Did Jesus of Bible claim he is God?

[mgrfin]

The book of Genesis says that God mad man “in His own image”. That means that God is in the “image” of man; and therefore He is a perfect, glorified Man. He is not a man like us—mortal, weak, imperfect, and sinful. Nevertheless He is Man; otherwise He could not create us “in His own image” as men. If we are made in “His image,” that means that His “image” is that of a Man. Hence His Son is also the “Son of Man”.

zerinus

Faulty reasoning, faulty conclusion. Man was made in the image of God, not the other way around.

peace

 

[zerinus]

Faulty reasoning, faulty conclusion. Man was made in the image of God, not the other way around.

peace

If man is made in the image of God, that means that means that God has an image, and that image looks like an man. That is good logic. If I sculpted a statute in your image, that means that you have an image that looks like that statute. So if God made man in His own image, that means that God’s image is that of man.

zerinus

 

[Keikiolu]

Thanks for making me laugh that is very nice of you, but to be a good muslim, I have to treat you with fairness, justice and respect and that goes for whatever you believe, religion or faith is not for me or any person but for God and the individual.

Now, why did not our lord Jesus say “Son of God” instead of “Son of man” he or god must have known that today someone like me who loves him so much would want know and understand him very clear terms.

Son of Man (www.newadvent.org)

Son of God

What honestly want understand is the significance of the terms “Son of God” and “Son of Man” as used by Jesus? Did He use the former to stress His deity and the latter to stress His humanity, or is there something more to this?

Also, “Son of man” appears some 109 times in the King James Version of the Old Testament. but How many times “Son of God” appears?

Furthermore, “Son of man” appears some 109 times in the King James Version of the Old Testament.

I tried to understand this **Luke 5:16 “And he (Jesus) withdrew himself into the wilderness and prayed to his God.” **

And you can see clearly that Jesus had a God, a supreme God, who is higher than him and stronger than him.

As a mohamedan you may believe as you like.

God the Father is God the Son’s God in that the Son could pray to His Father, and His Father was/is God.

If that makes no sense to you it proves nothing more than you’re not a Christian.

Jesus was God’s servant and he prayed to God so God would strengthen him more and reinforce him with patience and desire to continue his mission in spreading the word of God Almighty.

Also, in **Matthew 26:39 "And going a little way forward, he (Jesus) fell upon his face, praying and saying ‘My Father, if it is possible, let this cup pass away from me. Yet, not as I will, but as you will.’ " **

Here in this verse you can see two things:
(1) Jesus bowed down on his face and prayed in submission to his GOD in obedience.

Jesus, as fully man, was suffering and knew He would suffer most extremely. As one of us, being fully man, He prayed to His Father for strength. As God, He prayed to His Father in thanks for His being one with the Father.

(2) Jesus was begging his GOD to let the cup pass away from him. Jesus did not have the power to will it for himself and make the cup pass away from Jesus.

Jesus was NOT begging God to let the “cup pass” from Him. As a man He had the human thought that only if this were the only way should this torture be inflicted on ANY man.

But, as it WAS the only way, it WAS the will of God that it happen this way, then Jesus as man was accepting of His lot.

Jesus, as fully God, COULD have averted any harm to His person, His fully man-ness, but freely chose to not overide the necessity of His fate as a fully human man.

GOD had to do it for Jesus !. How can Jesus be the Creator of this Universe, the all knowing, most powerful??!!

God didn’t let the “cup pass” from Jesus…!

Could the creator of the universe not allow His Son to incarnate as a true fully human person, who is still fully God, and freely submit HImself to a torturous death?

I’d say that could be accomplished under the capability called “omnipotence”.

…continued below →

 

[Keikiolu]

continued from above:

…{snip}…

Now, what I want understand is, our lord Jesus never said clearly that I’m god and worship me, he never said clearly that I’m Son of God the almighty and I don’t mean in the biological sense of the word and we all know that God did not fathered Jesus biologically so as Millions and millions of Muslim now too. So how made him to be god almighty, the creator of this universe, of me and all of us on this forum.

No one MADE Jesus, as the second person of the Holy Trinity, God. He simply has been God the Son for eternity.

Jesus did say He was God the Son. You can find many reasons that is believed by Christians elsewhere. If you don’t find the “experts” believable, then you’re not going to find me believable, so I shan’t bother to try.

My Priest friend tells me that Lord Jesus is both man and God, i.e. while he was on earth eating honey comb and broiled, but up in heaven he is GOD. Is that the case?

 

[Keikiolu]

If man is made in the image of God, that means that means that God has an image, and that image looks like an man. That is good logic. If I sculpted a statute in your image, that means that you have an image that looks like that statute. So if God made man in His own image, that means that God’s image is that of man.

zerinus

If I make an image of a jpeg on my flash card, it bears no “pictorial” resemblance to the “assembled” image of the jpeg on my monitor.

We don’t know what the word “image” means as God means it, but it is not necessary that that “image” which we are of God is a “pictorial” or “sculptural” one.

You are being “literalistic” (“raining cats and dogs” means raining felines and canines), where we (more wise) Catholics are being “literal” (“raining cats and dogs” means raining a whole lot!).

But,… no one will begrudge you your “curious” interpretations, as they’re no surprise and of no persuasive value whatsoever.

They ARE amusing though.

 

[zerinus]

We don’t know what the word “image” means as God means it, . . .

I think that we do:

forums.catholic-questions.org/showpost.php?p=2878995&postcount=43

Try reading the posts before responding, and save yourself and us the trouble.

zerinus

 

[zerinus]

If that makes no sense to you it proves nothing more than you’re not a Christian.

A lot of Christians can’t make sense of that either. The earliest Christians would certainly not have done.

zerinus

 

[AbeOman]

Son of Man (www.newadvent.org)

Son of God

As a mohamedan you may believe as you like.

What is Mohamedan?

Snipped.

 

[MattG]

Did Jesus of Bible claimed he is God in any book of Bibles?

Mattg:

Yes,In Luke 6:5 [NAB]

Beginning with verse 1-4 and 5, we read,
6:1 * While he was going through a field of grain on a sabbath, his disciples were picking the heads of grain, rubbing them in their hands, and eating them.
6:2 Some Pharisees said, “Why are you doing what is unlawful on the sabbath?”
6:3 Jesus said to them in reply, “Have you not read what David did when he and those (who were) with him were hungry?
6:4 (How) he went into the house of God, took the bread of offering, * which only the priests could lawfully eat, ate of it, and shared it with his companions.”
6:5 Then he said to them, “The Son of Man is lord of the sabbath.”

 

[Mr.Ex_Nihilo]

yes, in all of them.

I will make things easier for you. Suppose that a Muslim man came, gathered hundreds of Muslims and said : i am the rahman, the raheem, maliki yawmiddin.

What will you understand? that this Muslim man is claiming to be Allah.

What determined this conclusion?

1- the words uttered
2- the audiance.

A Muslim man KNOWS how Muslims will interpret his words and when he utters them, it means he is claiming to be God, or he is intentionally blaspheming.

So did Jesus say I AM GOD? no, not using these same words. But He said : I am the Alpha and Omega ( God said this in the OT). He said " i give peace the world cannot give" ( Only God gives peace the world cannot give). He said " i give you wisdom" ( only God gives wisdom" ecc.

=Jesus is God.

What determined this conclusion?

1- The words He uttered
2- The audiance to whom He was speaking.

This is a simple explanation .

If we want to stay on the surface and say that Jesus is not God because He did not say " i am God", then we can as well say that Muhammad is not a prophet because nowhere in the Quran does He say " i am a prophet". This would render any theological discussion as shallow and meaningless.

Very good post.

 

[MH84]

Now, if Jesus said i am God, this does not fall well :

1- Jesus is not the Father.He made this clear because to a Jew, God is the Father. For Jesus to say I AM God, it means to a Jew that He is the Father so Jesus made it clear that He is the Divine Son, not the Father. So He was more than clear that He is not the Father but the Son. He said He is the divine Son. Jews understood correctly that He is equalling Himself to God but He made it clear He is the Divine Son, not the Father.

InJesus, I like this explanation because for me it is what the Scripture says. However, the individual will still need to discern what Jesus meant when he (and the apostles) called Himself the “Son”. This is where the Church comes in, guided by the Holy Spirit.

Keikiolou,

No one MADE Jesus, as the second person of the Holy Trinity, God. He simply has been God the Son for eternity.

Yes, exactly. This is what we believe.

Jesus did say He was God the Son. You can find many reasons that is believed by Christians elsewhere. If you don’t find the “experts” believable, then you’re not going to find me believable, so I shan’t bother to try.

I don’t know if you meant that phrase literally, but if you did that is simply not true. If it is please quote the scripture because I would like to see it. We believe Jesus to be God the Son because we believe God guided the Church to believe this. I get annoyed when people tell me or others that “Son of God” must mean “God the Son”, because it is not true IMO.

 

[po18guy]

When I was first trying to understand the Trinity, and had this mormon idea of God stuck inside my brain, there was a Catholic who was very, very patiently trying to get me to understand. Once when I was getting it all backwards, he told me that I was looking through the wrong end of the telescope.

It is a mormon problem in general. What they have been taught God Is, is assbackwards in a lot of ways. It is hard to get the telescope turned around so that you are looking through the right end. Especially when the desire is to keep on looking through the wrong end.

And, what an incredibly strong desire it is! I think it’s glued to someone’s eyeball. But, if that strong desire can only be turned in the right direction, amazing things will happen, right, RebeccaJ?

Christ’s peace.

 

[Keikiolu]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Keikiolu forums.catholic-questions.org/images/buttons_cad/viewpost.gif
We don’t know what the word “image” means as God means it, . . .

I think that we do:

forums.catholic-questions.org/showpost…5&postcount=43

Try reading the posts before responding, and save yourself and us the trouble.

zerinus

I could only get the one posting from that link, and it read:

ShortyLaRock_82
Junior Member Join Date: September 19, 2007
Posts: 20

Re: Did Jesus of Bible claim he is God?​

That is not what the Bible says. The Bible defines precisely what is meant by image: “And Adam lived an hundred and thirty years, and begat a son in his own likeness, after his image; and called his name Seth” (Genesis 5:3). Image means image; it is what everybody else understand by it.

I suppose we’ll have to agree to disagree on this issue. One of many I would think.

My opinion is at least as valid as yours, and more so siply because you LIMIT God and I don’t.

Best to you, Z.

 

[zerinus]

My opinion is at least as valid as yours,

I don’t think so. The meaning of the Bible is clear.

and more so siply because you LIMIT God and I don’t.

We don’t.

zerinus

 

[Keikiolu]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Keikiolu forums.catholic-questions.org/images/buttons_cad/viewpost.gif
If that makes no sense to you it proves nothing more than you’re not a Christian.

A lot of Christians can’t make sense of that either. The earliest Christians would certainly not have done.

zerinus

A lot of Christians aren’t Catholic, so it makes sense that “a lot of Christians” wouldn’t accept revealed truth.

That you’re one of that population tells me precisely why you think as you do.

You have no idea what the “earliest Christians” would think.

That you aren’t Catholic tells me that you have no concept of what the early Church was, much less how the individuals or groups of individuals of the early Church would think.

You’re welcome to you unfounded suppositions. Play with them and see where they take you…!

Best to you in your floundering around with false doctrine. May you learn as best you can.

Mahalo ke Akua…!
E pili mau na pomaikai ia oe. Aloha nui.

 

[Keikiolu]

Son of Man

(www.newadvent.org)

Son of God

As a mohamedan you may believe as you like.

What is Mohamedan?

Snipped.

I left out an “M”, apparently…

Try this: Mohammedans

Basically,… a follower of Big Mo in one way or another.

Mahalo ke Akua…!
E pili mau na pomaikai ia oe. Aloha nui.

 

[Keikiolu]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Keikiolu forums.catholic-questions.org/images/buttons_cad/viewpost.gif
My opinion is at least as valid as yours,

I don’t think so. The meaning of the Bible is clear.

Quote:
and more so siply because you LIMIT God and I don’t.

We don’t.

Yes, the bible is clear, as interpreted by the appropriate authority of the Magisterium.

Yet another thing we can agree to disagree on…!

What we should be talking about is the CONSEQUENCES of our differing opinions, instead of trying to convince each other that our axiomatically held (dogmatic) premises are “invalid”.

I’m not interested in getting into a juvenile “adversarial contradiction fest” with anyone,… most definately not the fabulous Mr Z.

See’ya around, Z’ster…!

 

[inJESUS]

InJesus, I like this explanation because for me it is what the Scripture says. However, the individual will still need to discern what Jesus meant when he (and the apostles) called Himself the “Son”. This is where the Church comes in, guided by the Holy Spirit.

correct even though i believe that what Jesus meant about the title is clear enough example, parable of the wicked tenant, and “no one knows the Father except The Son” ecc…

 

[RebeccaJ]

And, what an incredibly strong desire it is! I think it’s glued to someone’s eyeball. But, if that strong desire can only be turned in the right direction, amazing things will happen, right, RebeccaJ?

Christ’s peace.

Yes, very amazing and beautiful things.

Peace to you as well.

Rebecca

 

[AbeOman]

I left out an “M”, apparently…

Try this: Mohammedans

Basically,… a follower of Big Mo in one way or another.

Mahalo ke Akua…!
E pili mau na pomaikai ia oe. Aloha nui.

**That I consider an insult intentionally or due to lack of knowledge, but I will refrain from returning it in kindness as the bible says… turn the other cheek…

Sadly, you are the first Catholic who insulted me on this forum and for what I don’t know and only hope some one does not do the same thing.

Thank you.**