Eucharist - Please help me understand

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po18guy said:
I am not familiar with those documents. However, there is so much more that unites us than divides us. Jesus prayed that we be one, as He and the Father are one. Of the Evangelicals who have converted to the Catholic Church, all of them are very thankful for their Evangelical roots. An excellent example is Mark P. Shea, who has written a short book on the process that he personally experienced on his way to belief in the Eucharist. He has not one bad thing to say about his Evangelical background.
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I tried to find the original document apart from a particular church. However, I couldn’t find it apart from a church who posted it. Could you please read ECT 1 and let me know what you think. Just stick to the document and disregard to church that posted it. One of the signer on the Evangelical side was JI Packer, a famous Reformed theologian. Actually Chuck Colson is a Reformed Christain too.

leaderu.com/ftissues/ft9405/articles/mission.html
 
2nd_Adam said:
For the record, I am not anti-Catholic nor am I protesting against the Catholic Church.
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You don’t seem anti Catholic to me, however, if you are Christian and non Catholic then you are protesting against the Catholic Church.
 
CHESTERTONRULES said:
You don’t seem anti Catholic to me, however, if you are Christian and non Catholic then you are protesting against the Catholic Church.
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I understand your position. However, I was not raised by Catholic parents; therefore the Council of Trent does not apply to me.
 
po18guy said:
A very good read, and blessed are the peacemakers. As we were not one in Christ’s time (hence his prayer in John 17), may we strive, even today, toward unity.
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You see, maybe this a start of ECT III?
 
2nd_Adam said:
Okay, there are over 1 billion Catholics in the world. How many of those Catholics believe that the elements change to the actual flesh and literal blood at the mass? Do you care to speculate on the percentages?
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Your number of Catholics is incorrect, because you have excluded the Multitude in Heaven that no one could count (Rev.7:9) who handed down this Catholic Faith in the True presence of the Eucharist since Jesus Christ gave it to them and many of these were martyred for this Catholic Faith in the Eucharist.

The term literal does not give credence to the definition of Transubstantiation which gives a description of what takes place in this mystery of God’s presence from eternity but this definition never exhausts its mystery in time.

Truthfully I cannot speak for every individual Catholics status in faith, but I can promise you, that every Catholic Church in communion with the Pope teaches this faith of the True (*presence) body, blood soul and divinity of Jesus Christ is found in the Eucharist, world wide, from the past, present until Jesus returns.

Proof of this can be found in the C.C.C. under subject index Eucharist.

Duet.4:7
For what great nation is there that has gods so close to it as the LORD, our God, is to us whenever we call upon him?

Tell me 2Adam? Do you know the definition of Transubstantiation the way the Catholic Church defines it?
 
Can any one in this forum explain to me what the term troll means in relationship to the Internet? Thank you!🤷 Carlan
 
Carlan said:
Can any one in this forum explain to me what the term troll means in relationship to the Internet? Thank you!🤷 Carlan
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Basically it’s someone who does “hit-and-run” attacks, dumping propaganda which degrades the conversation rather than contributing to it. For instance, you get anti-Catholic fundamentalists on this forum who post lengthy screeds denouncing Catholicism and then disappear. A troll doesn’t actually engage in discussion but tries to influence the discussion without exposing himself/herself to refutation. That’s my understanding, anyway. Classic troll behavior also involves posting under a misleading name, or identifying oneself forcefully, or posting different posts under different names, or coming back under a different name after one has been banned. Maybe one or more of these behaviors should be considered essential to the definition.

As my doubt on this point shows, the definition is a bit vague (as I’ve seen it used–maybe I just don’t understand the definition, but if there is a clearer one then I think people often misuse the term), and often anyone who comes across as argumentative or obnoxious, or forcefully defends a minority position, gets accused of being a “troll.” I think that’s unfortunate. A “troll” should be defined only as someone who in some way exhibits bad faith, and we should be very cautious about assuming that someone who says things we don’t like is a “troll.”

It can be easy to fall into “trollish” behavior if one is on a forum one finds deeply upsetting. For instance, I used to post on the Anglican/Episcopalian forum on Beliefnet. At one point another poster commented in a disgusted fashion that I showed up at long intervals to denounce everyone for being mean to Catholics, and then disappeared. I don’t recall the word “troll” being used, but I was made to feel that this behavior was rude and inappropriate. So I more or less stay away from that forum (I visit it occasionally to see how different issues in Anglicanism are being discussed), because I thought the poster had a valid point. I wasn’t really willing to become part of that online community, and so my occasional irruption with denunciations of their liberal triumphalism was seen as being a bit trollish.

On this forum, while I am often obnoxious and annoy people, I have built up some credibility (mostly by dint of spending way too much time here!). So I don’t get accused of being a troll, though I do get accused of many other things (usually with justice).

Edwin
 
Carlan said:
Can any one in this forum explain to me what the term troll means in relationship to the Internet? Thank you!🤷 Carlan
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Check his other posts. There is much to agree with. And the ECT1 and 2 are interesting documents. I wish more “bible Christians” would read them - especially the Apostle’s creed. There is a lifetime of discussion just over the contents of that short, ancient creed.
 
Contarini said:
Basically it’s someone who does “hit-and-run” attacks, dumping propaganda which degrades the conversation rather than contributing to it. For instance, you get anti-Catholic fundamentalists on this forum who post lengthy screeds denouncing Catholicism and then disappear. A troll doesn’t actually engage in discussion but tries to influence the discussion without exposing himself/herself to refutation.
Edwin
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Thank you Ewin, it help greatly,:)Carlan
 
po18guy said:
Check his other posts. There is much to agree with. And the ECT1 and 2 are interesting documents. I wish more “bible Christians” would read them - especially the Apostle’s creed. There is a lifetime of discussion just over the contents of that short, ancient creed.
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Yes, and thank you, po18guy.:)Carlan
 
=2nd Adam;5713388]I’ll give you the answer to my question. Which Gentile sinners were granted saving fatih and repentance? The answer - those sinners that were appointed to eternal life were granted repentance and faith. Both repentance and faith are necessary for salvation, which God provides to those He predestined.
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BEEP! you’re wrong and should know it. You and I have dnaced this number before:thumbsup:

God being God simply cannot [an absolute impossibility] pre-judge, predestine, pre-select any body for eith heven or hell:thumbsup: If He did, He’d HAVE TO STOP BEING GOD:shrug:

Love and prayers,
 
2nd_Adam said:
Here is another follow up on ECT. I suggest that we all read it.

christianitytoday.com/ct/2009/januaryweb-only/103-51.0.html
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Here’s part of the article above. You can read it in context by the link above:

The timing of Neuhaus’s and Dulles’s deaths is really significant when you realize that Pope Benedict on November 19 in what was otherwise a routine audience in St. Peter’s square, gave a homily on justification and fully embraced the position that Evangelicals and Catholics Together had taken [in the 1997 document, “Gift of Salvation”]. He didn’t identify it as such, but that’s what he did.

Eleven years after that document was written, the Pope, the head of the church, concluded his homily by saying Luther was right, so long as you don’t exclude charity, that is love, and the works that flow from love. Which of course none of us does.

Almost at the same time that statement was issued, the two Catholics who were willing to say they agreed with what the reformers meant when they said sola fide died. It’s as if “Okay, you finished your task. The big issue that divided us in the Reformation has now been settled, so you guys can come home and rest.”
 
2nd_Adam said:
I understand your position. However, I was not raised by Catholic parents; therefore the Council of Trent does not apply to me.
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You are not historically illiterate, and you are an adult.

If you choose to remain outside the Catholic Church, it is your choice, not your parents.

Other than my marriage, my conversion to Catholicism has been the best decision of my life.
 
CHESTERTONRULES said:
You are not historically illiterate, and you are an adult.

If you choose to remain outside the Catholic Church, it is your choice, not your parents.

Other than my marriage, my conversion to Catholicism has been the best decision of my life.
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I think you need to read Pope Benedict’s paper on justification, confirming that faith alone is true. You guys need to break down your walls… I started a new thread on this dividing line which appears to be eliminated. In addition, Pope Benedict has an Augustinian theology too. 😉

forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=378445
 
po18guy said:
We are separated brothers in Christ, and you are here to sharpen us, and vice versa. That is how the Lord works. I gladly accept any and all sharpening.
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Thank you for that guy, I stand corrected.:)Carlan
 
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