European elections 2019: LIVE results

[PickyPicky]

There have been and are plenty of left wing parties in the Republic and NI.

Yes, but the fact remains that politics in the Republic has been dominated by two conservative parties.

 

[abucs]

Videos detailing and discussing the amazing and continued rise and success of nationalist parties across Europe as well as the surprise increase in the anti-Christian Green movement at the expense of the European status quo.

As mentioned above by other posters, many parties both Left and Right of the European status quo have moved to accommodate nationalist policies within their own platforms, especially with regards to migration because of the fear of losing even more support from the European people.

The insane migration policies of the European status quo have been stopped dead as a consequence of the continued turn of the European people to nationalist support.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B8-McaovZ1Q

 

[abucs]

Yes, but the fact remains that politics in the Republic has been dominated by two conservative parties.

Yes while the ‘Irish’ population of the north (nationalists) have a choice between two left wing nationalist parties, in the Republic the continued choice is between two right wing parties. There is greater choice in the Republic, it’s just that the left wing parties have been largely rejected, save for occasional threats from left wing Sinn Fein to break through.

Having said that there are aspects of Fine Gael that can be thought of as left wing such as their wish to destroy much of Catholic education and force it to be secular by dictate of the state.

 

[grotto]

Back in the day, I was a supporter of Gerry Adams (before he got into having a seat at the table). Over the years - a lot of ground was covered and then as happens, other intentions gain ground as well.
Leadership is like the weather; requires an umbrella or warm clothing.
I have a VCR of Adams here in the US - will have to dig that out and see what I think of it today.

 

[jeannetherese]

When Mr. Adams visited our area, he focused upon nationalism and economics to a generally appreciative audience.
I wonder if the movement into other areas by S.F. (abortion as an example) might affect support levels?

 

[PickyPicky]

Having said that there are aspects of Fine Gael that can be thought of as left wing such as their wish to destroy much of Catholic education and force it to be secular by dictate of the state.

Do you mean they are favour of integrated education? And they are proposing what, exactly?

 

[abucs]

Do you mean they are favour of integrated education? And they are proposing what, exactly?

I mean exactly what I said. The Fine Gael party has put on notice in the recent past their wish to take schools from the Catholic educational sector and make them secular.

 

[Zzyzx_Road]

I fully expect the migrant accommodation insanity to be throttled back as the big parties that backed it have found it to be an almost certain loser of ground to the various nationalist parties. People are essentially stating we like the EU, just don’t be shoving more migrants down our throats. So if the big parties move toward the anti-migrant positions of the nationalist parties, that will take some wind out of their sails. Denmark’s Social Democrats have already shown the way.

Along those lines, Brussels will not want to do this, but if they were to give the last word over UK migrant policy to the UK government, that would deflate a considerable portion of the Leave sentiment. Well Brussels already has to deal with Salvini and Orban who are not going away anytime soon. That will be interesting and the accommodation reached with them could set a useful inducement for the UK to remain.

 

[Cathoholic]

Zzyzx_Road . . .

I fully expect the migrant accommodation insanity to be throttled back as the big parties that backed it have found it to be an almost certain loser of ground to the various nationalist parties.

You COULD be right here Zzyzx_Road.

But I think it is going to be almost impossible to pull-back on immigration.

Why?

Because “immigration”, at least recently, was never primarily about the “immigrant” but the needs of the Europeans.

Just like “immigration” is here on America. (It is primarily about taking care of the needs of Americans.)

So if they DO pull-back on immigration, they will have unrest from their inability to “pension” their retired people. (Sooner or later this will occur anyway.)

A couple years ago I put an article up from Deutsche Welle detailing the labor vacuum and the NEED for “immmigrants”.

 

[jeannetherese]

Perhaps the immigration question might be linked to contradictions arising from the opening of markets within the EU?
As markets have opened, concerns for how to hold/ground footloose industry have emerged.
The labor market has also been opening and increased migration might be seen as a response to these opening markets.
How to resolve the challenges associated with shifting markets may be an increasingly debated topic in the years to come.

 

[niceatheist]

If they had addressed the migrants properly the first time around, you would not have seen the eurosceptic stance become so popular as it was the perception of many citizens that the EU was shoving the migrants down everyone’s collective throats. If the ruling parties had acted on that earlier, the populists would never really have got off the ground as much as they did.

And what would have been the proper way to handle it? The singular intervention that France and Britain advocated for when Ghadaffi was knocked out of power with US firepower didn’t exactly stem any tides. I guess you could sink all the migrant boats in the Mediterranean or force them back into the warzones which they were fleeing, but then you’d better be ready for the humanitarian consequences of that.

Like it or not, borders are often more ephemeral entities than actual walls and trenches. If even the Romans, with all their military might and will couldn’t keep migrants from pushing past their frontier, what is it you imagine liberal democracies are going to do?

 

[PickyPicky]

The Fine Gael party has put on notice in the recent past their wish to take schools from the Catholic educational sector and make them secular

Would these be schools funded almost entirely by the state?

 

[puppson]

How so? They’ve won in France, Italy, Spain, Poland, Belgium…

 

[Zzyzx_Road]

And what would have been the proper way to handle it? The singular intervention that France and Britain advocated for when Ghadaffi was knocked out of power with US firepower didn’t exactly stem any tides. I guess you could sink all the migrant boats in the Mediterranean or force them back into the warzones which they were fleeing, but then you’d better be ready for the humanitarian consequences of that.

For that part, I blame Obama and Hillary Clinton for the Libya fiasco. Never should have gone there. Gadhaffi was a useful bulwark to holding the tide back. I was once on a tour in some overseas country with a couple of married couples from Belgium. Who stood up for the EU in answer to my scepticism, but hated Obama and Clinton with a passion for destroying Libya and unleashing the migrant waves from there. They said it isn’t permitted to speak ill of the migrant policy in public, but “trust me, we are talking to each other on the down low”. Have to imagine they love Salvini’s policy.

Like it or not, borders are often more ephemeral entities than actual walls and trenches. If even the Romans, with all their military might and will couldn’t keep migrants from pushing past their frontier, what is it you imagine liberal democracies are going to do?

Then they are likely to go like the Romans did. We shouldn’t lord it over the EU though as we face a similar existential crisis from our own migrant situation.

 

[Victoria33]

Interesting and good observations on Libya but I would preface it with saying, it’s still not clear to me what happened. Obama didn’t seem real enthused about it and…not to sound like a “conspiratorial tin foil hat” type but I do wonder sometimes if there is a shadow government directing things… and since, I try to see things pretty objectively, it seems at least, that the French went in first, and perhaps later joined by the UK and USA and I just found an article calling it a Nato action. Also, the “shadow government” argument doesn’t quite hold up perfectly because it seems obvious that Clinton took a big role in the decision-making. I think she discusses in depth in a book she wrote.

If we went in, we needed to secure the ground, I guess we didn’t feel the commitment to do that or at least, something like that. If we don’t have that, maybe we shouldn’t have gone in and I have little sympathy for Gaddafi. I think we got it right that he was going to set his military on his own people.

 

[abucs]

Would these be schools funded almost entirely by the state?

These schools were largely funded and founded by the Catholic church. A history of Catholic education in Ireland that included at one stage priests risking their very lives to deliver skills to the Irish against the policy of the state who would kill them if they taught Irish children to read.

These schools give skills to the next generation of tax payers to provide for themselves, their future families and yes, to provide FOR the state. And they have played this role FOR the state generation after generation with THEIR schools and THEIR teachers. These schools are largely funded now by tax payers money from tax payers THEY educated to be able to develop the Irish economy and tax base. Who is not funding it to any large degree are those with a secular religion who wish to steal schools from the Catholic sector to promote a secular religion.

If people wish to provide a secular religion to the next generation then just like the Catholic church they can build their own schools. This is the great evil of our time where a section of the population with a secular religion do not build things as a community but demand the state take off others and build their own religion.

This is akin to the socialist economic model which relies on theft and state coercion rather than any lasting community efforts. Just like that model in the end it will fail. In the meantime such people can build their own schools and be prevented from stealing other people’s schools by dictate of the state.

 

[Cathoholic]

Vouthon . . .

As already stated, turning into a very good night for Europe’s Greens.

Is there anything else to the European election story other than the “Greens” Vouthon?

 

[PickyPicky]

These schools are largely funded now by tax payers money from tax payers

Yes, I thought so.

 

[abucs]

These schools give skills to the next generation of tax payers to provide for themselves, their future families and yes, to provide FOR the state. And they have played this role FOR the state generation after generation with THEIR schools and THEIR teachers. These schools are largely funded now by tax payers money from tax payers THEY educated to be able to develop the Irish economy and tax base. Who is not funding it to any large degree are those with a secular religion who wish to steal schools from the Catholic sector to promote a secular religion.

Yes, I thought so.

Great………

 

[PickyPicky]

That was my vague remembrance, but I hadn’t the confidence to say it! It’s useful to have someone around who actually knows what he’s talking about.

So how does the relationship with the Church work out?