Yes.
No. He was allowed to tempt him. He was not collaborating. If he was, he would not have inflicted the evil on Job that he did.
I believe your belief is unfounded and is a denial of the gift of free will. We cannot “unwittingly give in to sex.” Giving in to temptation is an exercise of the will. We are given sufficient grace to resist all temptation, no matter how great or how long lasting.
??? From the dialog, it sounds to me that God and Satan carried out a joint plot to test Job–both participated in Job’s ordeal.
You have not even mentioned most of the points in my posts, let alone interpreted them!
Ironic considering that you have ignored almost all my statements.
Love and being under Satan’s spell are incompatible.LOVE!
You are confusing redemption with salvation. Jesus has not failed and never will. Your negativity once again rears its ugly head…
Do you really believe God collaborates with Satan?
Satan has always been in this world… That won’t change. We are, historically speaking, at a major high point… with poverty continuing to decline, no world wars, violence on the decline… Don’t be a doom and gloomer…God loves you!
We live in a world of good and evil (not good versus evil). You tend to downplay the evil, as if this life was rosy. We, like Job, are loved by God, but tormented and deceived by Satan. The spell we’re under is not to negate the love of God! It’s all within God’s will for our salvation.
He has not done this. Why do you think so?
We are not under a spell unless we has chosen the slavery of sin instead of the love of God and neighbor.
Evil works against our salvation.
This may be your state. But I will claim that I am observing a reality that in neither grand nor an illusion.
The control people must be under is self-control, personal mastery. Conquer evil with good. Grace abounds to this end.LOVE!
Ah, I recognize what’s being expressed here. Is this a refinement of the discussion of the “Open your eyes, see the lies in front of you” thread?
We live in a world of good and evil (not good versus evil). You tend to downplay the evil, as if this life was rosy. We, like Job, are loved by God, but tormented and deceived by Satan. The spell we’re under is not to negate the love of God! It’s all within God’s will for our salvation.
Tony, look at the great advances and population explosion that took place in the past 150 years or so. Could this possibly have happened by mere chance, or is there somebody who guides our world? It’s ridiculous to think that it could have happened on its own, with our puny innate wit. Good and evil are working together to bring the human race to salvation. Central to the task at hand is a grand illusion with us wandering around in a trance-like states. Contrary to what the idealist would want to think, people need to be under control while living in this rapidly changing world. In comes Satan.
LOVE!
Frustration is certainly a dominant feature of hell because Satan’s excessive ambition and lust for power are never satisfied. The more he has the more he wants yet there is obviously a limit to what he can get because he is not omnipotent.
Thank you for bringing in this additional context.
People will hold on to their naive beliefs as much as possible to reduce strong cognitive dissonance.
Not true! The world in which we live is under the spell of Satan.
No, not always. Was Job’s salvation hampered by his torment by Satan?
How do you know this? Did you somehow test it?
Yes, we can sometimes fight evil with good, but what we commonly call reality is really just an illusion. Again, we live in a world of good and evil, and they often work together for the good of our salvation. We need to get the ever so popular notion that we live in a world of good versus evil out of our minds. In Judaism, it is believed that Satan serves God’s purpose.
Are you denying the assertion that Satan is full of lies which flood our world? People live this life in great denial!
I was asking a question. I have not said anything of the truth value of any assertions.
Do you know of a single corporation or business that runs itself? How absurd! Now, how much more absurd would it be that our extremely complex world runs by itself? Is our world guided and controlled in secret by humans? Somewhat, yes, but certainly not fully given our puny innate wit! Is it God? Now we’re getting somewhere, but we are stuck with a big problem because we believe that God is all loving, yet evil exists in our world. How about God and Satan, in collaboration, which is what is taught in Judaism? YES!!!
Because our world contains good and evil. If Satan worked against God, how absurd that an all powerful God would allow that. And to think that we live in a world of good versus evil, we are in severe error with the Church’s teachings; a world of good versus evil implies two gods in opposition to each other, but we believe in one Divine God! The only alternative explanation would be to view the world with Satan serving the purpose of God!
Unwittingly, yes sometimes, as do we all. (Perhaps even in my writing this!)
Do you believe that a person can sell their soul to Satan, and thus work for him? I believe we all unwittingly sell our souls to Satan at one point or another during our life.
If Satan serves G-d, how does Satan also oppose G-d? Are you saying that G-d uses evil in the person of Satan to cast the world under the latter’s spell, which in turn eventually leads to its redemption? This is contrary to both Catholic and Jewish belief although in different ways. Whatever your philosophy is, Robert, it is not orthodox (which is fine with me), just so you realize.I should have stated that Satan serves God in all the places where I said Satan collaborates with God. I should also say that I believe Satan and God oppose each other, but only in the sense that God is good and Satan is *evil. *
LOVE!