. Background checks, waiting periods in many states. In this case, this crazed individual didn’t own the guns, they were purchased by his mother, who did not have them secured.

What additional “gun control” laws would you propose. Let’s not continue to speak in generalities.

congratulations, you just proved my point that as long as the public has access to guns, they will always wind up in the hands of criminals.

 

[ringil]

ACLU sued Govt. in the 1980s to let go a lot of mental patients.

.

There were positive and negative aspects to the de-institutionalization of the seriously mentally ill, which was STRONGLY supported and pressed by Ronald Reagan.

 

[irishpatrick]

You know, I don’t know how I feel about this, I haven’t fleshed it out in my mind.

Maybe it is OK and maybe not.

I do believe it is OK and laudable when a student, teacher, or special remebrance occrs at a school. Nor sure about a regulated occurrence though.

Well, so long as it is not forced verbal prayer, and so long as the student can choose to pray, or not pray…I just cannot see a problem.

The nation is so divided that we cannot even find mature compromise with throwing hissy fits.

 

[austenbosten]

congratulations, you just proved my point that as long as the public has access to guns, they will always wind up in the hands of criminals.

Yeah because the criminals are barred from getting guns when illegal?

Do you know how easy it is to get your hand on a gun in a “gun-free” zone?

 

[scipio337]

And law abiding citizens should indeed be able to obtain the guns they desire, but there is no problem with universal background checks, short waiting periods, and limits on the number of guns in a given period of time.

I collect weapons myself- though not guns- and I do see the value in those who desire to own and collect firearms. I do believe there is room for sensible regulation while maintaining an individuals right to own firearms.

The NICS system is pretty universal, and many states have waiting periods for handguns (I think it was 7 days when I purchsed mine in IL).

 

[Prodigal_Son1]

The Great Biblical Commentary of Cornelius Lapide

Ver. 36.—But now he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip. A purse filled with money, a scrip with food, that they might have support in the impending persecution; for they will never find either, “because men will fly from Me, who am bound and accused, and consequently from My disciples as men wicked and condemned.”
And he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one. Christ, in these words, did not command them to take a purse and a scrip, and to sell their garment and buy a sword, for He soon after forbade Peter to draw his sword; but they were a warning of the fierce persecution which was about to fall upon Himself and the apostles, and which was so heavy to those that regarded the difficulty of the case with the eyes of mere human wisdom, that food and weapons would appear things absolutely necessary for the preservation of life. The meaning therefore is this, “Everything, so far, has happened to you, 0 my Apostles, well and prosperously; for when I sent you to preach the Gospel without purse, or scrip, or sword, you were kindly received by most, fed, and sheltered, and had no need of these things. But now so grievous a persecution is impending over you, and so great is the danger to your lives, that in human prudence it may seem necessary to each to think of the preservation of his life, and therefore to take a scrip and purse for provision, and a weapon for defence, and to sell his cloak, and buy a sword. But to Me, who weigh circumstances by the design and decree of God the Father, there is no need of such things; for I go voluntarily to the cross, and to death, and I offer Myself of My own free will, to those who will persecute Me and crucify Me, so that I may conform Myself to the will of My Father.” So S. Chrysostom (Hom. 85 on S. Matt.), and from him Theophylact on this passage, Jansen, Maldonatus, and others. S. Ambrose says well, “0 Lord, why commandest Thou me to buy a sword, and forbiddest me to strike, unless that I may be prepared for my defence, and that Thou mayest appear able to avenge though Thou wouldst not?”

CHRYS. What is this? He who said, If any one strike you on the right cheek, turn to him the other also, now arms His disciples, and with a sword only. For if it were fitting to be completely armed, not only must a man possess a sword, but shield and helmet. But even though a thousand had arms of this kind, how could the eleven be prepared for all the attacks and lying in wait of people, tyrants, allies, and nations, and how should they not quake at the mere sight of armed men, who had been brought up near lakes and rivers? We must not then suppose that He ordered them to possess swords, but by the swords He points at the secret attack of the Jews. And hence it follows, For I say to you, that this that is written must, be accomplished in me: And he was numbered with the transgressors.

CYRIL; Or else; When our Lord says, He who has a purse, let him take it, likewise a scrip, His discourse He addressed to His disciples, but in reality He regards every individual Jew; as if He says, If any Jew is rich in resources, let him collect them together and fly. But if any one oppressed with extreme poverty applies himself to religion, let him also sell his cloak and buy a sword. For the terrible attack of battle shall overtake them, so that nothing shall suffice to resist it. He next lays open the cause of these evils, namely, that He suffered the penalty due to the wicked, being crucified with thieves. And when it shall have come at last to this, the word of dispensation will receive its end. But to the persecutors shall happen all that has been foretold by the Prophets. These things then God prophesied concerning what should befall the country of the Jews, but the disciples understood not the depth of His words, thinking they had need of swords against the coming attack of the traitor. Whence it follows; But they said, Lord, behold, here are two swords.

A Catholic Commentary on Holy Scripture

35-38. Proper to Lk. The apparent contradiction of our Lord’s former and later teaching (10:4 ff.; 22:49-51, cf. Mat_26:52) must be explained in this way: he now wishes to impress upon them that although the principles of his teaching have not altered, nevertheless the times have changed. They are about to enter on a situation of the utmost gravity and danger. Compare the advice concerning the way they are to act in 17:22 ff.; 21:8 ff. When he first sent them out it was with the counsel to depend on the goodwill of their hearers for their needs; now there will be no longer goodwill but hatred for his sake. In fact they will be Ishmaels, like men who have no friends and can obtain even the bare necessities of life only by violence; that is the meaning of’ he that hath not (a sword) let him sell his coat and buy one’, a proverbial expression, not that he recommends such a measure to his disciples (cf. 12:22). This furnishes the meaning of his answer to their simplicity in 38: ‘It is enough’. He does not mean that two swords are enough for their protection, but, seeing that they have not understood him, he says with a smile, ‘That would be enough for what I meant’. Some think, less probably, that he answers abruptly to change the subject which they have misunderstood: ‘Enough of that’. 37. In confirmation of the advice in 36; the quotation is from Is 53 which deals with the Sufffering Servant of Yahweh. Jesus envisages his speedy death: ‘the things that have to do with me are coming to their completion’. He has frequently warned his disciples that the servant must not expect to fare better than the master.