Do Catholics still support Trump

[anon65111186]

As recently as October, he tweeted this:

@realDonaldTrump

With all of the Fake News coming out of NBC and the Networks, at what point is it appropriate to challenge their License? Bad for country!

That presidential tweet followed an NBC News report that claimed Trump had sought what amounted to a nearly tenfold increase in the U.S. nuclear arsenal during a summer meeting with national security leaders. Pure fake news, the general was there and said it was completely false.

 

[OKi]

Yes, his attorneys are concerned. And, excuse me, you know this … how?

Why don’t we conduct a trial right here, in the Court Of Online Forum (COOF).

Present your evidence: Which of Trump’s purported lies shall we examine first?

 

[anon65111186]

In other words, print what the government likes, or you don’t get access.

That’s undermining a free press. The evidence is there for anyone who is willing to admit it,

If you read the article it was a one time off-camera event with a select few, so it neccesarily excluded some people. It wasn’t an ongoing thing. It wasn’t Trump, but Spicer, who is no longer there mind you.

What Trump says is not as important as what he does, because people can interpret any way they like.

He is not doing anything that is illegal or against the constitution, and our three part government system would never allow him to get away with “undermining the press”. Have a little more trust in the founding fathers and how they set up our country.

 

[anon65111186]

That acquits Mrs. Clinton of all wrong-doing, too. Are you willing to stick with that?

How does saying Trump would be impeached if he obstructed get such a response? I don’t think you were following the thread.

If Trump has obstructed justice, how does that acquit Mrs. Clinton?

 

[anon65111186]

Try most of them, including the Brits, the Canadians, and the Mexicans. His approval rating in Europe and most of Asia is dismal.

Can you give specifics, instead of making those countries and regions into monoliths? I know for a fact that South Korean news and all I know have become very positive on Trump.

Again, false. Some need to remember that Mueller and Comey are both Republicans and were appointed by Republicans, and the only accusation of corruption and insubordination is coming out of Trump & Co. and some of the right-wing media.

Did I say Mueller and Comey in particular? No.

“right wing media” Are you a Catholic first or a liberal or conservative first? This is a Catholic forum, and whether it comes from the far-right or far-left is not neccesarily relevant, except to make genetic fallacy arguments. The source is bad, so the news is biased, is that what you want to say? There are no unbiased sources unfortunately.

As Catholics we accept truth nomatter where we find it. I don’t find your partisanship particularly Catholic.

 

[PaulinVA]

It removed any facade we might have had as an honest broker in the middle east, and placed us firmly in Israel’s camp.

That contradicts what the White house actually said. They didn’t do anything but recognize the de facto capital, Palestine does not have their de facto capital there. They are still working with the situation, they didn’t recognize borders or anything, just the capital.

LOL. The White House lies, too. We gave something to Israel they have wanted for years, and didn’t get anything in return. For a master negotiator, Trump is pretty dumb.

From CNN:
The final status of Jerusalem has always been one of the most difficult and sensitive questions in the Israeli-Palestinian conflict. For years, US policy has been to avoid declaring Jerusalem the capital of Israel in the absence of an Israeli-Palestinian peace deal, as the Palestinians also claim Jerusalem as their capital. It was argued that a unilateral decision would break with international consensus and prejudge an issue that was supposed to be left to negotiations.

Recognizing Jerusalem as the capital has also moved the United States a big step closer to relocating the embassy from Tel Aviv to Jerusalem, which would be seen as cementing Israeli sovereignty over the city.

Donald Trump has publicly lied at least 1600 times since inauguration. The news does not print fake stories against him.

Wow so charitable of you counting his sins, how many other people’s sins do you count? Do you really think that worldly way of thinking is charitable? Would you have someone count your lies and publish it for the world to see?

Donald Trump is the leader of the free world. His every statement is parsed by leaders the world over. He. is. a. liar. That is a fact. It is not uncharitable. It is the truth.

 

[anon65111186]

Besides undermining the “MSM”, the Trump supporters have turned on the FBI and some other federal agencies undoubtedly because they’re well aware of what’s coming down the pike with the investigations. They know the “message” is gonna be bad, so they’re going after the “messengers” in advance.

After all, why else would six members of Trump’s staff lie about not having any contact with the Russians, and why would they try and stop these investigations if they’re innocent? If I’m innocent, I want all the information to come out to show that I’m innocent.

All you have, and anyone who makes similar arguments against the president is speculation. We don’t know what Mueller has on the President in regards to collusion, obstruction of justice etc.

You can speculate all day, but why don’t you rather pray for Trump, pray for Mueller, pray for our divided country. That would be more useful. In heaven when we look back are we going to be proud of all the back and forth about such a worldly thing? Keep you eyes on Jesus and don’t look to either Mueller or Trump as your savior.

 

[Metis1]

The chair of the House of Representatives science committee, in a statement

“By withdrawing from the Paris climate agreement, President Trump has freed America from a bad deal that would cost billions of dollars but have little significant environmental benefit”

Whereas he was lying because no foreign agreement can trump U.S. law, no pun intended. OK, maybe a little pun. Secondly, by itself there would little effect, but in conjunction with other states and over many decades, it should.

 

[PaulinVA]

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[OKi]

That’s your big lie? We agree to the Paris Accord but it’s a lie to say we’d have to abide by it and lose billions and billions of dollars on a strategy that could have no effect whatsoever on so-called global warming?

 

[anon65111186]

For a master negotiator, Trump is pretty dumb.

So wordly, there is no reason to speak in such a way.

From CNN:

The final status of Jerusalem has always been one of the most difficult and sensitive questions in the Israeli-Palestinian conflict.

CNN? Talking about CNN… here is something I saw today we as Catholics should be concerned with, immorality in our newspapers:

CNN Tuesday, December 19 - 9:48 PM WorldNetDaily
On CNN’s New Day Sunday, the show devoted a four-minute segment to the new children’s book, Santa’s Husband, which portrays Santa Claus as a gay man who gets married to another man.

For years, US policy has been to avoid declaring Jerusalem the capital of Israel in the absence of an Israeli-Palestinian peace deal

Were they getting any closer to an agreement? In fact they have been getting farther and farther away over time.

Donald Trump is the leader of the free world. His every statement is parsed by leaders the world over. He. is. a. liar. That is a fact. It is not uncharitable. It is the truth.

Are you a liar, have you ever sinned? Cast the first stone if you haven’t, otherwise don’t add to the detraction and calumny the world the flesh and the devil loves.

 

[anon65111186]

Whereas he was lying because no foreign agreement can trump U.S. law, no pun intended. OK, maybe a little pun. Secondly, by itself there would little effect, but in conjunction with other states and over many decades, it should.

The point is it did not stop America from cleaning up the environment. It also did not stop other countries from doing the same. Countries who don’t do so can’t blame the US. The reason for them not cleaning up the environment is not going to be because the US isn’t in the climate accord.

 

[Metis1]

All you have, and anyone who makes similar arguments against the president is speculation. We don’t know what Mueller has on the President in regards to collusion, obstruction of justice etc.

You can speculate all day, but why don’t you rather pray for Trump, pray for Mueller, pray for our divided country. That would be more useful. In heaven when we look back are we going to be proud of all the back and forth about such a worldly thing? Keep you eyes on Jesus and don’t look to either Mueller or Trump as your savior.

To the first point, all one has to do is to connect the dots to realize that there is some sort of there there.

To the latter point, I certainly don’t think for one minute that Mueller and Comey are my saviors, but if one “keeps their eye on Jesus”, they sure as heck shouldn’t be Trump supporters.

 

[anon65111186]

if one “keeps their eye on Jesus”, they sure as heck shouldn’t be Trump supporters.

So they should be against the man? How is that any more Christlike?

 

[Metis1]

That’s your big lie? We agree to the Paris Accord but it’s a lie to say we’d have to abide by it and lose billions and billions of dollars on a strategy that could have no effect whatsoever on so-called global warming?

Let me suggest you actually google whether international agreements are sovereign over our domestic laws and see what you get.

 

[jfz178]

Misleading. The treaty would have the force of US law if ratified by the Senate. The State Department signing an agreement shows an intention and is the first step. Then comes the push for ratification.

Also, the Paris deal is full of empty promise. The restrictions are too little to have significant effect and there is little enforcement built in. What it would do, if ratified, is open the way for international civil law action against companies who do not comply. There is a legitimate fear that international regulators might use that power in a vindictive way against US companies.

Also, the treaty has no chance of being ratified, so why keep up the pretense that we are still in the deal?

 

[PetraG]

That presidential tweet followed an NBC News report that claimed Trump had sought what amounted to a nearly tenfold increase in the U.S. nuclear arsenal during a summer meeting with national security leaders. Pure fake news, the general was there and said it was completely false.

“I never discussed increasing it. I want it in perfect shape. That was just fake news by NBC. We don’t need an increase. But I want modernization and I want total rehabilitation. It’s got to be in tip-top shape.”
–Donald Trump, October 11, 2017

@realDonaldTrump
The United States must greatly strengthen and expand its nuclear capability until such time as the world comes to its senses regarding nukes

8:50 AM - 22 Dec 2016

“Recent reports that the president called for an increase in the U.S. nuclear arsenal are absolutely false. This kind of erroneous reporting is irresponsible,” Defense Secretary Jim Mattis

Last year, he said the US needed to “greatly strengthen and expand its nuclear capability,”–his own words from his own tweet–but ten months later it irresponsible to say he wanted that? He called for it. It is in his tweets. The question is whether the degree was exaggerated or whether or not he’s going to come out and say that he’s changed his mind.

Mind you, it is worrisome enough that he originally made the tweet without taking the trouble to find out if there are any treaties precluding what he was proposing. (There are.)

So…ONCE AGAIN… he’s a pretty rich one to be claiming about “fake news.” He is a source himself. If NBC ought to lose their license for that, what consequences should he face? Oh, nothing, because he “tells it like it is.”

Do not get me started.

 

[anon65111186]

Supporting his pro-life policies, his policies that accord with Catholic moral and social justice teaching does not equal supporting his personal sins, and I can’t imagine anyplace where support of a person politically means endorsing their sins.

He is a known sinner, but are you without sin? If so, cast the first stone.

There are no virtuous nor perfect politicians, they are all human and all have sin.

Is that episode something he apologized and repented of? Yes. Why don’t you forgive him and move on? That would be the Catholic thing to do.

 

[anon65111186]

Last year, he said the US needed to “greatly strengthen and expand its nuclear capability,”–his own words

You know that the NBC report did not cite that tweet, but rather said
“President Donald Trump said he wanted what amounted to a nearly tenfold increase in the U.S. nuclear arsenal during a gathering this past summer of the nation’s highest-ranking national security leaders, according to three officials who were in the room.”

The leaders in the room said he never said such a thing. Whether he said it before that gathering was not at issue. It was whether they accurately reported on the meeting.

 

[PetraG]

My apologies. When I have read that on other forums, the clarified meaning was “he would have been impeached by now.” I should not have read that meaning into your post, since you were only saying that he will be impeached if he is obstructed.

Of course, there is no such assurance. Impeachment is a political process, removal is a political process, and I think we all know it. If he were so clearly guilty of something that he will admit he’s guilty when confronted with the facts, that would be different if he were not also Donald Trump. I don’t think that will happen, guilty or not, because I don’t think he has any quit in him.