Does Satan have our world under a strong spell?

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Yes, and it has already been presented.

Revelation 12:9 RSV
And the great dragon was thrown down, that ancient serpent, who is called the Devil and Satan, the deceiver of the whole world–he was thrown down to the earth, and his angels were thrown down with him.

(Please supply the reader with your interpretations of the above quote.)
-]Already provided/-]. Not required. Not only that, you have not justified how “deceiver” = “spell caster”.
How on earth can something be done completely outside the intellect (which includes the conscious parts of the superego, ego and id, as defined by Freud) and still be done out of free will? (Please explain.)
intellect /intˈi-lekt/
noun
The mind, in reference to its rational powers
The thinking principle
The intellect is one aspect of the human soul. It should be used to apprehend the truth. Because the original sin has darkened the intellect, it doesn’t always see the truth clearly. Another impact of original sin is that the will is weakened. None of these facts is due to a spell. These are wounds inflicted on human nature by the first sin. A sin consciously chosen with full knowledge of it being wrong.

Habits and addiction occur when the will fails to engage the intellect in the decision making. In other words, the will acts on the passions rather than the truth.
 
Experience! Personal revelation is the greatest form of evidence there is! Given the results of the poll, some form of this ‘experience’ seems to be common among many of us.
Too much confidence in personal revelation has produced thousands of Christian sects…
I never promised proof, but I still believe my quote from Revelations is strong evidence for the existence of a ‘strong spell.’ (Or a strong fantasy or a grand illusion, which I have never bothered to distinguish from each other. I like ‘strong spell’ because it more easily denotes Satan and the idea of our drifting in and out of it.) Always, but at varying degrees of intensity (of the spell).
“drifting in and out” of a strong spell seems very unrealistic.
For most people, I assume we cannot know, but that matters little for temptations can still be a reality given God provides a valid situation for us to reflect morality by whether or not there is eventual remorse.
So sorry, but I honestly do not know.
That’s largely correct, and I provided countless sources that warn against worldliness, but God still has the upper-hand over Satan.
I still contend that we are always under Satan’s spell within the world, but not always at full capacity within specific situations. My choice of language was relaxed.
“relaxed” gives the game away! It amounts to a concession that the spell, fantasy or grand illusion is nebulous - and far from strong. A convincing theory is far more precise…
 
I think you made the same stretch above with Thomas Aquinas as with “strong spell”. And “always” is indefensible. The degree of “strong spell” is a variable. Nothing conclusive there but some woeful examples to which are the Holy Spirit filled happy, happy, happy. Sisters and so forth. 🙂
 
Too much confidence in personal revelation has produced thousands of Christian sects…
This may very well be true, but be it as it may, this is what gave arise to my view. Certainly there are many personal revelations that did not result in heresy.
“drifting in and out” of a strong spell seems very unrealistic.
How so? Do we not drift in and out of sleep? I’m not suggesting in any way that we drift in and out completely like we do in sleep, but just to a given degree.
“relaxed” gives the game away! It amounts to a concession that the spell, fantasy or grand illusion is nebulous - and far from strong. A convincing theory is far more precise…
You focus far too much on semantics of half-fast text!

I’m not too interested in formulating a theory, but merely interested in conveying insight brought about through my revelation. This is not to say that I do not value a critical evaluation; such helps me in sharpening my arguments, and is much appreciated.

LOVE! 🙂
 
This may very well be true, but be it as it may, this is what gave arise to my view. Certainly there are many personal revelations that did not result in heresy.
Noted are the words “your view” and “gave arise to your view” not a good or bad but rather what it is. Many private revelations did not result in heresy, but the one’s which didn’t were guided by the Church.
 
Noted are the words “your view” and “gave arise to your view” not a good or bad but rather what it is. Many private revelations did not result in heresy, but the one’s which didn’t were guided by the Church.
On 6 December, 1273, he laid aside his pen and would write no more. That day he experienced an unusually long ecstasy during Mass; what was revealed to him we can only surmise from his reply to Father Reginald, who urged him to continue his writings: “I can do no more. Such secrets have been revealed to me that all I have written now appears to be of little value.”
-Saint Thomas Aquinas

Was St. Aquinas’ personal revelation guided by the Church? Source. How many personal revelations are there, not just with saints, but with the Church as a whole? Did they all result in heresy? How would you know?
 
On 6 December, 1273, he laid aside his pen and would write no more. That day he experienced an unusually long ecstasy during Mass; what was revealed to him we can only surmise from his reply to Father Reginald, who urged him to continue his writings: “I can do no more. Such secrets have been revealed to me that all I have written now appears to be of little value.”
-Saint Thomas Aquinas

Was St. Aquinas’ personal revelation guided by the Church? Source. How many personal revelations are there, not just with saints, but with the Church as a whole? Did they all result in heresy? How would you know?
His vocation was guided by the Church.

This is why they are Saints, they are understood in the entirety of their work. Never to be ripped out of context. To achieve this has many variables. Course now this requires a deep probe for supernatural in the realm of confirmed miracles. So what you are reading is approved by Christ’s Church. Many of the Saints had much personal interaction with the supernatural. Still we don’t read what we want into for example St Faustina, she is understood through the Church. And rightly so.

This also doesn’t mean that personal interaction with the supernatural doesn’t occur with many and in many ways. So on a personal level I don’t think its anything to disregard, but rather to carefully discern and with help through the Church.

I still don’t see “always” to get back to the point, or did you say you concede that point?🙂 Just want to check the progress. 😉
 
No.

satan has our world under a strong spell. But, he can’t do anything which God didn’t permitted. 🙂 [SIGN]God has cotrol over this world[/SIGN]
 
Here’s St. Thomas on the subject of diabolic temptation:

http://www.newadvent.org/summa/1114.htm

The word ‘spell’ suggests that there is some sort of occult power that he has apart from the ability to tempt people into co-operating with him. If you mean by “spell” a subterfuge, a ruse, a series of falsehoods, yes, there are a vast number of people who have acceded to these ruses and subterfuges, because they appeal to the pride and the sins that pride brings in its train.
 
His vocation was guided by the Church.
So, if I’m reading you right, only those in a religious vocation can have a valid personal revelation? My point is that we have countless numbers of laity, many of who may have had a private revelation of one sort or another that the Church is unaware of. I would also venture to say that most of us have had a private revelation, but not as profound as those you read about. The very fact of learning of God’s existence is likely to contain this type of revelation. Also, if I’'m reading you correctly, all these people should have been led to heresy based on your argument.
This is why they are Saints, they are understood in the entirety of their work. Never to be ripped out of context. To achieve this has many variables. Course now this requires a deep probe for supernatural in the realm of confirmed miracles. So what you are reading is approved by Christ’s Church. Many of the Saints had much personal interaction with the supernatural. Still we don’t read what we want into for example St Faustina, she is understood through the Church. And rightly so.
Have you concluded that I am not a saint? You cannot get into Heaven without being one. You seem to compartmentalize all the people that the Church has declared a saint and somehow holding them up on a pedestal by saying that they were somehow greater than all the ‘unknown’ saints.
This also doesn’t mean that personal interaction with the supernatural doesn’t occur with many and in many ways. So on a personal level I don’t think its anything to disregard, but rather to carefully discern and with help through the Church.
I contend that I was guided by the Holy Spirit, which I think would suffice instead of being guided by the Church. Can you perhaps evaluate the notion of being guided by the Holy Spirit or the Church?
I still don’t see “always” to get back to the point, or did you say you concede that point?🙂 Just want to check the progress. 😉
Are you talking about my contention that we are always under this spell, but at varying degrees of trance? Yes, I still adhere to it.
 
So, if I’m reading you right, only those in a religious vocation can have a valid personal revelation? My point is that we have countless numbers of laity, many of who may have had a private revelation of one sort or another that the Church is unaware of. I would also venture to say that most of us have had a private revelation, but not as profound as those you read about. The very fact of learning of God’s existence is likely to contain this type of revelation. Also, if I’'m reading you correctly, all these people should have been led to heresy based on your argument.

Have you concluded that I am not a saint? You cannot get into Heaven without being one. You seem to compartmentalize all the people that the Church has declared a saint and somehow holding them up on a pedestal by saying that they were somehow greater than all the ‘unknown’ saints.

I contend that I was guided by the Holy Spirit, which I think would suffice instead of being guided by the Church. Can you perhaps evaluate the notion of being guided by the Holy Spirit or the Church?

Are you talking about my contention that we are always under this spell, but at varying degrees of trance? Yes, I still adhere to it.
No one with humility would ever contend that they were being guided by the Holy Spirit instead of the Church; whenever saints have believed they were guided by God, they always offered the proviso that they awaited the judgment of the Church, because the judgment of the Church on heresy is the judgment of the Holy Spirit. If one judges by another spirit other than that of the Church, then the spirit they claim is guiding them is alien to the Church.
 
No one with humility would ever contend that they were being guided by the Holy Spirit instead of the Church; whenever saints have believed they were guided by God, they always offered the proviso that they awaited the judgment of the Church, because the judgment of the Church on heresy is the judgment of the Holy Spirit. If one judges by another spirit other than that of the Church, then the spirit they claim is guiding them is alien to the Church.
Sounds like you’re inferring that I’m not humble. Do you have a source for your claim that I highlighted?

Matthew 7:1 RSV
"Judge not, that you be not judged.
 
So, if I’m reading you right, only those in a religious vocation can have a valid personal revelation? My point is that we have countless numbers of laity, many of who may have had a private revelation of one sort or another that the Church is unaware of. I would also venture to say that most of us have had a private revelation, but not as profound as those you read about. The very fact of learning of God’s existence is likely to contain this type of revelation. Also, if I’'m reading you correctly, all these people should have been led to heresy based on your argument. .
Was St. Aquinas’ personal revelation guided by the Church? In his case he was in the Church with a clear vocation. No, that’s not exclusive. I understand your point, still an unknown as to discernment by the Church. And sure people encounter the supernatural. How profound or valid no doubt varies, Who reached Sainthood or who was considered a heretic is known. Who as you say the Church was unaware of, is still unknown.
Have you concluded that I am not a saint? You cannot get into Heaven without being one. You seem to compartmentalize all the people that the Church has declared a saint and somehow holding them up on a pedestal by saying that they were somehow greater than all the ‘unknown’ saints…
No your not a Saint, there are no Saints till the particular judgment. Doesn’t mean you can’t be a Saint, good place to discern is Christ’s Church. We don’t “know” the unknown Saints. We do know of unknown martyrs who are Saints, and there’s many.

You can pray to be a Saint, but I suspect the trials will be much.
I contend that I was guided by the Holy Spirit, which I think would suffice instead of being guided by the Church. Can you perhaps evaluate the notion of being guided by the Holy Spirit or the Church?.
Sure I could, they are one of the same, while its true the Holy Spirit touches many who call the Lords name, So too they are called to His Church. The truth illuminates the truth always. What is unknown is still unknown elsewhere. Are you saying your an unknown Saint the Church is unaware of?
Are you talking about my contention that we are always under this spell, but at varying degrees of trance? Yes, I still adhere to it.
Can’t be and for the very reason you claim above, Saints, the particular judgment. Death was nailed to the Cross, communion is offered to man again. Aside from God, Mary was the first resurrected to indicate an example, Sanctifying Grace is Gods Love… no chains and strong spells “always”. Communion for the pilgrims, the bread of life.
 
Was St. Aquinas’ personal revelation guided by the Church? In his case he was in the Church with a clear vocation. No, that’s not exclusive. I understand your point, still an unknown as to discernment by the Church. And sure people encounter the supernatural. How profound or valid no doubt varies, Who reached Sainthood or who was considered a heretic is known. Who as you say the Church was unaware of, is still unknown.

No your not a Saint, there are no Saints till the particular judgment. Doesn’t mean you can’t be a Saint, good place to discern is Christ’s Church. We don’t “know” the unknown Saints. We do know of unknown martyrs who are Saints, and there’s many.

You can pray to be a Saint, but I suspect the trials will be much.

Sure I could, they are one of the same, while its true the Holy Spirit touches many who call the Lords name, So too they are called to His Church. The truth illuminates the truth always. What is unknown is still unknown elsewhere. Are you saying your an unknown Saint the Church is unaware of?

Can’t be and for the very reason you claim above, Saints, the particular judgment. Death was nailed to the Cross, communion is offered to man again. Aside from God, Mary was the first resurrected to indicate an example, Sanctifying Grace is Gods Love… no chains and strong spells “always”. Communion for the pilgrims, the bread of life.
I guess we can argue throughout eternity and neither of us prove anything. Most of my profound experiences happened while I was pretending to be a contemplative; much of my spirituality dwindled when I started contributing to CAF.

The ‘spell’ is something that I can clearly ‘see.’ How, I do not know.

If there is something else I would like to share, it’s the wisdom and deep spiritual growth that can be had from meditating on The Imitation of Christ. Nowhere does Thomas a Kempis mention a ‘spell,’ but after meditation on his writings for a while, one naturally ‘sees’ it.

Beware of ‘intellectuals!’ who inadvertently believe they can grow closer to God through the intellect. Intellectualism is the booby-prize of religious life.

The Imitation of Christ
Thomas à Kempis

BOOK 1

CHAPTER 2 – On Personal Humility
Code:
EVERYONE naturally desires knowledge, but of what use is knowledge itself without the fear of God? A humble countryman who serves God is more pleasing to Him than a conceited intellectual who knows the course of the stars, but neglects his own soul. A man who truly knows himself realizes his own worthlessness, and takes no pleasure in the praises of men. Did I possess all knowledge in the world, but had no love, how would this help me before God, who will judge me by my deeds? 

Restrain an inordinate desire for knowledge, in which is found much anxiety and deception. Learned men always wish to appear so, and desire recognition of their wisdom. But there are many matters, knowledge of which brings little or no advantage to the soul. Indeed, a man is unwise if he occupies himself with any things save those that further his salvation. A spate of words does nothing to satisfy the soul, but a good life refreshes the mind, and a clean conscience brings great confidence in God. 

The more complete and excellent your knowledge, the more severe will be God's judgement on you, unless your life be the more holy. Therefore, do not be conceited of any skill or knowledge you may possess, but respect the knowledge that is entrusted to you. If it seems to you that you know a great deal and have wide experience in many fields, yet remember that there are many matters of which you are ignorant. So do not be conceited, but confess your ignorance. Why do you wish to esteem yourself above others, when there are many who are wiser and more perfect in the Law of God? If you desire to know or learn anything to your advantage, then take delight in being unknown and unregarded. 

A true understanding and humble estimate of oneself is the highest and most valuable of all lessons. To take no account of oneself, but always to think well and highly of others is the highest wisdom and perfection. Should you see another person openly doing evil, or carrying out a wicked purpose, do not on that account consider yourself better than him, for you cannot tell how long you will remain in a state of grace. We are all frail; consider none more frail than yourself.
 
Too much confidence in personal revelation has produced thousands of Christian sects…
Then you admit you may be mistaken…
“drifting in and out” of a strong spell seems very unrealistic.
How so? Do we not drift in and out of sleep? I’m not suggesting in any way that we drift in and out completely like we do in sleep, but just to a given degree.

There is a vast difference between being asleep - which is natural - and being under a spell - which is supernatural.
“relaxed” gives the game away! It amounts to a concession that the spell, fantasy or grand illusion is nebulous - and far from strong. A convincing theory is far more precise…
You focus far too much on semantics of half-fast text!

I take what a person writes at its face value. Precision is very important when it comes to our view of reality. It makes a big difference to our moral responsibility if we are all under a spell.
I’m not too interested in formulating a theory, but merely interested in conveying insight brought about through my revelation. This is not to say that I do not value a critical evaluation; such helps me in sharpening my arguments, and is much appreciated.
And I appreciate your sincerity, Robert, but I don’t want you to overestimate Satan’s influence on us at the expense of God’s grace…
 
I’m not too interested in formulating a theory, but merely interested in conveying insight brought about through my revelation. This is not to say that I do not value a critical evaluation; such helps me in sharpening my arguments, and is much appreciated.
And I appreciate your sincerity, Robert, but I don’t want you to overestimate Satan’s influence on us at the expense of God’s grace…

(I exceeded the time limit for editing)

… or to underestimate the effects of original sin. There is no doubt about the horrific reality of diabolical evil in the world but I believe the vast majority of us are weak and ignorant rather than malicious and possessed. In fact your use of the word “illusion” is closer to the truth than “spell” because surely Satan wouldn’t be permitted to dominate the world to such an extent that his influence overcomes the power of the Cross, makes Hell much closer to us than Heaven and casts a dark shadow over our life on earth so that hope and joy are replaced by fear and - in some cases - despair. That is why it is important to emphasize the **Good **News brought to us by Our Lord…
 
Then you admit you may be mistaken…
I ‘see’ what I ‘see.’ There is nothing more to add to that perspective, so, no, there’s nothing to be mistaken about. But I guess you could twist things by getting me to admit that I have no reason to believe that I even exist, in which case I would have to say that I could easily be mistaken about a lot of things. It comes down to my having to know from what perspective you are viewing things.
There is a vast difference between being asleep - which is natural - and being under a spell - which is supernatural.
Yes, obviously a big difference, but the fact that we can slip in and out of consciousness when sleeping can add profound insight into what may be easily possible when under a ‘spell.’
I take what a person writes at its face value. Precision is very important when it comes to our view of reality. It makes a big difference to our moral responsibility if we are all under a spell.
My writing and communication skills are limited, and so I can’t promise too much. 🙂
And I appreciate your sincerity, Robert, but I don’t want you to overestimate Satan’s influence on us at the expense of God’s grace…
Thanks!

It seems to me that a lot of people underestimate Satan’s presence in this world. I think I can see where our entire mind is being constantly projected onto us, through external spirits. Free will would still be present, but our entire mind would be an illusion. Yeah, this is what I ‘see.’
 
Most of my profound experiences happened while I was pretending to be a contemplative; much of my spirituality dwindled when I started contributing to CAF.
Your experiences occurred when you were seeking God. And intercession works exactly this way. And much to souls unsuspecting surprise the first time.

Balance of the spiritual is always an issue here and for many. Your responsible for that. Doctrine doesn’t overshadow the spiritual unless you allow it to. The Doctrine confirms the spiritual
The ‘spell’ is something that I can clearly ‘see.’ How, I do not know.
Why do you believe what you see is universal and not a personal trial? What do you mean by “see”. You mean see, as in understand though knowledge?
the wisdom and deep spiritual growth that can be had from meditating on The Imitation of Christ. Nowhere does Thomas a Kempis mention a ‘spell,’ but after meditation on his writings for a while, one naturally ‘sees’ it.
Its a known “fact” in the Church …Lex orandi, lex credenda. And “yes” when you receive grace you became responsible for it.

You are reading “then” visualizing and then relating through your experience and placing it into context? Its transference to some degree, your experience is “unresolved” and in this his thinking becomes interactive with your experience. Also the mind omits trauma as if it never happened to protect itself.
Beware of ‘intellectuals!’ who inadvertently believe they can grow closer to God through the intellect. Intellectualism is the booby-prize of religious life.
True, however spiritual pride is common also. Especially with those who first encounter the supernatural. Nor hard to see people filled with the holy spirit. You see it here daily. The fire dwindles when its not fed.

There’s a completely different responsibility with the Church, clearly understand this.
A man who truly knows himself realizes his own worthlessness, and takes no pleasure in the praises of men. Did I possess all knowledge in the world, but had no love, how would this help me before God, who will judge me by my deeds?.
Your interaction with souls “all of them” you are responsible for. Everyone in your family past, all friends of the past, and all interaction in the present and future. That’s what the “general judgment” is. You can intercede for all of them now. That’s how the communion of Saints is continued. Not because each individual has a calling from the lord. But because all who do send up their redeemable suffering and prayer for the sake of others, they intercede through the Lord, and in person when possible
an inordinate desire for knowledge, in which is found much anxiety and deception. Learned men always wish to appear so, and desire recognition of their wisdom. But there are many matters, knowledge of which brings little or no advantage to the soul. Indeed, a man is unwise if he occupies himself with any things save those that further his salvation…
.
Anxiety and deception may be part of the transference and/or the attempt to fully comprehend. And “is” the point and issue with for example the OP “strong spell”
Code:
The more complete and excellent your knowledge, the more severe will be God's judgement on you, unless your life be the more holy..
And you should take this literally, your responsible for the knowledge and to the Church. You were not blessed to be Gods nomad prophet speaking contrary to all Gods prophets and Saints…“Church”.
Code:
A true understanding and humble estimate of oneself is the highest and most valuable of all lessons. To take no account of oneself, but always to think well and highly of others is the highest wisdom and perfection. Should you see another person openly doing evil, or carrying out a wicked purpose, do not on that account consider yourself better than him, for you cannot tell how long you will remain in a state of grace
This occurs because through the supernatural you see just how pitiful and wicked you are. And there reside’s your responsibility again…state of Grace. And you will know when your not in it and should be.

Being in a state of Grace and communication with the Lord are two different understandings. You can communicate and be communicated to by the Lord, and not be in a state of Grace. But its imperative you seek a state of Grace for all the reasons mentioned above once communication occurs. Humility and magnified responsibility become an absolute necessity. And a step forward with two back sometimes. Its a blessing and a trial.

Church is imperative, you will come to know the blessing if you walk through the trial.

Read the Saints, there is no one who can help you more, go to church and chase Grace as disheartening as it may be at times to catch. Continue to chase. Ask for a Spiritual director, and if you ask around where you are for recommendations you’ll find the one you need. A Catholic therapist of psychologist never hurts and its not a weakness to seek understanding of yourself. Fact is others at times see things clearer than we do. Its a truth that if you do not acknowledge will automatically work against you. …“humility”…“servant” descend, prayer, Church, Eucharist. Make it a “habit”.

There’s a difference in responsibility to “know” and to “believe” which brings strong conviction. Don’t allow your mind to doubt and diminish, which is a tool of evil, take the responsibility to heart. “Church”. I can’t imagine anything more alarming than to rationalize away a blessing in a counter path to sanctifying grace.
 
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