Divorcing

[kellygirl]

Robaynne…your words were exactly what I needed at this moment! I was praying to God on my way to work today asking him to give me hope and to remove the anxiety that I have in my heart today and he led me to your post I have even printed them for inspiration

It is so true that we worry about tomorrow when today has such wonderful gifts that are overlooked and taken for granted. I have been wallowing in self pity the last couple of days and your words helped me see that, so I thank you Dear Soul…many blessings to you and yours…Kelly

 

[Liberanosamalo]

This thread was at the bottom of another thread, and I’ve read it through and think we were all married to the same person. I wonder how you all are doing half a year later.

I was married to a narcissist. Who dragged me to one psychiatrist after another. That’s a big tip-off. Most men would rather have root canal surgery than sit and discuss feelings. But the ex was very happy to try to find someone to agree with him I was crazy. So a typical session would be me starting to answer a question and ex interrupting and telling them that wasn’t what I was thinking/feeling/saying. I would get up and leave and tell them that apparently he can speak for me. I apparently didn’t need to be there. When shrink would realize he was the problem, then he would change shrinks.

I pray for him. Not because I think he deserves salvation, but as my confessor said, his conversion would be beneficial to my children’s lives. And that I should ask God to remove his ability to harm me and the children in whatever way He felt best for the good of everyone’s souls involved.

I don’t want him to go to hell because I don’t want him to pull my children down with him. And Christ did not deserve to suffer in vain for my ex.

Narcissists are terrified of being alone. Mine has had a fiancee for several years that he wouldn’t marry. She finally left. He has a new girlfriend who has no clue what is beyond the facade.

The key to marrying someone like that is you have one thing in common. You are both head over heels in love with him.

And mine lacked empathy to the extent that when I thought I was miscarrying our third child at a Famous Amusement Park, he told me to lie on the grass and take a nap. I insisted we go back to the hotel room. He was angry and got his hand stamped so he could return to the park later. He griped about spending his vacation sitting in a hotel room (while I prayed the bleeding would stop.)

I was lonelier with him than without him. And I learned who my true friends are.

Nine years later he still can’t have a real relationship with anyone, and now his daughters are old enough to see more clearly. And he is starting to show his abusiveness to them too.

The best thing for the replaying of the stories over and over in my head was the filing of the annulment petition. Finally, I was able to put all that poison on a paper and turn it over to God. And I received my annulment. God heard me. The ex will never apologize. And some things still hurt over a decade later. But I have God and he doesn’t.

Even if you can’t pray, the Holy Spirit prays for you in your groanings. I have made it this far through the prayers of better people than myself. Divorce is worse than death. No one makes you a casserole. You don’t get an insurance payout to help start your life again. People you thought were friends shun you so they don’t “catch divorce” either. Or they think you want their husband now. (No, if he’s a cheat and would run off with me, I don’t want him. Been with a cheater. Never again.) You have all the pain of a dead husband and you have also lost all your memories. He dies twice. Because you can’t keep his photo out and remember the good times, because now all those are in question. (What was really going on with him and her when we were in this photo?)
Even your past has to be put in a drawer and lost for good. Which is something widows don’t have to do.

I tell people “God will help you through this.” It isn’t God’s will. Sin never is.

The phrase I hate is “Do what you have to do” because that’s what people told him to do. But now I’m grateful. In the end he did me a big favor. Another thing I did was have my engagement diamond reset in a mother’s ring with my children’s birthstones and mine. I earned that diamond! He may not be forever, but the rock remains.

 

[chandler550369]

I enjoyed reading your insight on your terrible situation. My husband who is divorcing me told my father that I was a narcisist
and maybe he is right. I did not deal with his depression really well and have horrible thoughts that I was not dealing with him kindly and in true charity. I was very lonely married but I am very lonely now–not sad just lonely.

 

[kellygirl]

Liberanosamalo…God works in such glorious ways! In my purse at this very moment is my engagement ring…I am taking it to a jeweler to have the center stone made into a neckelace! What a sign…man oh man. And what you said about your x being a Narcisisist…BINGO. I remember when I was in labor with our first child and on the way to the hospital he got so angry because I told him we needed to stop and get gas…he slammed the door and didn’t speak to me for an hour. I was like, “what the heck did I do?”

Also, about a year ago I was hanging a picture on the wall and the step ladder collapsed and I fell right onto the coffee table with a loud BANG…my H was in the next room and I know he heard me scream and the bang, but he didn’t even flintch. I hobbled into his tv room and asked him why he didn’t even come and see if I was ok…his reponse “If you were hurt, you’d come and tell me.”

There were so many of these little things that now when I add them up, I see just how poorly I was treated. Don’t get me wrong, I am no saint and I have done my share of improper stuff, but I put up with it for soooo long.

This was actually the best thing that could have happened to me…my H leaving the kids and I. I have gone back to church, I am so much closer to God, I have even become a Euchristic Minister within my parish. I believe God got fed up with the life I was living and has lovingly redirected my path. I was living for my H and NOT for God. Life is really so much better now that I am following our Dear Lord’s path and not my husbands dysfunctional rocky road

 

[Liberanosamalo]

Well, once I broke the code with my ex, now it’s so much easier to deal with him!

When he told me I was tied to my mother’s apron strings, it was because his mother was moving down to take care of him after the divorce. (He’s lived with her now for nine years and she’s leaving because she’s sick of his abuse. NOW she believes me! He made his 72-year-old mother sleep on the floor or the couch for nine years even though she has a heart problem. And she cleans his house and he yells at her if she doesn’t do it right. Yes, she’s part of the annulment papers…)

When he told me I was sick and needed to be on meds, he was getting lots of heavy meds. Still is.

When he told me I was lying, it was because he just told a whopper.

When he told me I was unfaithful and having an affair with my mother, it was because… well… you get the picture.

A narcissist’s accusations have nothing to do with you! It’s ALWAYS ALL ABOUT THEM! Everything is all about them. Really.

And yes, they go around town telling everyone you are sick and crazy. Eventually when you aren’t standing on the lawn screaming at people and you go about your daily life quietly and sanely, people figure it out.

Someday he’ll pick a fight with the wrong person. But it probably won’t be a man.

If you deal with a normal person in true charity, it brings forth grace and abundance. Mother Teresa couldn’t make a narcissist react nicely. No matter what she did it wouldn’t be enough.

Your goal is to stop measuring yourself by his faulty yardstick and measure yourself by Christ’s Commandments. Satan is known as the Accuser. He tries to break down your faith by making you doubt the good that you do. The ex tried to make me think I shouldn’t go to church anymore. Because he wasn’t going.

My ex went to every family member while I was married and would say things and get a reaction from them and quotes that he used out of context to persuade me that my family hated me too. He’d repeat them at me for hours over and over in his harangues that I couldn’t get away from. They had no idea what he was up to until I later told them the things he quoted. They were appalled that he had so systematically done that. Abusers do that to alienate you from everyone who gives you strength and support. Hopefully your father didn’t take his side when your ex did that. I almost laugh now at some of the stuff he pulled. And yet if I told anyone what he did to me, I was “badmouthing him.”

Just keep your side of the street clean and stay close to God. There is your help and protection.

For the loneliness, I realized early on that I was never alone. I have my guardian angel with me. I named her. I pray to her. I pray to my children’s guardian angels when they are over there. I think my guardian angel has given me physical strength and endurance to do things that I never thought I could. And has alerted me to things and helped keep me and the girls safe. People have asked me how I accomplish what I do. I just smile and say “I have help.”


And for anyone who is going through this, it is NOT your imagination. You are NOT crazy! But you almost have to become crazy to adjust your life to this insanity too. When you get away from it and step back, you realize you finally don’t have to adjust your moods to the other person and tiptoe around in your own soul. The first step is to admit to a priest in the confidence of the confessional what you are going through. Once you have publicly said it, it breaks a chain and begins to set you free. The hardest step is saying the words out loud though.

 

[Liberanosamalo]

Kelly! Good luck with that necklace! Wear it proudly! You earned it!

Mine gave me the silent treatment during my last L&D. For four hours of induced labor. Finally I cried and begged for an epidural because I couldn’t take the pain anymore both physical and psychological. See, he was mad that I had arranged for my mother to babysit our five year old and three year old. She lived four miles from the hospital. I don’t know what he thought we’d do with the kids. But he had to punish me. So all the way to the hospital he told me he was taking me off the joint bank accounts.

After the baby was born she was sick and had to be readmitted. On the way he told me he was going to kick us out on the street and sell the house.

Now I laugh at that. What a prince.

Sometimes God allows divorce to free innocent people from bondage. It was my flight out of Egypt. They are rather alike, aren’t they? Must have read from the Abusive Husband’s Handbook: Chapter Five L&D.

Oh, mine blamed me that we only had girls. I won’t tell you his sick reasoning, though. But it was gross.

 

[kellygirl]

Liberanosamalo, The problem I had for many years with my H, is that he wasn’t as blantanly abusive as your H seems to have been. He is actually a very quiet man, and didn’t speak to many people. He is an alchoholic (I can admidt that now) and left the kids and I for a chubby, alcoholic, chain-smoking inhaler dependant-asthmatic who lives in a trailor. She is the same age as him also, so he wasn’t looking for some hot young chick. Anyway, He just won’t file for a divorce and he has been gone for over a year. I had several sessions with our parish priest, and he informed me that because my H an I weren’t married within the church, we weren’t really married in the eyes of the church so I am free to divorce him and I can be married within the church in the future. I just haven’t filed yet either…I guess I will know exactly when it is time to file…but why doesn’t he? It really perplexes me.

 

[kellygirl]

Hindsight really is 20/20…during our marriage we had a ****** car and it broke down on me on the way home from work (around 30 miles from our home) right in the middle of an intersection…a good person took pity on me and helped me push the car to the side of the road. I called my H to tell him about my ordeal and to please pick me up and he was FURIOUS!!! When he found me he again began slamming the doors and throwing things. He didn’t even ask me if I was ok…gosh, I have let these incidents slip by the wayside for so long. It is not normal to treat someone like this…especially your spouse! So many things were wrong, and I deserve so much more and with God’s guidiance I will someday find the kind soul that was meant for me. Do I wish my H would see the error of his ways and realize all that he has lost, stop drinking, leave his mistress…yea, sure I do…are the odds of this happining pretty bleak…yes, they are, but Our Dear Father is preparing me for a brilliant life ahead and for my kids as well and if my H rejects the love, grace, courage and strength that the Lord freely offers him to come back to his family, that will be my H choice…but as for the kids and I, we will not be taken down into his dismal existance. I pity him, but I won’t let his life affect me or the kids anymore…

 

[Eliza10]

…the ex was very happy to try to find someone to agree with him I was crazy. So a typical session would be me starting to answer a question and ex interrupting and telling them that wasn’t what I was thinking/feeling/saying.

Yes this happened to me and and to make it worse, sometimes the counselor would take his word about what I was thinking and why I did things as fact. Then they’d both be turning on me. Firing squad.

…I pray for him. Not because I think he deserves salvation…

None of us deserve salvation. Contrary to their blustering, a Narcissist is the most unhappy person in the world, and truly trapped. They are terrified of looking within, and they are talented at recreating new personas and even kidding themselves that thats who they are. Narcisissts are truly those whom we tell the Lord are “in most need of Thy mercy”. I feel it is my personal mission to pray and offer sacrifices the rest of my life that he gets into heaven. And I don’t expect to see the fruits of my efforts till after death. I can’t think of anyone else who would pray for him thus, and such prayer is needed for one so lost, so I feel God gave it to me to do. After all, He fortified me by leading me to the Catholic Chruch. He has made me spiritually rich. I only have to draw on it.

…Narcissists are terrified of being alone. Mine has had a fiancee for several years that he wouldn’t marry. She finally left. He has a new girlfriend who has no clue what is beyond the facade…

I believe it. Its such a wonderful facade. They learn what “ideal” looks like and create that persona for themselves, to show the world. What you say here is exactly it:

…The key to marrying someone like that is you have one thing in common. You are both head over heels in love with him.

LOL. Its the truth.

…And mine lacked empathy to the extent that when I thought I was miscarrying our third child at a Famous Amusement Park, he told me to lie on the grass and take a nap. I insisted we go back to the hotel room. He was angry and got his hand stamped so he could return to the park later. He griped about spending his vacation sitting in a hotel room (while I prayed the bleeding would stop.)

A true and everyday-typical Narcissist reaction. Such things I also lived with. I think I kept blocking them out. I was shocked, and thought it better not to keep a record of wrongs, and purposefully blocked them out. Then when I understood narcissism, I understood all those strange happenings.

…I was lonelier with him than without him. And I learned who my true friends are.

Sad that is. But better a very few real ones, than several ones you only think are true.

…Nine years later he still can’t have a real relationship with anyone, and now his daughters are old enough to see more clearly. And he is starting to show his abusiveness to them too.

In time. But the children can be fooled a long time. Long distance relationships enhances the fantasy of who they are.

…The best thing for the replaying of the stories over and over in my head was the filing of the annulment petition.

I need to start mine.

…Even if you can’t pray, the Holy Spirit prays for you in your groanings.

True!

 

[Eliza10]

[continued from previous post]

… Divorce is worse than death. No one makes you a casserole. You don’t get an insurance payout to help start your life again. People you thought were friends shun you so they don’t “catch divorce” either. Or they think you want their husband now. (No, if he’s a cheat and would run off with me, I don’t want him. Been with a cheater. Never again.) …

True, true.

…you can’t keep his photo out and remember the good times, because now all those are in question. (What was really going on with him and her when we were in this photo?)
Even your past has to be put in a drawer and lost for good. Which is something widows don’t have to do.

True. My memories are in drawers and shelved boxes. The wedding was a nice day - because of my hopes and innocence of reality. Immediately after, the deterioation began as the real him appeared. Pictures after the wedding remind me what I lived with day in and out.

…The phrase I hate is “Do what you have to do” because that’s what people told him to do.

The phrase I hate is, “As long as your happy”. My ex’s family thought that was the be-all-end all, and justified what he did. That he seems happy now makes it all okay, at least it comes back that way to me. At the time, when I had one of my rare but incredible discoussion with my ex aobut his choice to divorce, his simple reason was, “I’m not happy” as if that should explain all.

…Another thing I did was have my engagement diamond reset in a mother’s ring with my children’s birthstones and mine. I earned that diamond! He may not be forever, but the rock remains.

Must be a nice rock. I don’t want mine.

…>>>>>>>>>http://www.goingpostalt-shirts.com/ItalianT-shirts/Big/ItalyMaria2.jpg

 

[Liberanosamalo]

Eliza, it is a lovely diamond. One carat. When he gave it to me, I thought it was because he loved me. Now I realize it’s because it made him look good and generous to everyone else. He’d sit and admire it and say “Look at the big rock I gave you.” And he’d never tire of telling all the women at work about how we got engaged and how romantic it was. It was all about how he looked. Later he was annoyed that he couldn’t get it back during the divorce.

As for filing the annulment… when I was going through the divorce I told my priest that I wanted to burn all the love letters from our dating and engagement (he was overseas part of the time, this was before internet.) The priest said no. Keep them. I’d need them for the annulment. And he was right (as usual.) It was contemporaneous proof of his state of mind during the period before and during the engagement and wedding. I now recommend to anyone to print out emails and keep them. You may need them someday, especially if your email trend is unpleasant while you’re dating.

And Kelly, I worry that you’re still officially tied to this man. How do you know he’s not ruining your credit? You can cite abandonment in a divorce petition.

Mine left for a year when the babies were little. Then he came back (not that I wanted it, but I had to try everything, right?) It was worse after I let him back. I had to wait two more years for him to be gone for good. I won’t go into details, but his behavior during this time was diabolical.

Sometimes people wait and hope that a second chance will work. Some things can’t be fixed. By the time I was divorced a second time I had moved to a new state with him and was stuck here. (His job moved him, and he said it would be a fresh start. And if I didn’t move with him, he’d kill me.)

So check your legal options. Be sure your patience isn’t rewarded with a financial knife in the back. Sounds like he is hedging his bets and he has her, but he thinks he’s keeping his options open if he changes his mind. When mine left the first time he later said “You’d have waited for ten years for me to come back, wouldn’t you?” He wasn’t happy when I told him no, and I was already looking into annulment proceedings. As soon as he found that out, he wanted back. Because he only wanted what he couldn’t have. Once you are no longer available to them, then you are more desirable than ever. I didn’t know that. I fell for it. I thought he was falling back in love with me. But once he had me back, he didn’t want me again. It’s the yo-yo treatment.

It’s a vicious cycle.

I was told by my priest to keep a diary of times and incidents of abuse. It came in handy in filling out the annulment petition. I had nine single-space pages of stuff on just that topic. I was told the more info you include, the better decision the tribunal can make.

And the computer made all that writing much easier. You don’t want to dredge it up, but it feels so good afterward to get it out. It was like confession. And the best part was to finally be treated with respect and mercy, which the legal profession did NOT do.
They treated me like I was part of the problem. But even at the end my lawyer was giving me free legal work because he was embarrassed at how long H had dragged things out and had run up the bill. It was basically a six year divorce from the first time he left till the day I got the divorce decree in final form. All the while he was telling my oldest that maybe someday mommy and daddy would get back together. And that he still loved me. Great way to make me look like the bad guy with the kids!

The games never stop.

But I learned to laugh a lot. During his tirades, which I knew by heart, I was tempted to yell out his lines before him, or along with him. But I knew that would get me slapped. I’d sit and try to think up snappy answers to his accusations. He told me life wasn’t a sitcom and whoever had the best retort won. I told him it worked for me. Anything to laugh. It was that or go completely mad.

One thing those guys don’t have is a working sense of humor. If they can’t laugh at themselves though, no problem. Many people are willing to do it for them.

 

[kellygirl]

“And Kelly, I worry that you’re still officially tied to this man. How do you know he’s not ruining your credit? You can cite abandonment in a divorce petition.”

Thanks for your concern, but I watch my credit like a hawk…all of the finances actually. My L has told me what I am entitled to and one thing I can say for my H is he has never been late with any support payments. I am very cognizant of the situation…I have closed our joint checking account and now I have my own and he pays me support weekly. I am getting very close to filing, I know it is near.

 

[Eliza10]

Eliza, it is a lovely diamond. One carat. When he gave it to me, I thought it was because he loved me. Now I realize it’s because it made him look good and generous to everyone else. He’d sit and admire it and say “Look at the big rock I gave you.” And he’d never tire of telling all the women at work about how we got engaged and how romantic it was. It was all about how he looked. Later he was annoyed that he couldn’t get it back during the divorce.

Mine is a 1/4 carat, as we were “poor” (little did I know he’d always consider us poor, no matter how much we had) and I was putting him through college at the start of our marraige, having completed mine and he was going back. The ring’s only beauty would be the love that it represented.

But it does not represent any love, only dashed hopes. If mine were lovely, I could see myself replacing putting it in a new setting with a new meaning, kind of like the oblisk in the Vatican square. I would first ask a priest to please bless it with Holy Water, though!

But I think I will sell mine on ebay, for far under what its worth, probably.

 

[Liberanosamalo]

You put him through college? Wow. He repaid you well, huh?

Why not get a small gold cross and have a jeweler fix it onto the cross for a necklace. The man was your cross. This is a good way to memorialize that fact. And a reminder to pray for him.

Don’t waste a diamond, not even a little one.

 

[Ray_Scheel]

I wonder how you all are doing half a year later.

About a year ago, the secretary for my department picked on me about the amount of grey hair I was getting, a solid sprinkling up there and in my beard. Now, it is hard to find any, down to just a few in my beard that have been there since I first grew it out in college and a couple up top, the fewest I’ve had since DS (5) was born. I’ve also manged to gain 10 lbs, which is a good thing. I’ve always been a beanpole (6’3", now ~153lbs) so I needed it, but just hadn’t been able to get it to stick no matter how I ate.

At my last contact from the tribunal ~3 weeks ago, in response to me asking them to not wait on one of my witnesses if she didn’t get her response in (I would still have 7, minimum of 3 required), they were waiting for my ex wife’s witness and counselor testimony to come in before moving to Publication. Though I am wondering who she’ll use beyond her family, I’m thinking that their testimony will be neutral at worst and may well help establish the grounds under which I’m petitioning since so many of the people she’s surrounded herself with have a really messed up idea of what marriage and family should be.

For a while she was still occasionally wanting to “talk” about what happened, but wanted to start from scratch each time she picked it back up again even though she was always the one who had previously discontinued communication of relationship issues. In late May she made a reference to picking back up again, but wanted to renegotiate from the top what she’d agreed to do in March (the last time she’d suspended talks) and hadn’t started yet, but dropped that when I said I wasn’t going to keep starting the conversation over regarding her making changes she’d been aware that the priest we’d been talking with had agreed to in principle back in March 2005… So I think she’s also (finally) just waiting until the nullity decision comes down…

My ex is doing considerably better as far as handling visitation with the kids and seeing them on a frequent basis. She still is rather irregular and hard to get to commit to a plan in advance, but I’ve been flexing on that for the kids sakes. She is making her token child support payment. I’ll have to see this month if she includes her half of all the times she’s taken the kids to ER in the past 8 months (most recently, a rather small splinter in DS’s toe that had been there less than 2 hours).

 

[Liberanosamalo]

Ray, it sounds like you’re doing well if you’re putting on weight. That was always the worst part of divorce was losing lots of weight.

Your xw sounds odd. Most women aren’t sporadic and irregular at all when it comes to seeing the children. Sounds like there were deeper problems. ER for a splinter?

Hope the Tribunal gets back to you soon.

 

[dulcissima]

Funny, when this thread resurfaced, I looked at the last couple of pages and hadn’t even realized I had posted on it originally. As I was reading a lot of the talk of the hurt feelings, I was realizing how much further along I was than I would have thought.

I am now divorced, instead of being in the process of divorcing. While I do still have some ugly drama in the future, such as my ex coming to get his things, I have found a lot of new strength and a lot of new detatchment. Even though inexplicably he is ramping things up post divorce, getting emotional and accusatory, I am not so bothered by it as I once would be. I’ve learned, he can make these ranting accusations of things that are objectively false (which can be proven false with past emails and court documents) so I don’t even have to defend myself against his ridiculous claims. I can just go about my business and do the things I need to do for my family, and let his little poisoned arrows fall to the ground around me. He is pretty worked up about his lack of control, but he is not going to detour me from moving forward.

I’ve put in the paperwork for going back to college in the fall and getting my teaching credential. I’ve been working this year as a teacher’s aid in a continuation school, and love being able to work one on one with some teenagers who really need it. I’ve been making positive steps with my own kids too, in having a more stable, more consistent home life. So, I think we are headed in the right direction.

I remember my first day of individual counseling, my counselor said at the end of the session that she was amazed at where I was at emotionally, that I was about 18 months ahead of the curve as far as perspective and understanding about my marriage. I think that is due largely to the studying I had done prior to leaving my abusive marriage, to coming to a real understanding about what a marriage really was. So, of course, I am working on my petition for annulment.

I think where I am now, I am feeling cautious and circumspect, but I am realizing I do still have trust and faith in marriage. I do thank God for that, because it allows me to hope.

 

[Liberanosamalo]

Good for you! And what you’ve been through will make you so much more effective with the teens.

 

[seaseadisney]

I guess I might a narcicist (sp) as my estranged and soon to be ex husband said I was to my father. When my dad asked him what that meant he told him to go and look it up in a dictionary.

I suppose I could have been a much better wife and I take all the blame for his leaving as I was not emotionally supportive. He was laying in bed most of the daylight hours and I felt smothered when I went home. He had lost his business because of poor business decisions (and depression) and we had to move to a rental home where he went to bed and I went to work to avoid him that is true.

I could have been a more understanding spouse.

He has just sent his records and has included the engagement ring in our assets. That hurt that he now takes a sacred object and reduces it to a financial record

 

[cmujake]

And god truly is watching over our every move…he has a better plan…its God’s Plan.

I think that while it is important to remember that God does have a plan for all of us, it is also important to remember that we are human beings and have free will. We think that we have the answers and instead of listening to HIM, we do what we want and interfere with HIS plan. Some people believe that everything that happens is pre-destined and do not believe in free will. My soon to be ex-wife is one of these people. She believes that everything happens for a reason. My response to someone not believing in free will is that if everything was already laid out, what would be the point of praying?