Early islamic historians, how important are they to muslims?

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hasantas said:
Yes. First light and soul of Muhammad were created among prophets and first it was written " la ilaha illallah muhammadur rasulullah".
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So there is no real tangible evidence that muhammad came before Adam?

From my understanding muhammad at the age of 40 had the quran dictated to him by Gabriel. Why are 40 plus years you knew nothing of your existence before hand?

It seems to be a problem with hadiths is that muslims can accept or deny its authenticity depending on whether it will benefit them or not. When a certain hadith suits them it is considered to be authentic and when it does not, they say it is not authentic. The same hadith can be authentic and unauthentic depending on situations.

The hadith contradicts the Quran 18:110 “Say [O Prophet]: “I am but a mortal man like all of you.”
 
JimmyDFG said:
So there is no real tangible evidence that muhammad came before Adam?

From my understanding muhammad at the age of 40 had the quran dictated to him by Gabriel. Why are 40 plus years you knew nothing of your existence before hand?

It seems to be a problem with hadiths is that muslims can accept or deny its authenticity depending on whether it will benefit them or not. When a certain hadith suits them it is considered to be authentic and when it does not, they say it is not authentic. The same hadith can be authentic and unauthentic depending on situations.

The hadith contradicts the Quran 18:110 “Say [O Prophet]: “I am but a mortal man like all of you.”
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There would be as Much Evidence of this, as there is Evidence that Christ is the First and the Last.

Regards Tony
 
TonyBS said:
There would be as Much Evidence of this, as there is Evidence that Christ is the First and the Last.

Regards Tony
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Where is evidence of Christ first and last in early Islamic history?

What does first and last mean in Islam?

MJ
 
TonyBS said:
There would be as Much Evidence of this, as there is Evidence that Christ is the First and the Last.

Regards Tony
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Quran 18:110 “Say [O Prophet]: “I am but a mortal man like all of you.”
 
JimmyDFG said:
Quran 18:110 “Say [O Prophet]: “I am but a mortal man like all of you.”
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This is a reference to Prophet Muhammad’s human nature.

As we have mentioned numerous times, each Manifestation of God (that includes Muhammad btw) has a two-fold nature, a human and a Divine. The Divine nature allegorically “descends” upon the human nature at some point and the Word is born and revealed.

Jesus had the exact same thing happen to Him when the dove descended.

There is plenty of evidence that the Manifestation of God is fully aware of His Divine nature very early (long before a dove, or Angel Gabriel, or the Maid of heaven descends) however, this Word which is to be revealed is withheld until the exact moment in history that complies with Divine Will.

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Servant19 said:
This is a reference to Prophet Muhammad’s human nature.

As we have mentioned numerous times, each Manifestation of God (that includes Muhammad btw) has a two-fold nature, a human and a Divine. The Divine nature allegorically “descends” upon the human nature at some point and the Word is born and revealed.

Jesus had the exact same thing happen to Him when the dove descended.

There is plenty of evidence that the Manifestation of God is fully aware of His Divine nature very early (long before a dove, or Angel Gabriel, or the Maid of heaven descends) however, this Word which is to be revealed is withheld until the exact moment in history that complies with Divine Will.

.
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Either your mortal or your not, Baha’is has invented a new class of human beings.
 
Techno2000 said:
Either your mortal or your not, Baha’is has invented a new class of human beings.
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Not at all.

What happens to you when you die? Is it all black and no consciousness for eternity?
When someone witnesses the Beatific Vision, are they dead?
.
 
Servant19 said:
This is a reference to Prophet Muhammad’s human nature.

As we have mentioned numerous times, each Manifestation of God (that includes Muhammad btw) has a two-fold nature, a** human and a Divine**. The Divine nature allegorically “descends” upon the human nature at some point and the Word is born and revealed.

Jesus had the exact same thing happen to Him when the dove descended.

There is plenty of evidence that the Manifestation of God is fully aware of His Divine nature very early (long before a dove, or Angel Gabriel, or the Maid of heaven descends) however, this Word which is to be revealed is withheld until the exact moment in history that complies with Divine Will.

.
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That is our definition of Jesus.
 
Servant19 said:
They should. As with all Abrahamic religions, some scholars don’t even know their own religion correctly because the Books are sealed until the End Times.
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What scholars are you talking about? Can you please shed some light on your above comment
 
Techno2000 said:
But, you say Jesus is not Divine.🤷
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No I don’t…

I said all Manifestations of God have a human AND DIVINE nature.

That doesn’t mean that He shares in the essence of God, otherwise that is pantheism Techno…

.
 
Servant19 said:
No I don’t…

I said all Manifestations of God have a human AND DIVINE nature.

That doesn’t mean that He shares in the essence of God, otherwise that is pantheism Techno…

.
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So where does the Divine nature come from?🤷
 
JimmyDFG said:
What scholars are you talking about? Can you please shed some light on your above comment
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Any Jewish, Christian and Muslim scholar is purely speculating as to what their Holy Books mean.

Daniel himself would affirm it.

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Micosil said:
But would that also not be the case for Baha’i scholars?
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Bahais believe Baha’u’llah unsealed the Books with His Revelation. As Daniel stated, the Books will be sealed until the End Times. Bahais believe the End Times began the moment Baha’u’llah said “I am”

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Servant19 said:
Bahais believe Baha’u’llah unsealed the Books with His Revelation. As Daniel stated, the Books will be sealed until the End Times. Bahais believe the End Times began the moment Baha’u’llah said “I am”

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That’s Baha’u’llah interpretation. Could it be that Baha’i is this one world religion in Revelation
 
Servant19 said:
Yes Truth is Truth is Truth.

But actually, it’s not “your” definition. All religions have taught it.

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Jesus defined it. He is the Truth. He is Mercy.

Now someone will copy my words and the characteristics of Jesus and claim it also belonging to their faith. The Truth is no one can live with themselves without clinging to Jesus.

MJ
 
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