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Roman_Catholic_1
Guest
Underdog no one said anything about RCIA or having water sprinkled on your head.
Can you tell us the Church you go to for worship on Sundays?
God bless
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Can you tell us the Church you go to for worship on Sundays?
God bless
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underdog
Guest
Catholic are far from uniform in their beliefs, and I think you know that.Well, I’ll accept that, for now. Tell me this, how many different Christian denominations are there in the world today? And, do they all share the same doctrines and beliefs?
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underdog
Guest
Why is the so important to Roman Catholics. I can tell you the Holy Spirit is present during the worship service.Underdog no one said anything about RCIA or having water sprinkled on your head.
Can you tell us the Church you go to for worship on Sundays?
God bless
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Prodigal_Son1
Guest
How’s the Pacific Northwest this time of year?Catholic are far from uniform in their beliefs, and I think you know that.
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Roman_Catholic_1
Guest
Underdog, with all due respect you are the one making it a big deal about people’s church affiliation and how they identify themselves with their church.Why is the so important to Roman Catholics. I can tell you the Holy Spirit is present during the worship service.
If you don’t want to say that’s fine I can respect that. I just don’t see why someone would keep something like that from anyone? But you must have your reasons.
Pax Tecum
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underdog
Guest
?How’s the Pacific Northwest this time of year?
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Prodigal_Son1
Guest
Did you come here for a honest discussion, or for the sake of besmirching Catholicism? I asked some simple questions and saying you think that I know, does not answer the questions.Catholic are far from uniform in their beliefs, and I think you know that.
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Prodigal_Son1
Guest
You know the Pacific Northwest, where you’re from. How’s the weather now?
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Prodigal_Son1
Guest
I’d bet money he’s “Reformed”, who used to say he was catholic, with the small c. Now he states he’s in the universal church.He has already answered this charged on another thread… Funny that you bring it up too.
Although I believe underdog stated that he was not a Protestant on the other thread.
God bless
He responds to my questions, which was my first post to “underdog”, with a picture of underdog.
Then he asks what’s my point rather than address the questions.
The same way Reformed used to post to me. I gave him a good run for his money in the Protestant vs. Catholic apologetic discussions. He played these type tricks and did anything but address points, or answer questions, brought up to him.
Finally he responds with:
This is the first discussion I’ve entered into with “underdog”, and he thinks that I know that. When I tried to discuss Protestantism and all the different denominations with different doctrines, with Reformed, his response was the diversity in Catholic beliefs instead of answering the questions or addressing the point I was driving at, and he logs when I mention the area “Reformed” was from…a little more than coincident, I’d say.Catholic are far from uniform in their beliefs, and I think you know that.
Reformed was banned 30 days prior to underdog starting an account. He spoke very ill of Catholicism. One of those who didn’t want to know what we believed, he felt he knew what we believed better than what we told him. He also crossed the line in respect to proseltizing Catholics. At least that what I saw him do.
:bluelite:…:bluelite:…:bluelite:
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underdog
Guest
I think people are willing to avoid the real issues by whatever means that they can. I think you guys are paranoid of this Reformed Character. What happend with him, did he reveal things about your beliefs that bothered you? It seems the people on this site think things are true simply because the Catholic Church tells you that is true. Well, the Muslims believe they have the truth too. According to the Catholic Church, the Muslims have truth too. Now, go figure that one out, especially if you understand the essentials of the Christian Faith.
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Genesis315
Guest
Love of God comes first, and love of His people (His Church) flows from that, as does love of all people.
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underdog
Guest
I think Catholics do not in general understand what God means by loving others. It is not an act of love to imply that Muslims and Jews can be saved apart from faith in Christ. The love Christians are commanded to show to others will result in persecution. If you share the true gospel, then it will have two strong reactions.Love of God comes first, and love of His people (His Church) flows from that, as does love of all people.
Triumph in Christ
12 When I came to Troas to preach the gospel of Christ, even though a door was opened for me in the Lord, 13 my spirit was not at rest because I did not find my brother Titus there. So I took leave of them and went on to Macedonia.
14 But thanks be to God, who in Christ always leads us in triumphal procession, and through us spreads the fragrance of the knowledge of him everywhere. 15 For we are the aroma of Christ to God among those who are being saved and among those who are perishing, 16 to one a fragrance from death to death, to the other a fragrance from life to life. Who is sufficient [1] for these things? 17 For we are not, like so many, peddlers of God’s word, but as men of sincerity, as commissioned by God, in the sight of God we speak in Christ.
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Genesis315
Guest
Almost every truth anyone knows, comes from being taught by someone else–we all assess the credibility of the person making the testimony, it’s not a random guess. The same goes with trusting the teaching handed down by the Catholic Church.It seems the people on this site think things are true simply because the Catholic Church tells you that is true.
Have you ever witnessed a court trial? The jury has determine what the truth is. They do this by listening to testimony and evaluating it based on the credibility of the witness and other factors. Even written evidence and physical evidence has to be authenticated by testimony.
Humans beings learn truth from other human beings–no one only believes information you gathered purely experientially. The Apostles witnessed the resurrection–if you didn’t have their testimony and that of Christians throughout the millenia who have handed on that information, you would never know of this fact. Humility demands we acknowledge this.
And so does your community or you as an individual. That’s why, as I said above, one needs to evaluate the claims and the credibility of the claimant.Well, the Muslims believe they have the truth too.
It’s really not that hard to figure out if you use a little common sense. Being wrong on one point, doesn’t make one wrong on every point automatically. If someone says 1+1=5, it doesn’t make them wrong when they say 2+2=4. Someone could be wrong on a million points, but if they’re right on one, they’re still right on that one.According to the Catholic Church, the Muslims have truth too. Now, go figure that one out, especially if you understand the essentials of the Christian Faith.
A Muslim can be correct in believing there is one God and Creator of all things and speak the truth in that regard while being wrong concerning when they assert a unitarian nature of that God.
Read Acts 17. St. Paul shows the pagans there where their own poets asserted the truth and even says he is preaching the God they already worshipped. He of course also corrects the errors in their community (others there were worshipping idols) and supplements the truth they did have with the fullness of the Gospel.
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underdog
Guest
Here is a very simple question. Do you believe the Muslims believe in the same Christ that the Catholic Church believes in?Almost every truth anyone knows, comes from being taught by someone else–we all assess the credibility of the person making the testimony, it’s not a random guess. The same goes with trusting the teaching handed down by the Catholic Church.
And so does your community or you as an individual. That’s why, as I said above, one needs to evaluate the claims and the credibility of the claimant.
It’s really not that hard to figure out if you use a little common sense. Being wrong on one point, doesn’t make one wrong on every point automatically. If someone says 1+1=5, it doesn’t make them wrong when they say 2+2=4. Someone could be wrong on a million points, but if they’re right on one, they’re still right on that one.
A Muslim can be correct in believing there is one God and Creator of all things and speak the truth in that regard while being wrong concerning when they assert a unitarian nature of that God.
Read Acts 17. St. Paul shows the pagans there where their own poets asserted the truth and even says he is preaching the God they already worshipped. He of course also corrects the errors in their community (others there were worshipping idols) and supplements the truth they did have with the fullness of the Gospel.
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chris_molter
Guest
My love for the Church (the Body of Christ) flows from my love of Christ Jesus. There is no dichotomy, no split. My love of God is the love of a creature to his creator, a son to his Father, a slave to his master, and a knight to his Lord. My love and honor of the Church flows from that since it is through the Church that I come to know and love God through the Gospel. My love for the Blessed Virgin Mary is as a lost (now found) child to his Mother, for if we are all adopted of God by virtue of Jesus’ humanity, we are all, then, Mary’s children as Christ’s humanity comes from her.
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Genesis315
Guest
I believe they are talking about the same Person, but believe many grave errors about Him. When the Pharisees in Christ’s time spoke of Jesus, for example, they were talking about the same person Peter was–they weren’t talking about some other person–even though Peter rightly believed He was the Christ, the Son of the Living God, while many Jews did not (as Muslims do not).Here is a very simple question. Do you believe the Muslims believe in the same Christ that the Catholic Church believes in?
This is just common sense. For another example two different historians may assert different conceptions of the same figure. Some say George Washingon was a virtuous and honorable man his whole life, etc. Others say he wasn’t so great, he practiced scalping and other war crimes, etc. The two historians are still talking about the same person, but with vastly different understandings of him (and where they conflicted, at most one could be correct, the other would be in error).
This is also different than the sense in which Christ says we must believe in Him. This does not refer to just believing He exists, but rather believing His doctrine, His promises, etc.
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underdog
Guest
1 John reveals that if we do not love our brothers who we can see, we cannot love God who we cannot see. We have passed from death to life if we love our brothers. According to the Apostle John, who are your brothers who have been adopted into the family of God? The problem with Catholics is your view of the church being exclusive and unbibilical (IMO). You will get a mixed bag of answers regarding views of who are actually united to Christ, and who are still children of the dark. I know it is impossble for anyone to judge the status of an individual. However, my question of who are your brothers is more theological in regards to individuals in groups such as Orthodox, Protestants, Mormons, JW, Muslims, Hindus, Jews, athesist, agnostics, etc. Again, I am asking the questions of who are you adopted brothers based on Roman Catholic theology.My love for the Church (the Body of Christ) flows from my love of Christ Jesus. There is no dichotomy, no split. My love of God is the love of a creature to his creator, a son to his Father, a slave to his master, and a knight to his Lord. My love and honor of the Church flows from that since it is through the Church that I come to know and love God through the Gospel. My love for the Blessed Virgin Mary is as a lost (now found) child to his Mother, for if we are all adopted of God by virtue of Jesus’ humanity, we are all, then, Mary’s children as Christ’s humanity comes from her.
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underdog
Guest
Spiritual discernment is never about common sense, but rather divine revelaton. Are you saying that Catholics and Muslims know the same Christ?I believe they are talking about the same Person, but believe many grave errors about Him. When the Pharisees in Christ’s time spoke of Jesus, for example, they were talking about the same person Peter was–they weren’t talking about some other person–even though Peter rightly believed He was the Christ, the Son of the Living God, while many Jews did not (as Muslims do not).
This is just common sense. For another example two different historians may assert different conceptions of the same figure. Some say George Washingon was a virtuous and honorable man his whole life, etc. Others say he wasn’t so great, he practiced scalping and other war crimes, etc. The two historians are still talking about the same person, but with vastly different understandings of him (and where they conflicted, at most one could be correct, the other would be in error).
This is also different than the sense in which Christ says we must believe in Him. This does not refer to just believing He exists, but rather believing His doctrine, His promises, etc.
2 Corinthians 11:4
4 For if someone comes and proclaims another Jesus than the one we proclaimed, or if you receive a different spirit from the one you received, or if you accept a different gospel from the one you accepted, you put up with it readily enough.
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Prodigal_Son1
Guest
Maybe you can help me out with my suspicious mind a bit then underdog. Where are you from?I think people are willing to avoid the real issues by whatever means that they can. I think you guys are paranoid of this Reformed Character. What happend with him, did he reveal things about your beliefs that bothered you? It seems the people on this site think things are true simply because the Catholic Church tells you that is true. Well, the Muslims believe they have the truth too. According to the Catholic Church, the Muslims have truth too. Now, go figure that one out, especially if you understand the essentials of the Christian Faith.
P
Prodigal_Son1
Guest
Underdog,I think people are willing to avoid the real issues by whatever means that they can.
You think people are willing to avoid the real issues by whatever means they can, yet you have failed to answer any question or address any point that I’ve brought up? Can you not see the contradiction in this?
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