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MamasBoy33
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I support Trump still
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pnewton
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I truly do not understand this question. I would think the answer obvious on a Catholic site.
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MamasBoy33
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Tax bill passes.
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ProVobis
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OKi
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Well, I just see it differently. I absolutely love Trump. Full stop. There’s no “but” with me.
I do not think Trump brags or gives offense for no reason. I really don’t. I think he’s a lot more purposeful and very much smarter than most people give him credit for. I understand he’s a personality not everyone will like. But if the politicians in the GOP had not screwed up so badly for so long, Trump would not have been necessary. And I do feel he with his strong personality WAS necessary.
I am a conservative but I detest the Republican party. I hope Trump completely destroys it. They are totally corrupt. Total phonies. Total LOSERS. Even when they win elections, they accomplish nearly nothing. The fact they wouldn’t repeal Obamacare when they had the chance, after all those YEARS of pretending they were trying definitively exposed them for what they are. After Trump is through with them, I hope the only ones left are the ones who really do what the GOP voters want (not the donors).
Just my opinion but I am not offended by Trump - his so-called coarseness is irrelevant to me. There are real issues that needed to be taken on and WON. Like immigration, national sovereignty, controlling the border, and getting the corporatists out.
I do not think Trump brags or gives offense for no reason. I really don’t. I think he’s a lot more purposeful and very much smarter than most people give him credit for. I understand he’s a personality not everyone will like. But if the politicians in the GOP had not screwed up so badly for so long, Trump would not have been necessary. And I do feel he with his strong personality WAS necessary.
I am a conservative but I detest the Republican party. I hope Trump completely destroys it. They are totally corrupt. Total phonies. Total LOSERS. Even when they win elections, they accomplish nearly nothing. The fact they wouldn’t repeal Obamacare when they had the chance, after all those YEARS of pretending they were trying definitively exposed them for what they are. After Trump is through with them, I hope the only ones left are the ones who really do what the GOP voters want (not the donors).
Just my opinion but I am not offended by Trump - his so-called coarseness is irrelevant to me. There are real issues that needed to be taken on and WON. Like immigration, national sovereignty, controlling the border, and getting the corporatists out.
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OKi
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Thank you for posting that. I have seen it before but I liked watching it again. That guy “placeboing” on youtube is an absolute genius. I’m so glad we can have some fun with it now, after the fact, after dodging the lethal bullet which was Hillary Rodham Clinton.
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OKi
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We were talking about the primaries.
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OKi
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Exactly. Some of those pundits still don’t know “what happened”. They were out of touch with the American people and many of them still are. That’s why the election results were such an unfathomable earthquake for them.
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OKi
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You’re very wrong on that, ProVobis. Hillary would have been much worse on abortion.
Federally funding abortion in perpetuity would have been a permanent national tragedy for America, and Hillary had the power and legal expertise to do that. This is the reason the abortion industry hates Trump so much. They fear he will end their gravy train of tax money and I hope he does.
Federally funding abortion in perpetuity would have been a permanent national tragedy for America, and Hillary had the power and legal expertise to do that. This is the reason the abortion industry hates Trump so much. They fear he will end their gravy train of tax money and I hope he does.
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angel12
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That is an absolutely amazing job of twisting what TheAmazingGrace said. The statement was very clear.
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jfz178
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Good point. I think we have gotten complacent on abortion and don’t realize how much worse it can get. Back in the aftermath of Roe v Wade, even abortion promoters saw it as a last ditch option. I heard a lot of proponents say, “I would never want to have an abortion, but I want women to be able to have one if they really need it.” But now there are some radical feminists who not only want it to stay legal, but who actually want to promote it. Both International Planned Parenthood and UN Women are trying to actually push having abortions, worldwide. This goes beyond just providing abortion “rights” this is “abortion encouragement.”
In addition, some radical US feminists feel that having kids holds women back in the workplace and in politics and the abortion is a key tool in solving that. My daughter has a sister-in-law who is a perfect example. She is a healthy professional woman from a well-to-do Christian from a who frankly, “sleeps around.” She has had three abortions, basically because she has not taken “precautions” and she brags about it.
The ways this is being promoted is:
So when considering abortion as a voting decision, I think it’s important to realize that curtailing abortion is a larger fight whose victory may be a ways off. The immediate battle is keep abortion from expanding, to keep it from becoming more normalized.
In addition, some radical US feminists feel that having kids holds women back in the workplace and in politics and the abortion is a key tool in solving that. My daughter has a sister-in-law who is a perfect example. She is a healthy professional woman from a well-to-do Christian from a who frankly, “sleeps around.” She has had three abortions, basically because she has not taken “precautions” and she brags about it.
The ways this is being promoted is:
- Articles lauding women who choose to not have kids
- Articles that show how much more successful women who don’t have kids can be
- Articles about the cosmetic aspects of giving birth, basically that your body will look better if you don’t take a child to term
- Changing the narrative: They don’t use the term “abortion” as much, but say things about “reproductive health choices”
So when considering abortion as a voting decision, I think it’s important to realize that curtailing abortion is a larger fight whose victory may be a ways off. The immediate battle is keep abortion from expanding, to keep it from becoming more normalized.
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godisgood77
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Okay word-boy. Let’s shift gears… what is it about this President’s words, actions and positions that you support? Keeping in mind that the thread is about whether a Catholic can support him - so try to consider Catholic teaching when writing your next diatribe.
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HarryStotle
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Let’s do “consider Catholic teaching,” but before we “shift gears.” Insulting Catholics on forums is, I wouldn’t think, a way of demonstrating a consideration for Catholic teaching. Unless you also want to make insult out to be a synonym of admonish?
Admonishing the sinner is considered a work of MERCY in Church teaching. It comes from taking seriously the words of Jesus in Matthew:
Note that the person being admonished is directly involved and addressed, first in private by the admonisher, then by the "one or two others,’ and then by the Church who speak to the “brother” directly.
If that still doesn’t convince you about admonishing not being merely criticizing, swap the word admonish with criticize in the statement of the work of mercy. Do you honestly suppose the Church intends that admonish the sinner could be read as criticize the sinner? How could that sincerely be considered a work of mercy?
What I see here, on your part, is an unwillingness to recognize that you just might be wrong about something, in this case, about a critically important definition of a word. Rather than admit you are wrong, you get snarky – “word-boy” – and then deflect to something else – “let’s change gears.”
What would be the point of changing gears, from my perspective, if no matter what I do to make a convincing case about Trump, your inability to admit you are wrong will always get in the way of you possibly being convinced that you might just be wrong about Trump? Why would I enter into such a futile endeavor?
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HarryStotle
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Yeah, well, so was the claim that Trump has “no track record” with regard to opposition of abortion. And someone did claim that. Funny, I didn’t see you post anything to correct THAT “false claim, a straw man.” We seem to be very selective with regard to pointing out straw men, no?SuperLuigi:
That is a false claim, a straw man. No one is saying that.
Makes one begin to question whether the virtue of honesty is being taken seriously in this thread.
Or do you agree that Trump has “no track record” in that regard? Do I also need to go on another long “diatribe” regarding the meaning of track record?
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HarryStotle
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Did you not see the question mark? He was asking for clarification. How is that an “absolutely amazing job of twisting” what was said, when he is uncertain of what was said? “Are you saying…?”MamasBoy33:
That is an absolutely amazing job of twisting what TheAmazingGrace said.
And very clearly trading off an Implicitly evil act, abortion, for some undefined and relative goods which may or may not obtain.
Kind of like Judas trading in one life, that of Jesus, in return for the good to all the people that he thought would come about as a result of the trade-off. The thirty pieces of silver were a bonus.
Ditto with Planned Parenthood and its supporters. The selling of baby body parts is just a bonus, a charitable donation from the recipients of those parts.
See what an absolutely amazing job of “twisting” really looks like when the twisters put their minds to it?
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PetraG
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My main problem with Mr Trump is how flippantly he says things that are wrong (because he repeats things he sees on TV without bothering to have someone fact check) or just plain lies. It is as if he doesn’t understand how easy it is for an average person to check for themselves directly whether or not he’s just making stuff up again.
Do not tell me “they all do it.” No, they do not all do it as he does and lying does not become more palatable because others do it. He says he’s different than everyone else in politics–yes, he’s more brazen in his lies! The worst may be how he makes things up just to brag how he is once again the biggest or best of all time.
How childish does someone have to be to want to do that? Really? You’re the President of the United States, you don’t have to show off like a foolish insecure middle schooler. More to the point: How stupid does he think I am? How lazy does he think I am about checking for myself whether the truth means anything at all to him? How do you love that–being lied to so often and so carelessly?
I’ve known people who lie like that. They don’t confine themselves to small or insignificant matters. They’ll lie to you about anything and do it straight to your face. The ones like him who won’t ever admit they’ve lied when you catch them and yet always talk about how everyone else lies except them are the worst. That is why of all the truth-twisters in Washington, I trust him the least: he has earned it.
Do not tell me “they all do it.” No, they do not all do it as he does and lying does not become more palatable because others do it. He says he’s different than everyone else in politics–yes, he’s more brazen in his lies! The worst may be how he makes things up just to brag how he is once again the biggest or best of all time.
How childish does someone have to be to want to do that? Really? You’re the President of the United States, you don’t have to show off like a foolish insecure middle schooler. More to the point: How stupid does he think I am? How lazy does he think I am about checking for myself whether the truth means anything at all to him? How do you love that–being lied to so often and so carelessly?
I’ve known people who lie like that. They don’t confine themselves to small or insignificant matters. They’ll lie to you about anything and do it straight to your face. The ones like him who won’t ever admit they’ve lied when you catch them and yet always talk about how everyone else lies except them are the worst. That is why of all the truth-twisters in Washington, I trust him the least: he has earned it.
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ProVobis
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If he spent as much time talking against abortion as he does against Chicago, you might have a case.
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PetraG
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If I was looking for someone who really cared about ending abortion, I don’t see how Donald Trump would be my candidate until he’s running against a Democrat. If you look up what he’s said in the past, there is not a consistent recognition of understanding the true nature of the act or the factors that lure mothers into doing it.
Having said that, he has not pushed the matter to the back burner. I don’t know if the issue is important to him personally, I can’t say, but it seems clear that he appreciates that his supporters care about it very deeply.
I do think he counts the support of his core voters above all. That doesn’t mean that he won’t say things to please them that aren’t true, but hand it to him: he didn’t get into office and just forget who got him there. That is a point in his favor, an unusual trait in a good way.
Having said that, he has not pushed the matter to the back burner. I don’t know if the issue is important to him personally, I can’t say, but it seems clear that he appreciates that his supporters care about it very deeply.
I do think he counts the support of his core voters above all. That doesn’t mean that he won’t say things to please them that aren’t true, but hand it to him: he didn’t get into office and just forget who got him there. That is a point in his favor, an unusual trait in a good way.
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PetraG
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Just by the way: the data say self-identified Catholics were split on whether to vote for Trump or not. Whether you look at self-administered surveys or surveys conducted by contact by another person, the numbers are in the ballpark of 48% Trump, 45% Clinton, and the rest somewhere else.
if you put 48 Catholics on one side of a church and 45 on the other, nobody would look at that and say there is clearly a majority on one side or the other. It certainly wasn’t a lot different than the Obama-Romney split from the earlier election. If there is that little difference between Mitt Romney and Donald Trump or Barack Obama and Hillary Clinton, you have to conclude that the support was largely based on political platform, not the person…because man oh man, those are four very different people!
if you put 48 Catholics on one side of a church and 45 on the other, nobody would look at that and say there is clearly a majority on one side or the other. It certainly wasn’t a lot different than the Obama-Romney split from the earlier election. If there is that little difference between Mitt Romney and Donald Trump or Barack Obama and Hillary Clinton, you have to conclude that the support was largely based on political platform, not the person…because man oh man, those are four very different people!
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