Freemasonary not being warned about?

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flameburns623:
No “curses” involved. Masonic ritual is essentially a collection of formal rules of order regarding the conduct of meetings, proper address of officers of the lodge, etcetera. The oaths are formed in the stilted language of ancient British legalities and readily misunderstood: they are an oath and a prayer addressed to God, which petition Him (and Him alone) to oversee the faithfulness of the Mason in maintaining as private the internal matters of the Lodge. The oaths are taken with the prior admonition of the Worshipful Master of the Lodge that nothing contained in the oaths or taught by by Lodge at any time will ever or can ever conflict with any duty or obligation owed by the candidate to his family, his country, or his God. If such a conflict arose–it would necessarily negate the terms under which the oath were contracted. No ‘renunciation’ would be obligatory.

By the bye: I am not a Roman Catholic. Neither am I commending to Roman Catholics that they flout their church or their consciences and join the Lodge. I have simply pointed out that virtually every secular reason, and most theological reasons tendered for not joining, are based upon false pretences. The Lodge is NOT a surrogate religious movement and one is NOT asked to believe things contrary to one’s faith, as noted above. Freemasonry is not a conspiratorial institution manipulating history from the shadows. It’s worst aspect was the long-established (and long-renounced, in the Grand Lodges of the USA) practice of ‘preferment’. This was the committment of Lodge-members to ‘prefer’ to buy goods of equal value sold by both Masonic and non-Masonic retailers from the Masoninc retailer; to vote–where other issues were not at stake–for the Masonic candidate over the non-Mason; to promote among candidates of equal talent and ability the Freemason. This practice became problematic for American Freemasons long ago and was disavowed (the British faced scandals rooted in ‘preferment’ as late as the 1980’s and early 90’s).

What WASN’T resolved very quickly in American Freemasonry was a split in the Lodges based along racial lines: Blacks had their own Lodges from colonial times, recognized by the Grand Lodge of England but not by any of the 50 Grand Lodges of the USA until the late 1990’s and early 21st century. Before that time, very few Lodges accepted Blacks at all, and most which did were extremely selective about the matter. At the time that I joined, the “Prince Hall” (Black) Lodges were in rapprochment with White Grand Lodges in my home state, and each now gives full recognition to the other.
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Like I said all you did was leave the building.Are you going to continue to live by that spirit of fear. Or are you going to seek God that He may set you free. Its your choice. :eek:
 
If they are not evil, than why is it that their symbol resembles a pentagram:

freemasonry.org/phyllis/

Yup, I’d say that freemasonry is a sick joke if I ever saw one before. It is pretty weak if you have to join a society to get ahead in life anyway. Did you know that some of the forefathers of our nation were freemasons?
 
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flick427:
If they are not evil, than why is it that their symbol resembles a pentagram:

freemasonry.org/phyllis/

Yup, I’d say that freemasonry is a sick joke if I ever saw one before. It is pretty weak if you have to join a society to get ahead in life anyway. Did you know that some of the forefathers of our nation were freemasons?
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The Pentegram was a Christian symbol before it was expropriated around the turn of the 20th century by Aleister Crowley, who took it for the symbol of the Horned God. Prior to that the Pentacle represented Christ; the five points, the five wounds of Christ. Inverted it represented the Star of Behlehem, pointing downward to a manger.

In any case the square-and-compass symbol resemble a Star of David. ‘Way too much time in the ol’ Chick tracts, Flick427.

Yes: the majority of foundng fathers were Freemasons by some accoutns. Including George Washington, whom I note that you quote.
 
Also, the upside down cross, which is now considered to be a satanic symbol, original represented Saint Peter because he was crucified upside down at his request because he said that he was unworthy to die in the same manner as our Lord.
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flameburns623:
Yes: the majority of foundng fathers were Freemasons by some accoutns. Including George Washington, whom I note that you quote.
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The scary thing is that many of our current leaders are also Masons and there are UNCONFIRMED rumors that Pope John 23rd MIGHT have also been a mason. :eek:
 
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SPOKENWORD:
Like I said all you did was leave the building.Are you going to continue to live by that spirit of fear. Or are you going to seek God that He may set you free. Its your choice. :eek:
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Just because you are not Roman Catholic dosnt exclude you from being a mason. This applies to all christians. As a christian you cannot serve to masters. You say that there are no curses involved,but I am here to tell you that is a lie of satan.Of course you cannot see them because they are spiritual.You can continue on and let satan show you twisted truth or you can listen to Gods TRUTH. Masonry and christianity are not compatible. :eek:
 
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SPOKENWORD:
Just because you are not Roman Catholic dosnt exclude you from being a mason. This applies to all christians. As a christian you cannot serve to masters. You say that there are no curses involved,but I am here to tell you that is a lie of satan.Of course you cannot see them because they are spiritual.You can continue on and let satan show you twisted truth or you can listen to Gods TRUTH. Masonry and christianity are not compatible. :eek:
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It is impossible to conduct a reasonable conversation while being simultaneously demonized. There is something about this topic that draws crackpots like dungflies to offal. I’ve tendered some reasonable responses and offered some sources a fair-minded individual–who is taking all needful medication as prescribed by their analyst–can seek out and ponder. I’m unsubscribing this thread and leaving it to the conspiracy theorists to wallow in their own mire. God’s blessings to all of good will.
 
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flameburns623:
It is impossible to conduct a reasonable conversation while being simultaneously demonized. There is something about this topic that draws crackpots like dungflies to offal …
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Look, every group, organization, association, etc.; has certain rules & regulations that it expects it’s members to abide by. The Catholic church has officially stated (other members have already quoted the sources earlier in this thread so I will not bother repeating it) that a person can not be both a Mason and a Catholic at the same time. They have to pick one or the other.

Whatever their reasons, that is the current ruling. If you wish to be a member of a group, association, etc.; in good standing, then you HAVE TO abide by their rules.

So what part if this do people have a problem with? If you believe otherwise, then you need to petition the Holy See for a change in those rules, but until those changes happen, those rules need to be followed.

Seems pretty simple to me.
 
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flameburns623:
It is impossible to conduct a reasonable conversation while being simultaneously demonized. There is something about this topic that draws crackpots like dungflies to offal. I’ve tendered some reasonable responses and offered some sources a fair-minded individual–who is taking all needful medication as prescribed by their analyst–can seek out and ponder. I’m unsubscribing this thread and leaving it to the conspiracy theorists to wallow in their own mire. God’s blessings to all of good will.
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Isnt it amazing when you begin to show Gods light onto DARKNESS.what the enemy does. He runs away because of GODS LIGHT.Im sorry if you feel i offended you,and you can hate me all you want,but Gods TRUTH and his WORD is piercing.Please remember our battles are not against flesh and blood but against the principalities of darkness. I am available to talk to you anytime you desire about Gods TRUTH.Just post on my message mail]. Jesus can set you free. 👍
 
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Spiri220:
Actually, you’re wrong, Lider. The Roman Catholic Church officially forbids their members to join the Freemasons under penalties up to and including Excommunication, as Bishop Bruskewicz showed in Lincoln several years ago.

Are Masons anti-Catholic? Some may be, but that would be a personal problem, not an official Grand Lodge position.

Do Catholics join Lodges, in defiance of Church position? Sure. Just like they use birth control.

Does the Catholic Church hate Masons? Yes, they do.
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It’s true that we as Catholics are not permitted to join the Freemasons.

But… sigh… Please do NOT put words in the mouth of an entire organization! Especially when those words could NOT be FURTHER from the truth!!!

As an orthodox Roman Catholic myself, I do not, nor have I ever, nor do I ever plan to “hate Masons!”

Yes, I’ve been prejudiced against by them. Still, I DO NOT hate them!!

I will NEVER join them because their creed is irreconcilable with the Christian creed. Take a close look at the organization beyond their (admittedly) charitable works and you’ll see more clearly why I make this point.

Sheesh!!! Gimmeabreak!

:tsktsk:

Some people who are Catholic may have chosen to join a Masonic Lodge. I don’t know, but it’s possible some have.

Now, whether a Catholic has chosen to join a Masonic Lodge in order to defy the Church is between them and God. I’m not around to judge, by all means!!!

At the General Questions & Answers section of the Faith pages at www.ewtn.com, it has a whole page on Freemasonry and WHY we as Catholics may not join the Masons. Here’s a little snip of that (which should fit in this post). Thanks!

ewtn.com/expert/expertfaqframe.asp

**Declaration on Masonic Associations (Quaesitum est)

English Translation of a Latin Document from the Sacred Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith November 26, 1983

Therefore, the Church’s negative judgment in regard to Masonic associations remains unchanged since their principles have always been considered irreconcilable
with the doctrine of the Church and, therefore, membership in them remains forbidden. The faithful, who enroll in Masonic associations are in a state of grave
sin and may not receive Holy Communion.**

Here is some of the commentary on that made at the Faith Q&A page:

Masonry is not the Jaycees, in which people of all religions and philosophies come together to work on local business problems. Masonry has its own religious and philosophical worldview, its own religious language, its rituals and its morality. In the library of every lodge you will find Albert Pike’s Morals and Dogma. A top American Mason, he is the greatest writer on the real meaning behind Masonic beliefs and rituals. Even the title of his book shows that Masonry has a morality and a doctrine. If they are not Catholic morality and Catholic doctrine, and in fact they aren’t even Christian, a Catholic or any Christian may not follow them. This is why, since the 1700s the popes have consistently rejected Freemasonry as incompatible with the faith. The motives and works of most masons may be good and benign, but this does not change the choice which the Catholic has to make between the religious philosophy of masonry and that of Catholicism.

Thanks for listening…
Your sister in Christ, Veronica Anne
 
Steer clear of masonry. I found a 32nd degree mason in my parish who is not only a member of the Knights of Columbus, he is also a Eucharistic Minister. Masons are quietly lurking about in the Catholic Church, so please be aware of this.

[srmason-sj.org/web/journal-files/Issues/oct03/elias.htm](http://www.srmason-sj.org/web/journal-files/Issues/oct03/elias.htm)

Akram R. Elias, 33°
6100 Westchester Park Drive, Apt. 1616, College Park, Maryland 20740-2850

An article reprinted with permission from the California Freemason (Spring 2003) underlines the impressive growth of Freemasonry in Cuba.

http://www.srmason-sj.org/web/journal-files/Issues/oct03/elias-pin.jpgDuring his visit to Cuba in March 2002, Ill. Akram R. Elias, 33°, visited with His Eminence Jose Siro Gonzales Bacallal, Catholic Bishop of Pinar de Rio in Cuba, and put a Masonic pin of the Grand Master of the Grand Lodge of the District of Columbia on the Bishop’s shirt.

srmason-sj.org/web/temple.htm

This is not your typical ‘Good Ol’ Boys’ club either. Look very closely at the masonic symbols in these photographs below.

The Altar
The great altar is of Belgian black and gold marble, raised on a black marble plinth which was quarried in nearby Virginia.http://www.srmason-sj.org/web/temple-files/altar1.jpg

http://www.srmason-sj.org/web/temple-files/title-banner.gif

Offical banner of the Supreme Council, 33°, framed by columns of polished
green Windsor granite with bronze bases.http://www.srmason-sj.org/web/temple-files/banner1.jpg

http://www.srmason-sj.org/web/temple-files/title-sgcs.gif

“It is interesting to know that not only the architectural motives but everything in the building was especially designed and made under the architect’s direction. The fixtures, the furniture, the rags, were elaborately studied and carefully developed in this way.” The Architectural Review, January 1916.

http://www.srmason-sj.org/web/temple-files/sgcstation.jpg[/right]
 
Yes, the “evil” Masons who are part of the Shriners who have hospitals for burned children and provide reconstructive surgery to children with cleft pallets. The list of what they do is endless. ALL FREE OF CHARGE. Horrible people there those evil Masons.
:nope:
 
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Lilyofthevalley:
Yes, the “evil” Masons who are part of the Shriners who have hospitals for burned children and provide reconstructive surgery to children with cleft pallets. The list of what they do is endless. ALL FREE OF CHARGE. Horrible people there those evil Masons.
:nope:
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Lily, Masons are not horrible people. I love the person but I hate the sin. Satan is very cunning and likes to distort the TRUTH. Some of the good things done are just a smoke screen set up by no one other than Lucifer. It looks good to the natural but the supernatural is where satan operates.Thats how satan operates,hes a deciever and liar. There are alot of good works that we do BUT alot of these works are going to be burned up and thrown out when we come before our Lord on judgement day. If these works were not done in the right motive and right heart these works only gratify us on this earth and we get the glory here. If they were done to glorify the Lord thats another story The Lord will test everything we do. :confused:
 
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drparch:
Steer clear of masonry. I found a 32nd degree mason in my parish who is not only a member of the Knights of Columbus, he is also a Eucharistic Minister. Masons are quietly lurking about in the Catholic Church, so please be aware of this.

[srmason-sj.org/web/journal-files/Issues/oct03/elias.htm](http://www.srmason-sj.org/web/journal-files/Issues/oct03/elias.htm)

Akram R. Elias, 33°
6100 Westchester Park Drive, Apt. 1616, College Park, Maryland 20740-2850

An article reprinted with permission from the California Freemason (Spring 2003) underlines the impressive growth of Freemasonry in Cuba.

http://www.srmason-sj.org/web/journal-files/Issues/oct03/elias-pin.jpgDuring his visit to Cuba in March 2002, Ill. Akram R. Elias, 33°, visited with His Eminence Jose Siro Gonzales Bacallal, Catholic Bishop of Pinar de Rio in Cuba, and put a Masonic pin of the Grand Master of the Grand Lodge of the District of Columbia on the Bishop’s shirt.

srmason-sj.org/web/temple.htm

This is not your typical ‘Good Ol’ Boys’ club either. Look very closely at the masonic symbols in these photographs below.

The Altar
The great altar is of Belgian black and gold marble, raised on a black marble plinth which was quarried in nearby Virginia.http://www.srmason-sj.org/web/temple-files/altar1.jpg

http://www.srmason-sj.org/web/temple-files/title-banner.gif

Offical banner of the Supreme Council, 33°, framed by columns of polished
green Windsor granite with bronze bases.http://www.srmason-sj.org/web/temple-files/banner1.jpg

http://www.srmason-sj.org/web/temple-files/title-sgcs.gif

“It is interesting to know that not only the architectural motives but everything in the building was especially designed and made under the architect’s direction. The fixtures, the furniture, the rags, were elaborately studied and carefully developed in this way.” The Architectural Review, January 1916.

http://www.srmason-sj.org/web/temple-files/sgcstation.jpg[/right]
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Did you all notice the cunning serpents all around this temple both inside and outside. I wonder who they represent? And ladies and gentlement we have behind thes two curtains no other than the great architect of the universe LUCIFER :eek:
 
FACTS: The Scottish Rite of Freemasonry confers the 4th through 32nd degree (as well as the honorary 33rd degree). A York or Scottish Rite Mason is then eligible to join the Shriners.
Note that all Shriners are Master Masons, and swear an oath to Allah on the Koran promising to be faithful to Freemasonry.

Here is an audio file interview that Catholic Answers conducted with John Salza in May of 2001. John was a 32nd degree mason (And a Catholic too) who left the brotherhood. He is currently working on a book on masonry.

**Are Catholics Free 2 B Masons? *NO!
***John Salza
[Listen] - [

[Download[/color]John Salza’s website:http://www.scripturecatholic.com/](ftp://radio.catholic.com/calive/2001/ca010514.rm)
 
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flameburns623:
The Pentegram was a Christian symbol before it was expropriated around the turn of the 20th century by Aleister Crowley, who took it for the symbol of the Horned God. Prior to that the Pentacle represented Christ; the five points, the five wounds of Christ. Inverted it represented the Star of Behlehem, pointing downward to a manger.

In any case the square-and-compass symbol resemble a Star of David. ‘Way too much time in the ol’ Chick tracts, Flick427.

Yes: the majority of foundng fathers were Freemasons by some accoutns. Including George Washington, whom I note that you quote.
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Oh, I am aware of George Washington…I am in that “love the sinner hate the sin type attitude”. That is something that I don’t want to admit about him:crying: …😉 There are no doubt good freemasons who help society…just as there are bad Christians…The problem is FREEMASONRY, not the freemason…anytime you melt ideas together like they do, it weakens their individual faiths and conforms them to that of the group…people end up conforming to their buddies in the freemasons and not to their individual religions…this is the same reason that I am against the United Nations.
I underastand what you are saying…the symbol is not evil because it was Christian first…that is fine, but it is how it is looked at today that people see it and now associate it with something else…I think Satan perhaps does this to trick people…this happened with another symbol…it is a beautiful symbol that is actually part of nature and kids love it…what is it?..it’s the rainbow!..it use to be just a beautiful innocent thing, and now it is all over the place in California and many other places…homosexuals use it as a symbol…again, love the sinner, hate the sin…
 
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Lilyofthevalley:
Yes, the “evil” Masons who are part of the Shriners who have hospitals for burned children and provide reconstructive surgery to children with cleft pallets. The list of what they do is endless. ALL FREE OF CHARGE. Horrible people there those evil Masons.:nope:
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Recall that Satan often comes as an “angel of light” APPEARING to do good in order to snatch souls into his trap.
 
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drparch:
Steer clear of masonry. I found a 32nd degree mason in my parish who is not only a member of the Knights of Columbus, he is also a Eucharistic Minister. Masons are quietly lurking about in the Catholic Church, so please be aware of this.
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»»»» a member of the Knights of Columbus :eek:

Contact the Grand Knight and the Financial Secretary of that council and inform them of what you know. If they dismiss it or fail to take any type of action, contact the Supreme Council themselves at …

Knights of Columbus Headquarters
1 Columbus Plaza
New Haven, CT 06510
(203) 752-4000
Email: info@kofc.org

… a person can NOT be an active member of both groups!

»»»» he is also a Eucharistic Minister :eek:

Again, express your concerns to your pastor about this matter. Be sure to bring with you the reference material quoted in this thread which shows that Catholics can not be masons and show him that if he says that it is no longer an issue. If he should say that the church’s position on the matter has changed, ask him to provide you with a source of reference since you believe that you are in possession of the church’s current position. If he refuses to do so or fails to take action, escalate this matter to your local bishop.
 
Sir Knight said:
»»»» a member of the Knights of Columbus :eek:

Contact the Grand Knight and the Financial Secretary of that council and inform them of what you know. If they dismiss it or fail to take any type of action, contact the Supreme Council themselves at …

Knights of Columbus Headquarters
1 Columbus Plaza
New Haven, CT 06510
(203) 752-4000
Email: info@kofc.org

… a person can NOT be an active member of both groups!

»»»» he is also a Eucharistic Minister :eek:

Again, express your concerns to your pastor about this matter. Be sure to bring with you the reference material quoted in this thread which shows that Catholics can not be masons and show him that if he says that it is no longer an issue. If he should say that the church’s position on the matter has changed, ask him to provide you with a source of reference since you believe that you are in possession of the church’s current position. If he refuses to do so or fails to take action, escalate this matter to your local bishop.
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Don’t any of you understand it yet? The only ones "excommunicated " any more are those who cling to the Tridentine Mass of the Latin Rite you know… the SSPX. but any attemp to excommunicate or censur the Holy Sacrafice of the Mass only ends up excommuncating the ones who try to excommunicate the Mass!! NO BODY can "excommunicate " the “True Mass”. Read up on Pope Pius V and Pope Pius X … BOTH of them are SAINTS of Holy Mother Church.They have both decreed that the Tridentine Mass was to be the Mass the Church was to embrace " for all time and until the end of time.
 
Off-topic

General Reminder:

This discussion has strayed from its original topic of Freemasonry. Please return to the original topic under discussion. Thank you for your understanding and cooperation.

Paul Stephens
Moderator
 
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Lilyofthevalley:
Yes, the “evil” Masons who are part of the Shriners who have hospitals for burned children and provide reconstructive surgery to children with cleft pallets. The list of what they do is endless. ALL FREE OF CHARGE. Horrible people there those evil Masons.
:nope:
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