Don't Hate Me. I Am Going To A SSPX This Sunday

[Your_Abbott]

Hmmm…let’s see now…if I am to CITE a source that IS NOTHING MORE THAN A MOUTHPIECE OF THE VATICAN… well then, what would be the point of that? How else are we to expose the errors if not by citing opposing sources, or outfits that fight for the traditions of our faith, such as tradition in action? What would you have me cite? “Father Flapdoodle’s lesson on the beauty of the Novus Ordo, altar boy girls, communion in the hand, and Eucharistic ministeresses”?

I had to check your profile. I thought you were some sort of anti-Catholic…what venom! What has the Church done to you? What rudeness and disrespect. Maybe we can get Barak’s minister in here to say "God d… the Catholic Church! It certainly would go along with your comments.

Maybe you are one of those Sede people, or SSPX, who think that the Catholic church is some sort of sect. Is that what you think?

 

[Littlemouse]

How about you site some source and not from Tradition in Action or such outfits not in communion with the Vatican.

Here are just a few:

“Without this faith, no one can enter Heaven.” Saint Thomas Aquinas

“And he said to them: Go ye into the whole world, and preach the gospel to every creature. He that believeth and is baptized, shall be saved: but he that believeth not shall be condemned.” Mark 16:15-16

“He who will not willingly and humbly enter the gate of the Church will certainly be damned and enter the gate of hell whether he wants to or not.” … “Without this confession, without this faith, no one can enter the kingdom of God.” Saint Bede the Venerable O.S.B., Doctor

“By divine mandate the interpreter and guardian of the Scriptures, and the depository of Sacred Tradition living within her, the Church alone is the entrance to salvation: She alone, by herself, and under the protection and guidance of the Holy Spirit, is the source of truth.” Pope Pius XII

“If you die as an unbeliever, you will be damned and lost.” St. John Bosco

“Can we be saved in every religion? No, we can be saved only in the religion that Jesus Christ has taught. Where do we find this religion of Jesus Christ? We find it in the Roman Catholic Church.” St. John Neumann (died 1860)

“My children, why are there no Sacraments in other religions? Because there is no salvation there! We have the Sacraments at our disposal because we belong to the religion of salvation.” Saint John Marie Vianney (died 1859)

“Let no man deceive himself. Unless he believes that Christ Jesus has lived in the flesh, and shall confess His cross and passion, and the blood which He shed for the salvation of the world, he shall not attain eternal life, whether he be a king, or a priest, or a ruler, or a private person, a master or a servant, a man or a woman.” Saint Ignatius of Antioch

“All who do not confess Christ to be true God shall go into eternal fire.” Saint Martial of Limoges (died A.D. 165)

“We know that salvation belongs to the Church alone, and that no one can partake of Christ nor be saved outside the Catholic Church and the Catholic Faith.” Saint John Chrysostom, Doctor, (died A.D. 407)

 

[Your_Abbott]

How can one sit blindly by as the pope promotes ecumenism and boldly defies this perennial church teaching?

Maybe you think the pope is a heretic. Call on Robert Bellarmine.

 

[Littlemouse]

Maybe you think the pope is a heretic. Call on Robert Bellarmine.

Maybe you like chocolate ice cream, maybe you don’t! Maybe you drive a black car. Maybe you like President Bush. Maybe you think the earth is flat. Maybe you believe in global warming. While you’re busy maybe-ing yourself into next Tuesday, think about the fact that the Pope DOES promote ecumenism (not MAYBE).

 

[Eilish_Maura]

Now how does all this carry-on about the heresy B16 espouses have anything to with rejecting the OF of the Mass - to the point where it is seen as totally OK to go to an SSPX Mass to avoid it?

 

[bear06]

Maybe you like chocolate ice cream, maybe you don’t! Maybe you drive a black car. Maybe you like President Bush. Maybe you think the earth is flat. Maybe you believe in global warming. While you’re busy maybe-ing yourself into next Tuesday, think about the fact that the Pope DOES promote ecumenism (not MAYBE).

Uh, I’d just like to point out that the Church has always promoted ecumenism.

 

[MrS]

I did not make the outrageous claim that the OF was accepted under false pretenses - I don’t have a thing to prove so keep your ‘challenge’.

What documented proof is there for any claim that the OF was accepted under false pretenses?

Silly… of course there would not be “documented proof” for this claim. If there was, it would make it easy to show that we have had 40 years of ambiguity after VATII.

That is why I asked you to show any support from VatII for the NO Mass as it is too often celebrated today.

As to the false pretenses, I offer you a challange EM… one I know you will not answer on other threads concerning the NO: Find a reference of mention in all of the VATII documents which describes the NO Mass. Then compare it to what you seem to approve of as the NO Mass we most often see today. Specifics would be nice, for a change.

Guess I was right about you again. You seem to have no substance for the opinions you post, which is fine. They are only that, opinions. But you do make a strong case for those whom you agree with.

 

[Like]

Hmmm…let’s see now…if I am to CITE a source that IS NOTHING MORE THAN A MOUTHPIECE OF THE VATICAN… well then, what would be the point of that? How else are we to expose the errors if not by citing opposing sources, or outfits that fight for the traditions of our faith, such as tradition in action? What would you have me cite? "Father Flapdoodle’s lesson on the beauty of the Novus Ordo, altar boy girls, communion in the hand, and Eucharistic

There is no hope for you

I had to check your profile. I thought you were some sort of anti-Catholic…what venom! What has the Church done to you? What rudeness and disrespect. Maybe we can get Barak’s minister in here to say "God d… the Catholic Church! It certainly would go along with your comments.

Maybe you are one of those Sede people, or SSPX, who think that the Catholic church is some sort of sect. Is that what you think?

Worse:thumbsup:

 

[Aramis]

The Pope excommunicated 5 members of the SSPX. 5.

The Calvinists and Lutherans are schismatic heretics. Cardinal Hoyos has said that the SSPX are neither. Forgive me for deferring my judgement to a Cardinal who deal directly with the SSPX and not to you.

And the same pope, in the same paragraph, suspended the rest of the society.

Hoyos has been wrong before, not likely to be the last time. Hoyos also has an agenda to put forward as well; their return to Catholicity. If he doesn’t… he’s not doing his job.

 

[Like]

Here are just a few:

“Without this faith, no one can enter Heaven.” Saint Thomas Aquinas

“And he said to them: Go ye into the whole world, and preach the gospel to every creature. He that believeth and is baptized, shall be saved: but he that believeth not shall be condemned.” Mark 16:15-16

You misunderstood what I was asking of her. She is claiming that JP II and B XVI have/are teaching one need not be in the Church to be saved, & I am asking her for documentation from a source in communion with Rome.
I hope this helps.

 

[Derbingo]

:

I love your logic. Very compelling. You convince me for sure. I don’t really need any reasoning. I run on emotions and passions. Keep up the good work. Maybe your little icons have one for : “diss like”

 

[Derbingo]

Silly… of course there would not be “documented proof” for this claim. If there was, it would make it easy to show that we have had 40 years of ambiguity after VATII.
.

I don’t know. I never experienced any ambiguity after Vat 2.

I did however after coming on this site and was exposed to these SSPX people, who think that the Church is a schismatic sect. They believe that they are the true Church and the rest of us have fallen over the edge.

What a load.

 

[Derbingo]

Again, the canon lawyer who defended the Hawaii Six disagrees with the sedevacantist website traditio.com He says that those excommunicatiedin Lincoln cannot be defended by the overturning of the Hawaii Six excommunicaitons (and remember, this is the guy who defended them).

catholicculture.org/library/view.cfm?recnum=2864

I thought SV was verboten here? We have trouble enough not promoting SSPX, but SV’s?

With all that Robert Bellarmine nonsense. They are totally off the wall.

 

[palmas85]

Seeing the Mass in Latin will give only one signal, how foreign the Church is. Who are you convincing by speaking of the Unity of the Church if the American Catholics hear mass in a strange tongue.

How would it be if the Congress of the United States started hearings in Hungarian?

Those watching this Mass will be Americans. Our language is English, and I am sure the Pope will be proud to show off his ability in our native tongue.

Saying it in Latin here will turn back the liturgical movement in the U.S. by a hundred years.

Why do you think that? The United States is a multi cultural, multi racial and multi lingual country. Depending in what area you are in it could reasonably be argued that Spanish is the more common language of the majority of the people.

The entire Mass would not be said in Latin in any event, so I really don’t understand your somewhat hysterical claim that the liturgical movement, whatever that is, would be turned back a hundred years

 

[Cat]

I realize that it’s too late now and the Sunday has passed, but perhaps this will apply for next time.

I’ve skimmed through this entire thread and have not seen my response, so I trust I’m not repeating what someone else said.

Skip the concert.

There is no obligation to go to a concert, even if the concert is a kids’ concert that your family is looking forward to.

It seems to me that the big issue in this thread is not which Mass shall I attend, but rather, how can I conveniently squeeze Mass into my busy life?

Shouldn’t we be squeezing our busy life into Mass instead?

It’s too late now, but for next time, tell the family, “Sorry, nothing will get in the way of Holy Mass. Not even a one-time only family activity, because Mass is a family activity.”

I live near Chicago, and if the concert was something of national level (e.g., the Sesame Street tour), I’m guessing that the same kids’ concert would have been held in Rockford, Milwaukee, or Peoria, or possibly up in Michigan in Grand Rapids, or maybe down in Indianapolis, at a time that wouldn’t interfere with your Mass. None of these places is more than four hours from Chicago. Wouldn’t the drive have been worth it, to fulfil your obligation to the Lord and keep your conscience completely clear? What a testimony to your family about the importance of the Mass and also the important of your children, that you are willing to give up a day and gas for their interests!

 

[Eilish_Maura]

Silly… of course there would not be “documented proof” for this claim. If there was, it would make it easy to show that we have had 40 years of ambiguity after VATII.

That is why I asked you to show any support from VatII for the NO Mass as it is too often celebrated today.

As to the false pretenses, I offer you a challange EM… one I know you will not answer on other threads concerning the NO: Find a reference of mention in all of the VATII documents which describes the NO Mass. Then compare it to what you seem to approve of as the NO Mass we most often see today. Specifics would be nice, for a change.

Guess I was right about you again. You seem to have no substance for the opinions you post, which is fine. They are only that, opinions. But you do make a strong case for those whom you agree with.

Cut the nonsense – you know the rule of law here is the one who makes the outrageous claim has the burden of proof.

What fraud was committed on the members of the Church to get the OF in place of the TLM? Who lied?

Or is it just your opinion and that of your favorite conspiracy groups?

 

[bear06]

I thought SV was verboten here? We have trouble enough not promoting SSPX, but SV’s?

With all that Robert Bellarmine nonsense. They are totally off the wall.

Jo’s instructions were very clear. They’re not to be promoted as in “you should go here it’s great”. Nobody said that the mere mention of their name nor articles from them couldn’t be posted. Now, if they’d like to install that rule, whoo hoo but they haven’t. It’s a discussion board. It’s not a place, no matter how nice it would be, where we must all agree.

 

[piouswoman]

I had to check your profile. I thought you were some sort of anti-Catholic…what venom! What has the Church done to you? What rudeness and disrespect. Maybe we can get Barak’s minister in here to say "God d… the Catholic Church! It certainly would go along with your comments.

Maybe you are one of those Sede people, or SSPX, who think that the Catholic church is some sort of sect. Is that what you think?

Yea…sometimes the truth really hurts doesn’t it? Sorry, but after forty years of destruction, seeing the church where I was baptized, made first Communion, was confirmed, educated (or rather poorly catechized) in, married in, raised my family in, it just makes me a bit jaded to have to watch the abuses and destruction occur right in front of my very eyes, and not only that, I had to witness all but ONE sister of my family leave the faith, abandon their religion and who now have **no concept **of what it is to truly be a Catholic.

So go ahead and throw out your accusations at me, I am strong in my TRADITIONAL CATHOLIC FAITH, and nothing will sway me from the TRUTH. I had to RE-EDUCATE myself in my faith, and start literally from the beginning to get it back.

So don’t check my profile, rather, check your own. We are the CHURCH MILITANT…we have to fight for our faith and traditions, not sit idly by with stars in our eyes, following what is CONTRARY TO THE ROMAN CATHOLIC FAITH, while those in the church hierarchy are teaching ERROR. If you know your faith, you will know this truth.

Remember, Christ said: “Do not think that I came to bring peace on the earth; I came not to bring peace, but a sword…”

 

[Your_Abbott]

Maybe you like chocolate ice cream, maybe you don’t! Maybe you drive a black car. Maybe you like President Bush. Maybe you think the earth is flat. Maybe you believe in global warming. While you’re busy maybe-ing yourself into next Tuesday, think about the fact that the Pope DOES promote ecumenism (not MAYBE).

I do believe that the Pope promotes ecumenism. I am all for it, and applaud it. “That they all may be one”

Did you believe I didn’t? If you believed I didn’t, then you were wrong.

 

[Your_Abbott]

Yea…sometimes the truth really hurts doesn’t it? Sorry, but after forty years of destruction, seeing the church where I was baptized, made first Communion, was confirmed, educated (or rather poorly catechized) in, married in, raised my family in, it just makes me a bit jaded to have to watch the abuses and destruction occur right in front of my very eyes, and not only that, I had to witness all but ONE sister of my family leave the faith, abandon their religion and who now have **no concept **of what it is to truly be a Catholic.

So go ahead and throw out your accusations at me, I am strong in my TRADITIONAL CATHOLIC FAITH, and nothing will sway me from the TRUTH. I had to RE-EDUCATE myself in my faith, and start literally from the beginning to get it back.

So don’t check my profile, rather, check your own. We are the CHURCH MILITANT…we have to fight for our faith and traditions, not sit idly by with stars in our eyes, following what is CONTRARY TO THE ROMAN CATHOLIC FAITH, while those in the church hierarchy are teaching ERROR. If you know your faith, you will know this truth.

Remember, Christ said: “Do not think that I came to bring peace on the earth; I came not to bring peace, but a sword…”

Good for you. I hope you support the Vicar of Christ on earth, and the efforts of the Popes to promote ecumenism at the Second Vatican Council, and revive the liturgy.

That is orthodoxy. Now if that is where you are, I applaud your efforts. If not, I pray you get with the program.