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Yerusalyim
Guest
Hamaba, mind showing me Jesus with his face on the ground in the Greek scriptures?
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hamba2han
Guest
Not sure about Greek scripture but here is what Matthew 26:36-39 says:
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36 Then Jesus came with them into a country place which is called Gethsemani; and he said to his disciples: Sit you here, till I go yonder and pray. 37 And taking with him Peter and the two sons of Zebedee, he began to grow sorrowful and to be sad. 38 Then he saith to them: My soul is sorrowful even unto death: stay you here, and watch with me. 39 And going a little further, he fell upon his face, praying, and saying: My Father, if it be possible, let this chalice pass from me. Nevertheless not as I will, but as thou wilt.**
And for those here who seemingly are content to see other Christians prostrating to their Lord, I wish to ask them this:
Why aren’t you yourselves regularly prostrating to the Lord during your own prayers?
I will reiterate my initial point i.e. those Christians who are reluctant to prostrate to their Lord in public prayer… (and indeed during private prayer as well)… have simply allowed their distorted sense of pride to come between them and this most noble and profound way to pray to the Lord as practiced by Jesus (pbuh) himself according to the Bible.
If it was a good enough way for Jesus to pray, then why is prostration to the Lord not a good enough way for you to pray as well?
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LilyM
Guest
Jesus didn’t fall on his face when he prayed at the tomb of Lazarus just before raising him from the dead - he stood and raised his eyes to heaven. Which he did numerous other times when praying too. If you truly revere him as a prophet you would do the same much more often than you prostrate yourself.
Neither did most of the Jews - read the story of the repentant tax collector in Luke 18 - he STOOD and prayed for mercy! And God willingly heard his prayers and saw his repentant heart.
So not physically falling on our faces has nothing to do with pride - there is not a proud bone in my body. It’s a realisation that God hears our prayers regardless of our posture.
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water
Guest
Thank you, LilyM.
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hamba2han
Guest
Apart from prostration, Muslims would also stand, bow and sit during our daily prayers.
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LilyM
Guest
Do you really think God doesn’t hear our prayers regardless of our posture? Have you never prayed while walking out on the street? while sitting in a car or a bus? While playing with a child? Don’t you think those prayers are heard just as much as the ones you say while prostrated? God doesn’t care what posture we have while praying, he cares that our hearts are sincere.
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water
Guest
Thanks LilyM.hamba2han, we also stand, bow, knee and sit during praying and holy mass celebration.
I forgot to mention some are lying on their dead bed praying too. Surely, God hears them well.
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hamba2han
Guest
There are two types of prayer in Islam, the first like I have mentioned involving prostration, standing, bowing and sitting is known as the daily salat.
The second type of prayer is known as the doa or supplication and it is this type of prayer which Muslims would very often say when doing things like walking, driving, working, playing and in virtually every other aspect of daily life.
And if as you say, God does not care about what posture we have while praying, then why did Jesus, Abraham and Moses (pbut), just to name a few, fall on their faces when they were praying as written in the Bible?
Don’t you want to pray like the Prophets (pbut) themselves prayed?
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water
Guest
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LilyM
Guest
To be sure they did sometimes, not all of them did, not half of them are recorded as having done so. Nor did they do it as a matter of routine every day, week, month or year. If I took your logic(?) to its conclusion I’d have to make sure to pray in Hebrew or Aramaic or whatever languages they prayed in too. Which you don’t for starters. And in the same exact places they prayed as well. Which is impossible. And turn myself into a man for that matter.
How much slavish mindless imitation is too much? Enough! If I pray with the same heart and thoughts that they prayed with, the position of my body doesn’t matter. Nor does the language I pray in nor any other detail.
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Eireann
Guest
Didn’t you read the part where I said we aren’t Muslims ? when in Rome, do as the Romans do.
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PaulDupre
Guest
Only in the Americas is the word “corn” used exclusively to describe maize, the corn native to the Americas. In other countries and in ancient times, “corn” means any edible grain. Do a search for “corn” in an online King James bible and you’ll see that it used to refer to any edible grain including wheat, millet and barley.
Come to think of it, in the early U.S., barley was often called “barley-corn” as in “Old John Barley-Corn”, an affectionate name for hard liquor.
Paul
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cheeto1
Guest
If your only point is “why not try this position sometime? It’s holy”
then it really does sound worthy of trying for the sake of holiness.
But if your point is that Islam is holier than Christianity, then, well, I have to respectfully disagree. That killing infedels part just
can’t be reconciled with holiness, no matter how low you bow.
then it really does sound worthy of trying for the sake of holiness.
But if your point is that Islam is holier than Christianity, then, well, I have to respectfully disagree. That killing infedels part just
can’t be reconciled with holiness, no matter how low you bow.
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hamba2han
Guest
No, I did not because when Jesus (pbuh) stood to make the prayer, it was as a doa or supplication but when he fell on his face to pray, it was in the form of the salat.
Like I mentioned, there are two different types of prayer that the Prophets (pbut) made and which are acceptable to their Creator.
By choosing not to prostrate themselves to their Creator, Christians are performing only one type of prayer i.e. the supplication prayer.
The question Christians need to honestly ask themselves is:
Why do you choose not to prostrate to the Lord?
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water
Guest
Do you, as a Muslim, lay down on the street to pray?
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Eireann
Guest
I think you need to stop ignoring other posters including myself, or why then do you think you deserve an answer ?
Some- time this week please.
Anyone ever heard of an ear of wheat ?
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water
Guest
To be fair, for benefit of the doubt, one can not answer everything to many other posters.
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LilyM
Guest
We don’t define a type of prayer by the posture one adopts when praying it. When Jesus fell on his face he said ‘Father, if possible take this cup of suffering away from me’ - that was supplication prayer, as well as salat!
When David danced in front of the Ark of the Covenant, or sang the Psalms, or the Israelites danced and sang after they crossed the Red Sea, that was thanksgiving, adoration, worship, and submission as well - the same spirit as what you call salat prayer. But they didn’t prostrate themselves to do it!
The truth is ALL prayer is, or should be, a mix of different types - supplication, worship, thanksgiving, submission to God - all mixed into one. We don’t, and can’t, make false distinctions between these different types of prayers.
And we certainly don’t class them based on whether or not you are on your face while praying! For us kneeling, which we all do at various times in prayer, is a gesture of profound submission. Going on your face isn’t better or more submissive. It’s not our usual custom to go flat on our face for anybody, nor was it usual for Jews, to go flat on their faces either.
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hamba2han
Guest
The whole planet is God’s domain and Islam is for all of humanity and so, it does not matter where the creations are located because they need to worship their Creator according to how He Himself wants them to worship Him.
What this means is that no man-made religions or rituals of worship are acceptable to Him except that which He has commanded.
If you created something, would you have it any other way?
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hamba2han
Guest
Muslims certainly fall on our faces when performing the salat and sometimes when the mosques are overflowing with worshipers, we do indeed pray on the streets.
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