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buffalo
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This question is still open - what will you be in heaven? Will you still be protesting?
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PRmerger
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It says we must judge, but when we judge we must judge rightly.
24Stop judging by mere appearances, and make a right judgment.
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tmac1956
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Those are called traditions and in the case of the RCC, some of those would be traditions passed down from the Apostles. For Protestants, however, traditions are often looked upon as a bad thing – even though many denominations are ripe with them. I.e. Alter calls, wednesday night services, revivals, etc. And yes, not everything said or done by Jesus was writen down. That’s where Sacred Tradition and the writings of the early church fathers come in to fill the gaps.
Why not be specific on what “…not so silly teachings…” that you had/have problems with? If you list them, each could be addressed one at a time by knowledgable Catholics here.
God Bless!
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nlm
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If I understand you correctly many of these CC teachings are traditions. Could they originate from man rather than from Jesus? Thread #199 which basically says one is headed to hell if one does not live by the CC teachings is saying that one can go to hell for not accepting traditions? Am I missing somethings here? You are correct in pointing out many Protestant traditions. The big difference is that if I ,as a member of that church participates in a Wednesday evening prayer service or a revival etc. or not has no impact on my salvation . These are opportunities to avail one’s self of being with other Christians for prayer and worship plain and simple.NLM
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PJM
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The lack of understanding of who and what God are in the Protestant Community that post here is astounding. Even given the fact that they seem to enjoy some assumed right to only use parts of the bible that agree with them, and have the right, nay; even the obligation to ignore the Word of God.
This lack of understanding is most perplexing.Mt. 3: "16 And when Jesus [Second Person of the Trinity] was baptized, he went up immediately from the water, and behold, the heavens were opened and he saw the Spirit of God descending like a dove, [Third Person in the Blessed Trinity] and alighting on him; and lo, a voice from heaven, saying, “This is my beloved Son, [First Person in the Trinity] with whom I am well pleased.”
*John 1: 1 "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was in the beginning with God; [Speaking specifically of Jesus!] all things were made through him, and without him was not anything made that was made. In him was life, and the life was the light of men. The light shines in the darkness, and the darkness has not overcome it. **
John 10: 37: "If I am not doing the works of my Father, then do not believe me; 38 but if I do them, even though you do not believe me, believe the works, that you may know and understand that the Father is in me and I am in the Father."
Luke 10: 21 "In that same hour he rejoiced in the Holy Spirit and said, “I thank thee, Father, Lord of heaven and earth, that thou hast hidden these things from the wise and understanding and revealed them to babes; yea, Father, for such was thy gracious will. All things have been delivered to me by my Father; and no one knows who the Son is except the Father, or who the Father is except the Son and any one to whom the Son chooses to reveal him.”
Friend I share this for the sake of your salvation:
1 John 2: 21 "I write to you, not because you do not know the truth, but because you know it, and know that no lie is of the truth.Who is the liar but he who denies that Jesus is the Christ? This is the antichrist, he who denies the Father and the Son. No one who denies the Son has the Father. He who confesses the Son has the Father also. Let what you heard from the beginning abide in you. If what you heard from the beginning abides in you, then you will abide in the Son and in the Father.
***Mt. 12: " 31Therefore I tell you, every sin and blasphemy will be forgiven men, but the blasphemy against the Spirit will not be forgiven. And whoever says a word against the Son of man will be forgiven; but whoever speaks against the Holy Spirit will not be forgiven, either in this age or in the age to come. ***
Friend you need to rethink your position which is unbiblical. To deny any part of the Trinity is to Deny God! That is serious salvation endangering stuff
Love and prayers,*
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tmac1956
Guest
I believe that someone has already posted the difference between big “T” and little “t” traditions. However, little “t” traditions are akin to customs; such as the color of vestments, etc. And as such, they are not part of doctrine and can therefore be changed. Disbelief in these will not send you to hell. Doctrine, however, is a different matter.
It is my understanding that doctrine has come to us through Apostolic Tradition (big “T”) directly from the teaching of Jesus to the Apostles (remember that not everything Jesus said or did was writen down), or by guidance through the Holy spirit via the Pope. Examples are the Trinity, hypostatic union, etc.
I hope this helps.
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distracted
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Jesus told Peter (St Mt 16:18) when speaking of the Church he was beginning on Earth he would give him the keys… whatever he bound on Earth would be bound in heavne and whatever would be loosed on EArth would be loosed in Heavne…
He gave to the 1st pope, Peter, the power to make Church laws… traditions and etc…
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distracted
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you don’t have to obey every tradition like no meat on Fridays… to get into Heaven… These kinds of things just help us to htink of God…
and the way the world is today, you have to admit that is not a bad idea… to get poeple to think about God… .
doesn’t look like too many are thinking about him… when they make sex & violence saturated movies… TV shows… when people watch those movies & TV shows rather than help the poor, etc…
i don’t see too many thinking of God… and if they are… well, maybe they should let their thoughts come out once in awhile…
and the way the world is today, you have to admit that is not a bad idea… to get poeple to think about God… .
doesn’t look like too many are thinking about him… when they make sex & violence saturated movies… TV shows… when people watch those movies & TV shows rather than help the poor, etc…
i don’t see too many thinking of God… and if they are… well, maybe they should let their thoughts come out once in awhile…
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AwGusTeen
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Yes, these are your set of beliefs and you are certainly entitled to them – albeit a somewhat skewed set. However, I believe that our separated Protestant brothers and sisters call this “easy believism”.
On a completely different topic… Would you PLEASE stop SHOUTING with virtually EVERY other word and USE a little NETIQUETTE.
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tweetymom
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Nlm You have done a great job explaining your position and I have found your post to be a breathe of fresh air. Keep on doing what you are doing . You are a very polite person Thank you for that. It isn’t always necessary for all to agree just try and work together. It’s not easy being a Christian but if we all pray for one another we will make it! God BlessYes, these are your set of beliefs and you are certainly entitled to them – albeit a somewhat skewed set. However, I believe that our separated Protestant brothers and sisters call this “easy believism”.
On a completely different topic… Would you PLEASE stop SHOUTING with virtually EVERY other word and USE a little NETIQUETTE.
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Sonny1954
Guest
From the writings of Mark Twain:
“I knew a man who tried diligently all his life to acquire Heaven. When he finally got there, the first person he met was the fellow he’d been hoping all that time was in Hell. He was so disappointed and outraged that he picked up his satchel, inquired the way to Hell and left. So there you have it…Heaven for climate, Hell for society.”:heaven:
“I knew a man who tried diligently all his life to acquire Heaven. When he finally got there, the first person he met was the fellow he’d been hoping all that time was in Hell. He was so disappointed and outraged that he picked up his satchel, inquired the way to Hell and left. So there you have it…Heaven for climate, Hell for society.”:heaven:
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distracted
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i fail to see how highlighting somehting or making it bigger is not using “netiquette”…Yes, these are your set of beliefs and you are certainly entitled to them – albeit a somewhat skewed set. However, I believe that our separated Protestant brothers and sisters call this “easy believism”.
On a completely different topic… Would you PLEASE stop SHOUTING with virtually EVERY other word and USE a little NETIQUETTE.
it is a common tool of all writers to emphasize certain words & sentences… .
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distracted
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this shows to me how people end up in Hell… i believe people ALL meet God and are shown Heaven at the end of their lives… but not all STAY there…
even though this is a “joke” i believe it be reflect a very real event that happens w/ everyone who dies…
and i believe that people DO, after “arriving”… find something about Heaven they don’t like… all that mushy LOVE stuff…for example. "I don’t want to go THERE!!!" and so they pitch themselves into Hell or hopefully Purgatory, which, from all i have learned (and been through) means Hell that however excrutiating (as the saints call it), does eventually end… once you are purified of all that aversion to love and various other godly “things” you think you don’t want…
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distracted
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My “Issues” (??) with the Church (etc):
I tend to believe men are better off being married. Statistics will bear me out: men live longer when they are married. Women, however, do not… they live longer being single… so I guess the Catholic Church with its celibacy for priests… and nuns… actually benefits women (assuming living long is a great benefit??) . Even so, I still think there should be a celibate priesthood. The Church used to have both but that changed in the 13th century or thereabouts & this pope isn’t going to change it even though it is not a dogma etched in stone that priests not be married.
Anyway… you mentioned Indulgences. Basically a person sacrifices an amount of $ so that a Mass can be said for deceased persons in Purgatory. I find this to be a beautiful teaching, that we can help suffering souls get to Heaven sooner. I totally believe it but it’s a long story all the various reasons I believe it… (other than i trust the Church Christ gave us)
Do you believe in purgatory? 1 Cor 3:13 / St Mt 18:23, & 12:32…
I believe in Purg because of what I’ve learned but also due to that great Teacher Experience. I am in Purg and continue to be there… atoning for past sins. Jesus forgives us our sins and opens the way of salvation but there is still expiation to be done after forgiveness… I don’t know if this is one of the things you don’t believe in or not??
The thing that ends all questions about the Church is whether or not Christ established one Church & if so, [the answer to the question of:] Which one is it? If we can know w/ certainty that the RCC is the true Church, we can therefore trust everything it teaches… Of course there can only be one Church and any that teach something opposite of what the true one teaches must, by logic, be in error. Everything protestant churches teach is not in error but it is when it disagrees w/ Catholic teaching. the Catholic Church is the one Christ established. All others came after the 1500s and are man-made. They aren’t all bad, but they contain error.
I sometimes feel like leaving the RCC myself… rude priests, unorthodox priests, bad Catholics… etc… but there is one thing that will keep me There forever (if nothing else): The Real Presence.
Have you ever spent much time There with Jesus? When I go There and sit with him in total silence, I am shown amazing things… about my life… about life in this world in general… things too mysterious & deep to put into words…
All Christians should do this… otherwise they are missing out… which should go w/o saying.
I tend to believe men are better off being married. Statistics will bear me out: men live longer when they are married. Women, however, do not… they live longer being single… so I guess the Catholic Church with its celibacy for priests… and nuns… actually benefits women (assuming living long is a great benefit??) . Even so, I still think there should be a celibate priesthood. The Church used to have both but that changed in the 13th century or thereabouts & this pope isn’t going to change it even though it is not a dogma etched in stone that priests not be married.
Anyway… you mentioned Indulgences. Basically a person sacrifices an amount of $ so that a Mass can be said for deceased persons in Purgatory. I find this to be a beautiful teaching, that we can help suffering souls get to Heaven sooner. I totally believe it but it’s a long story all the various reasons I believe it… (other than i trust the Church Christ gave us)
Do you believe in purgatory? 1 Cor 3:13 / St Mt 18:23, & 12:32…
I believe in Purg because of what I’ve learned but also due to that great Teacher Experience. I am in Purg and continue to be there… atoning for past sins. Jesus forgives us our sins and opens the way of salvation but there is still expiation to be done after forgiveness… I don’t know if this is one of the things you don’t believe in or not??
The thing that ends all questions about the Church is whether or not Christ established one Church & if so, [the answer to the question of:] Which one is it? If we can know w/ certainty that the RCC is the true Church, we can therefore trust everything it teaches… Of course there can only be one Church and any that teach something opposite of what the true one teaches must, by logic, be in error. Everything protestant churches teach is not in error but it is when it disagrees w/ Catholic teaching. the Catholic Church is the one Christ established. All others came after the 1500s and are man-made. They aren’t all bad, but they contain error.
I sometimes feel like leaving the RCC myself… rude priests, unorthodox priests, bad Catholics… etc… but there is one thing that will keep me There forever (if nothing else): The Real Presence.
Have you ever spent much time There with Jesus? When I go There and sit with him in total silence, I am shown amazing things… about my life… about life in this world in general… things too mysterious & deep to put into words…
All Christians should do this… otherwise they are missing out… which should go w/o saying.
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distracted
Guest
.
one of the points i was wanting to make with the previous post was that even though i have “issues” with the Church teachings sometimes, that is not a reason for me to leave the Church Christ instituted on EArth…
it is far from perfect… but there is no other church that doesn’t have the same problems…
and the Church was important to Jesus so it should therefore be important to us who call oursleves Christian… and even those who don’t… but that’s another story…
one of the points i was wanting to make with the previous post was that even though i have “issues” with the Church teachings sometimes, that is not a reason for me to leave the Church Christ instituted on EArth…
it is far from perfect… but there is no other church that doesn’t have the same problems…
and the Church was important to Jesus so it should therefore be important to us who call oursleves Christian… and even those who don’t… but that’s another story…
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nlm
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Thank you for your kind words. I am not here to argue but to try and get answers to questions which were never answered for me in the past. You are correct, being a Christian is not easy but it’s worth every effort to be a Christ follower. We will never agree on everything and that’s ok ,as long as we respect one another’s beliefs. Some seem to think that qestionning is not respecting,that is not correct in my opinion. When I ask a question, it’s because I really do not know the answer. Otherwise, I would not waist my time nor anyone elses.NLM
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nlm
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I have never heard the words" easy believism " spoken nor have I ever read this word anywhere in any Protestant literature. What would the origin of this word be?Yes, these are your set of beliefs and you are certainly entitled to them – albeit a somewhat skewed set. However, I believe that our separated Protestant brothers and sisters call this “easy believism”.
On a completely different topic… Would you PLEASE stop SHOUTING with virtually EVERY other word and USE a little NETIQUETTE.
I will be the first to admit I am not well versed in what you call “netiquette”. I apologize if I have broken netiquette rules. I will try and be more careful in the future.Thank you for sharing your knowledge in both these issues.NLM
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tweetymom
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Unfortunally some think that if you ask a question or diagree you you are disresectful and I do 100% agree with you. I have certainly taken a lot of slams here because I don’t always agree. No we will never agree 100% but we do need to agree that we are one in Christ God Bless:thumbsup:
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nlm
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Marrried priests> Yes, I believe priests should marry if they wish.I could add to this statement but I have limited time this evening.
Purgatory> No ,I do not believe in it. When I die I will be judged then and there. There is no second chance ,no waiting ,it’s done.
The true church> I believe Jesus sent His followers to spread His word and make disciples. I believe Jesus expects us to follow Him. I am not convinced He is so bothered by the name on the front door of the building I worship Him in. When I die I will be asked if I accepted Jesus as my Lord and Saviour. I will be asked if I lived my Christian walk to the very best of my ability. I will be asked if I treated my neighbor, regardless of his religious beliefs like a Christ follower should treat his neighbor. And much more. I don’t think the words Anglican, Baptist,Catholic, Wesleyan etc. will ever be spoken.
Spending time with Jesus> Yes, I spend time with Jesus as frequently as I can. He lives within me and I spend time with Him when I pray.He has done amazing things for me in recent times.One need only learn to listen and be sensitive to His calling and direction in our lives and one sees how really real He is. It is amazing .
These may not be the answers you want to hear but as I have tried to do in all my threads I am being honest with you. What value would it be to our discussions if I answered the way I know you would like me to answer? God BlessNLM
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