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HarryStotle
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Kevin’s not buying it.
He thinks it is privileged white people trying to “bubble wrap” black people, (and other minorities) and an example of reverse racism.
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Florida's GOP gubernatorial nominee says a vote for his black opponent would 'monkey this up'
- Thread starter LeafByNiggle
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He thinks it is privileged white people trying to “bubble wrap” black people, (and other minorities) and an example of reverse racism.
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Theo520
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No, I read they have a very general problem, and the article describes exactly how the labor market is supposed to operate.
- First, qualified people come from out of town to fill the jobs, probably from areas with less opportunity. CO takes advantage of the whole US as a labor pool.
- Second, they start to address problems with training their own youth to meet the requirements.
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Theo520
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Nope, I recall very clearly the book referenced significant research, what most call facts.
The Hill article also referenced verifiable facts on Nixon’s pro-civil rights activities plus his public and private communications.
You however have no supporting facts.
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No. Socialism brings misery and poverty, not to mention government power over individual rights.
The idea that someone has to believe in something or have experienced it to understand or observe it is nonsense.
I think a Muslim could read and study what it means to be a faithful Catholic.
Actually, it is. Government control or ownership of the means of production is not intended to bring prosperity, but equity.
I think you want to exclude examples because there are no examples of socialist states that aren’t violent.
All need do is look at the twentieth century. Tens of millions of civilians killed by their own governments. Millions more dying because of shortages of basic necessities. It still goes on today in Venezuela and North Korea.
Socialism empowers the state and devalues the individual. People tend to resist this when the inevitable shortages take place. Socialist states, from Nazi Germany to China tend to be violent places.
Not even close. The most secure individuals in the world live in free market economies.
Norway is not a socialist state. Oh sure, it has a welfare state, but that doesn’t make it socialist. Norway, Denmark, they will tell you they have a free market economy.
LeafByNiggle
Well-known member
Then how about tuition-free trade schools, welding, HVAC, plumbing, electrical, architectural design, I.T., carpentry, etc.? These are not post-modernist.LeafByNiggle:
Why would any responsible Catholic or principled anyone want to have their tax dollars go to fund essentially post-modernist institutions, run by overpaid…
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Boatswain2PA
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This is more echo-chamber fake-news from CNN, and this is the reason they are failing. Instead of reporting the NEWS, they take snippets of the news and twist the story around to meet their own ideology.
THIS is one of the reasons that we now have a President Trump. While far leftists (like leaf, dvd, Gillum, and the author Caroline Kenny) would never vote for a Republican/Conservative, most Americans are fairly centrist. These centrist Americans are coming to the realization that CNN (and much of the rest of mainstream media) are so blatantly dishonest and biased toward the leftist Democrats that they no longer credible.
This article is just another example of this. What DeSantis said was “The last thing we need to do is to monkey this up by trying to embrace a socialist agenda with huge tax increases and bankrupting the state.”.
Not racist, just common terminology that every-day (centrist) Americans can understand, and these every-day (centrist Americans) KNOW that’s not a racist statement.
Of course, leftists like Gillum, Leaf, and DVD don’t understand the center,. They think that anyone who doesn’t think the way they do are evil/racists/mysogenists/nazi/etc…so they LOOK for evil/racism/etc everywhere. Plus Gillum (and other leftist Democrats) know their friends in the media will amplify any calls of racism they make…so they make them.
An HONEST reporter/news agency could have reported what DeSantis said, and that Gillum inferred that the comment was racist. An HONEST reporter/news agency would have ALSO reported the many other recent times that Demcorats used the term “monkey”, and the other famous time that a Democrat senator (and eventual VP) called another Democrat senator (and eventual POTUS) “articulate”.
But that’s not what CNN does. CNN takes DeSantis quote of “The last thing we need to do is to monkey this up by trying to embrace a socialist agenda with huge tax increases and bankrupting the state.” and changes it to a DISHONEST, race-baiting attack on Republicans and says " Florida’s GOP gubernatorial nominee says a vote for his black opponent would ‘monkey this up’"
THIS is fake news. Dishonest, biased, untrustworthy…and the reason why CNN is failing.
Leaf - you should be ashamed of yourself for spreading such lies (but I doubt you are).
THIS is one of the reasons that we now have a President Trump. While far leftists (like leaf, dvd, Gillum, and the author Caroline Kenny) would never vote for a Republican/Conservative, most Americans are fairly centrist. These centrist Americans are coming to the realization that CNN (and much of the rest of mainstream media) are so blatantly dishonest and biased toward the leftist Democrats that they no longer credible.
This article is just another example of this. What DeSantis said was “The last thing we need to do is to monkey this up by trying to embrace a socialist agenda with huge tax increases and bankrupting the state.”.
Not racist, just common terminology that every-day (centrist) Americans can understand, and these every-day (centrist Americans) KNOW that’s not a racist statement.
Of course, leftists like Gillum, Leaf, and DVD don’t understand the center,. They think that anyone who doesn’t think the way they do are evil/racists/mysogenists/nazi/etc…so they LOOK for evil/racism/etc everywhere. Plus Gillum (and other leftist Democrats) know their friends in the media will amplify any calls of racism they make…so they make them.
An HONEST reporter/news agency could have reported what DeSantis said, and that Gillum inferred that the comment was racist. An HONEST reporter/news agency would have ALSO reported the many other recent times that Demcorats used the term “monkey”, and the other famous time that a Democrat senator (and eventual VP) called another Democrat senator (and eventual POTUS) “articulate”.
But that’s not what CNN does. CNN takes DeSantis quote of “The last thing we need to do is to monkey this up by trying to embrace a socialist agenda with huge tax increases and bankrupting the state.” and changes it to a DISHONEST, race-baiting attack on Republicans and says " Florida’s GOP gubernatorial nominee says a vote for his black opponent would ‘monkey this up’"
THIS is fake news. Dishonest, biased, untrustworthy…and the reason why CNN is failing.
Leaf - you should be ashamed of yourself for spreading such lies (but I doubt you are).
LeafByNiggle
Well-known member
Not failing, and not fake. The news is that Gillum and other Democrats had these reactions to DeSantis’ remarks. That actually happened. CNN did not make it up. Your complaint is more accurately aimed at Gillum and the Democrats who gave this response, not to CNN for reporting the fact that they had this response. Do you want CNN to suppress certain facts that you find distasteful? If you follow the article carefully you will see that CNN took no position on the validity of the Democrats’ interpretation of DeSantis.
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HarryStotle
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And neither did DeSantis’ comment compare anyone to a monkey. You missed the point, apparently.Imdaman:
That’s ridiculous, and you know it. Leaf’s post didn’t compare anyone to a dog.
If Leaf is going to insist that DeSantis’ comment makes a necessary connection between monkeys and black people, then using the term dog whistle with reference to the supposedly ‘racist’ right is calling those who respond to the “dog whistle,” ‘dogs.’
Fortunately, no dogs answered the call.
The barks you are hearing is from those who think the whole controversy is a howler.
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Boatswain2PA
Guest
Leaf - the HEADLINE was factually inaccurate, and of course inflammatory.
The HEADLINE: “Florida’s GOP gubernatorial nominee says a vote for his black opponent would ‘monkey this up” is fake news.
The HEADLINE!! DeSantis never said voting for the black guy would monkey it up.
What DeSantis said was “The last thing we need to do is to monkey this up by trying to embrace a socialist agenda with huge tax increases and bankrupting the state.”
So DeSantis says voting for a socialist agenda, with its huge tax increases and bankrupting the state, would be monkeying it up.
Leftists read this as “DeSantis called Gillum a monkey”, and CNN reports that on it’s HEADLINE!!
It’s fake, dishonest, biased, and a perfect example of why CNN is untrustworthy.
And yet you can’t see that…perhaps too much dog-whistling in your ears??
The HEADLINE: “Florida’s GOP gubernatorial nominee says a vote for his black opponent would ‘monkey this up” is fake news.
The HEADLINE!! DeSantis never said voting for the black guy would monkey it up.
What DeSantis said was “The last thing we need to do is to monkey this up by trying to embrace a socialist agenda with huge tax increases and bankrupting the state.”
So DeSantis says voting for a socialist agenda, with its huge tax increases and bankrupting the state, would be monkeying it up.
Leftists read this as “DeSantis called Gillum a monkey”, and CNN reports that on it’s HEADLINE!!
It’s fake, dishonest, biased, and a perfect example of why CNN is untrustworthy.
And yet you can’t see that…perhaps too much dog-whistling in your ears??
LeafByNiggle
Well-known member
Connecting this back to the topic of Andrew Gillum, the question is then what kind of socialist is Gillum? The Venezuelan kind or the Norwegian kind? He is for medicare for all, a higher minimum wage, and more money for education. That sounds more like Norway than Venezuela.LeafByNiggle:
The only reason Norway does not have a failing economy is that the people there are smart enough to keep their economy a market based capitalist one.starshiptrooper:
Oh, I quite agree that Venezuela is socialist. And so is Norway. Venezuela has a failing economy. Norway does not.LeafByNiggle:
They call themselves socialist… Then you could compare the points and try to make your case that Venezuela is not really socialist.
Norway is a free market economy with some social programs. That is a mixed political system, at best. It is not purely socialist. Venezuela was pretty much that. Which is why it is failing.
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HarryStotle
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Okay, I’ll grant you that it is difficult to see how welding, HVAC, plumbing, electrical, or carpentry could ever become postmodernist since the product must stand on its own.HarryStotle:
Then how about tuition-free trade schools, welding, HVAC, plumbing, electrical, architectural design, I.T., carpentry, etc.? These are not post-modernist.LeafByNiggle:
Why would any responsible Catholic or principled anyone want to have their tax dollars go to fund essentially post-modernist institutions, run by overpaid…
However, given the number of bridges that have collapsed recently, perhaps we need to investigate the infiltration of postmodernism into architectural design and engineering. Bridges don’t seem to be standing on their own very well.
As to IT, the cultures at places like Google, Facebook, Mozilla, and Apple argue against you.
LeafByNiggle
Well-known member
Since he was talking about Gillum in the whole speech, it is quite clear that he means that voting for Gillum would be embracing a socialist agenda with huge tax increases. The headline is accurate.
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HarryStotle
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Nope. Just want CNN to stop suppressing certain facts that THEY find distasteful.
LeafByNiggle
Well-known member
I am open to examples of a successful nationwide private school system anywhere on earth - not just the United States. It would be an experiment to attempt to switch over to relying primarily private schools - an experiment that has never worked anywhere else in the world at any time, present or past. And the victims of that experiment would be the masses who have no choice by public school. Unless you are implying a huge tax-based investment in private schools to make them accessible to all, in which case they would become, for all intents and purposes, public schools, private in name only.LeafByNiggle:
To be fair, it has never been allowed to benefit the whole nation, has it?Jeanne_S:
You missed the point. Where has a private school system benefitted the whole nation, not just the few who are fortunate enough to have access to it? That has not happened here because very few do have access to free private schooling.
Public schools are free and people do value them.
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HarryStotle
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Yup and by saying, “The last thing WE need to do is monkey this up…” the monkey referent was to “we” as in all the people of Florida, making your claim that the monkey comment was aimed at Gillum – i.e., “was talking about Gillum” – inaccurate at best and incendiary at worst.Boatswain2PA:
Since he was talking about Gillum in the whole speech, it is quite clear that he means that voting for Gillum would be embracing a socialist agenda with huge tax increases. The headline is accurate.
Best to stop trying to dig your way out of this hole and admit the inaccuracy of thinking DeSantis meant anything to disparage black people.
Perhaps the people of Florida should be up in arms for DeSantis calling them (including himself) all “monkeys?”
Sensitivity run amok? Methinks they would be better off not answering that dog whistle.
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LeafByNiggle
Well-known member
If you had a point to make by asking the questions you should have made that point instead of implying the point through questions. If you had no point at all to make in asking those questions, then why ask them? I took my best guess as to what the point was behind your questions. If I guessed wrong, then don’t make me guess in the future.LeafByNiggle:
My ‘original claim’ as you quoted it was neither original nor a claim. It was a question asking for your response and it was included in a set of several other questions in response to your statement about blacks voting for the Democrats.
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HarryStotle
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Yeah, no. Public schools aren’t free. Someone is paying for them. The problem is that those who are paying for them (parents and taxpayers, generally) have little to no say in terms of how they are run, who is teaching their children and the content of instructional material.
People value the idea of education and having their children educated, they just don’t value the delivery system. That shows in a number of ways – truancy, student performance, parent involvement, etc.
LeafByNiggle
Well-known member
Of the two articles you referenced, The Hill was clearly labeled right there on the website as “Opinion.” And the NYT article was essentially a book report - about a book with an opinion.LeafByNiggle:
Nope, I recall very clearly the book referenced significant research, what most call facts.
The Hill article also referenced verifiable facts on Nixon’s pro-civil rights activities plus his public and private communications.
You however have no supporting facts.
As for my supporting facts, see the 109 footnotes to this article.
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HarryStotle
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I’m not seeing it.
How do footnotes to 109 opinions establish the facts?
Perhaps you are of the opinion that repeating an opinion a sufficient number of times establishes it as a fact?
Perhaps Wikipedia should post on every page: Our opinions count as facts because of their sheer number.
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