Gun Carrying Catholics Armed

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I would agree with that…except the military offers a lot of kids opportunities they may not otherwise have.

What would happen to the 18 year olds waiting to turn 21 if 21 was the total age of majority?
 
That’s a good question. But I feel consistency in what constitutes an adult in society is needed.
 
I don’t disagree with that. But that puts us back at square one, to me.

It’s a cultural problem. I wish I knew the answer; I think ALL of us agree on that.
 
Owning a gun may be a really good, moral, compassionate and religious thing to do. It’s also well within Catholic teaching to do so.

I’m glad we have these tools/inanimate objects to protect ourselves with.

#2A
 
Well, actually, no; the “weapon of choice” has been a semi automatic, whether it is a rifle or a pistol.

Oregon just recently had a proposed ballot which would have not only banned the AR-15 (and as written, banned it in the larger calibers used for hunting, as opposed to just the .223), but would also have banned a significant number of pistols, if not the majority, and any bolt action rifle which has a muzzle break - such as the .308 and the 6.5 Creedmore - all hunting riffles on up to the .50 cal.

Their comment was that the AR-15 is never used for hunting, only killing (There is a difference? Someone whould tell the mule deer I have harvested), implying it is only a military weapon.

I know of absolutely no military of any country which is armed with AR-15s. ’

As a matter of fact, the AR-15 is used extensively in coyote and other predator hunting (e.g. badgers and prairie dogs); it may be debatable whether it is more popular, or a bolt action rifle for such hunting.

It is also used in home defense (as occurred about a week ago in at least one instance).

and, to be honest, there have been reports that at least one gang in Chicago has moved to arming themselves with AR-15s as a step up in the gang warfare, and the pistol has become something bordering on “ubiquitous.”

Before I would go down the path of banning rifles of any sort, I would suggest that simply getting the information into the background check database is critical (e.g. Broward County/FBI failure in the Florida shooting and the military in the Texas church shooting). And having police agenicies which follow up on information of an individual who may be a threat (both of the above shootings, and the information given to police in the YouTube shooting by her father) is obviously critical.

As to banning 18 to 21 year olds; I have no problem with requiring them to go through some form of training before they can purchase (states do it now for under age hunters). But it seems an oxymoron that we would ban someone 18-21 from purchasing a .22 rifle, pistol or revolver, but it is okay to rain them to use and carry fully automatic weapons, just because they have gone through Basic and AIT training and are now walking somewhere in a war theater where there are both combatants and civilians.

There are an estimate 120,000,000 gun owners. While the AR-15 may be one of the most, if not the most popular configurations for rifles, estimates are that there are 2,000,000 rifles manufactured each year on average. If only 10% of them are AR-15s, do the math for several years worth of production.

(cont.)
 
(cont.) I have seen repeatedly that the Clinton semi-auto rifle ban was and is still considered ineffective. Not to mention that Columbine occurred during the ban, and that the boyos had one semi-auto rifle, on pistol, a double barreled shotgun and a pump shotgun. And 95 homemade bombs. As there were 37 expended shotgun shells and 151 expended 9mm shells, all four weapons were used (the carbine was 9mm, and I would leave it to forensics as to whether a 9mm or a .223 is a more “dangerous” round).

And from the Center for Disease Control, their study of defensive use of weapons pegs it between 500,000 and 2,000,000 times per year. that, and the CDC is not exactly known as a pro-gun organization.

I don’t know of anyone at all who would want school kids to be slaughtered. None. But there are a number of things we can do to protect children, beyond what I have mentioned above.

Most people, before they go to bed at night, check to see if the doors are locked. If we lock our homes to keep out unwanted individuals, why not schools? The Answer I received from 2 friends, both teachers and in nuclear meltdown over the Florida shooting, is that “Schools are community gathering places. We can’t lock them!”

Well, so is the local courthouse; and I have had to go through a checkpoint with armed deputies, and a metal detector to get in - for years. Oh, and did I mention airports?

As one police commander said, several days after the Florida incident: teachers, coaches and admin will be the first responders. Do we want them to show up with a pencil or a pistol? My two friends melted down further when I brought it up - totally aghast, and neither aware that Oregon is one of 18 states which allow (with rules and restrictions) teachers to be armed. And one of my friends made a blank statement “people can’t shoot accurately. they will kill someone else”.

And then we had Maryland… (and yes, it appears the shooter shot himself in the head; but the deputy on scene shot him in the hand as he was doing so - not exactly inaccurate shot placement).

And before we ban certain guns, we need to think about how many are legally owned. When we have literally hundreds of thousands of owners of a gun which (because of looks) scares some people, we need to ask if this is actually going to reduce the chances that someone who is mentally ill/mentally unstable is going to be stopped because of the ban. I would submit that is pure and unadulterated wishful thinking. We need to effectively enforce the rules on the books, and increase mental illness treatment.
 
I’ll be honest, my biggest motivation is I think 18 year olds are too dumb to be trusted with voting as a general rule.
 
In Oregeon, we now have a law requiring that a peer to peer gun transfer has to be done withe background checks.

I have yet to have even one single person - district attorney, police, sheriffs, or federal agency tell me how that is going to be enforced.

Oregon, and in particular from Portland down the valley to the southern border, is liberal (our Governor just said that she is going to prevent our Oregon National Guard from serving any duty on the southern border - aftr all, we are a sanctuary state) and this law was passed by the liberals. And I have absolutely no doubt (having heard some of them already doing so) that they are going around patting themselves on the back for making Oregon “safer”.

What absolute, idiotic, complete and thorough nonsense. They - both the libwerals and the police agneices have nothing whatsoever they can do unless a) someone voluntarily complies; b) the transfer occurs and someone says "Guess what? I just bought a gun from (Joe/Sally/whomever); or c) the purchaser commits a crime with the weapon, and admits where they obtained it.

Or d) the police start trying to set up “sting” operations, soliciting people to sell their guns to the police undercover agent.

Will it stop criminals from obtaining a gun, likely already owned by another criminal?

Really?

And as to arming teachers: Someone intent on mass killing comes into the school, and you, the teacher, have the children in lockdown in your classroom. does the door have a window? He can shoot through that, either to kill students he can see, or to open the door. Or he can fire at the door locking mechanism and possibly breach the door. Now what will you do - throw a pencil at him?

You also presume that if the shooting starts, you are going to be in cyour classroom; but you may, instead, be one of the teachers in the hallways trying to get students to cover - and he comes aroung the corner. Now what do you do? Throw a pencil?

I have a relative, school teacher, who took training because she had every intention of protecting her students, and she carried.

And amusingly, one of the male teachers said, not entirely jokingly, that if the shooting started, he was coming to her classroom.

Not all teachers should carry. In fact, many should not carry; they either do not have the ability to shoot someone who intends murder, or they are prone to panic reaction under stress, or they simply cannot shoot effectively in a stress situation. Those that can may be the one who stops mayhem in its tracks. The fact that an individual cannot or would not carry should have no influence on allowing someone else, competent and competently trained, to do so. As the police commander from another jurisdiction said after Florida: " teachers, coaches and admin are the first responders. Do we want them to show up with a pencil or a pistol?
 
if you are brought up with gun bearing being one of your laws/rights (forgive terminology) then it’s going to be how you see life. Other place where you aren’t brought up with guns such as UK are going to vote differently (possibly) just because police don’t even carry guns (except a minority of them) and the general public certainly don’t unless criminals or possibly in the countryside famers may own shotguns etc. point is it is rarely legal.
Yeah. I genuinely don’t get Americans when they say that it’s their right to have all of these weapons. From someone in a country where you just can’t get a gun (and thankfully, gun control works really well here), it seems a little odd. I don’t think extremely strict gun control would work in the states now (too late for that), but just their attitudes towards guns have always been weird for us here.
 
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I am currently in Washington, though thankfully not a legal resident. Thank God for active military status.

You have my empathy.

I hate to tell your genius governor (and I feel fairly certain you know this already), but the President can conscript the National Guard into Federal service over her ruling. Imma pop popcorn and a cork and watch this one on the northern sidelines.
 
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Agreed.

Which is why I’m not a big fan of representative government.
 
The only problem I have with raising the age of adulthood is that we simply delay the aging process. As a society, we’re not transitioning kids to adults. We’re just becoming bigger kids. Raising age requirements add to the problem, as we’re delaying even more the age we’re telling kids when they can be an adult. 16? 18? 21? 26? 30? 55? 65? 70? If we move things up to 18 -if we expect kids to be adults, then that’ll help fight the trend before we have a bunch of 30 year Olds living in their parents’ basements on suboptimal jobs.
 
Yeah I don’t disagree.

Modern society will probably collapse here before long anyway. It’s a self correcting problem.
 
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→ Okay, this last one isn’t part of the collection yet.

Yes, I do carry.

Boclucky: Don’t we already have that?

Lea101: London topped NYC’s murder rate lately… Think about that for a moment. None of my 40 +/- firearms has jumped up and killed anybody.

Mrsdizzy: You know how you protect society from the mentally ill? It’s not “politically correct,” but you institutionalize them.

PetraG: Here’s the problem, who says that the robber (please note, that is different from a “thief”) wouldn’t simply kill to get rid of the witness?
 
Conjecture
I conceal carry, and I don’t consider myself paranoid in the least. I don’t do it all the time - usually only at night when the trip to Walmart becomes necessary for whatever reason.

Live where I live - meth central, ah, the PNW - and you might not think it’s such a bad idea.

I’ll agree that every Tom, Dick, and Harry shouldn’t just be handed a CC permit. I’m not a firearms expert but I have a lot more training than some of the - ahem - individuals I see at the range, and that scares me sometimes. I think there should be a standard for handing out a permit, and a lot of states have basically no standard. I don’t agree with that.
 
I was a member of an all women’s gun club at one of my last duty stations.

The handgun was unloaded, but I actually took a pistol out of a woman’s hand when she continuously pointed it at me, totally oblivious to anything she was doing, thus violating MULTIPLE handgun rules, and reported her to the range officer.
  • no muzzle discipline
  • treat every weapon as though loaded
  • don’t point the muzzle at anything you don’t intend to shoot
She wasn’t happy with me, but far more women around her were.
 
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