How and why to pray through Mary?

[Eilish_Maura]

Absolutely. As Catholics, we believe in the “Communion of Saints” and that in addition to us attending Mass, all of those who have passed on before us are there as well. Tthough we can’t see them, they are there just as much as the elderly man who sat to my right and the young Mother & Dad who sat to my left, with their 3 darling children, last Sunday.

I heard once that the reason that the priest takes a few steps back at the beginning of the Roman Cannon, is that he must make room for Our Blessed Lady & the Communion of Saints…who are present with us at every celebration of the Mass. Don’t know if that’s true or just a legend, but I like it.

That would be just some pious thought the person you heard it from liked.

Still - none of this has anything to do with the OPs issue in the opening post.

 

[CradleCath]

That would be just some pious thought the person you heard it from liked.

Still - none of this has anything to do with the OPs issue in the opening post.

Do you believe in the Communion of Saints…that’s not a “pious story”, but a doctrine of the Church. From the Roman Canon of the Mass:

**In union with the whole Church **

we honor Mary, the ever-virgin mother of Jesus Christ our Lord and God. We honor Joseph, her husband, the apostles and martyrs Peter and Paul, Andrew, (James, John, Thomas, James, Philip, Bartholomew, Matthew, Simon and Jude; we honor Linus, Cletus, Clement, Sixtus, Cornelius, Cyprian, Lawrence, Chrysogonus, John and Paul, Cosmas and Damian) and all the saints.** May their merits and prayers grant us your constant help and protection.
(Through Christ our Lord. Amen.)**

Either we ARE in Communion with all of the saints, both living & dead,…or we aren’t. What do you think??

 

[Peter_Da_Rock]

I am a Catholic.

Good for you!

But in my childhood I was bombarded with Protestant beliefs and ideologies.

You have my sympathy

I’m still a Catholic though. But, to this day I find it difficult or sometimes even silly to pray through Mary or the saints.

If it feels silly, then don’t do it. Only do what is comfortable to you provided what you do is not a mortal sin.

I pray to Jesus and the Father.

Good.

And I’m heard.

Yes you are

So why should I pray through Mary or the saints?

It’s optional. You don’t have to. If someone has told you, “You SHOULD” then that person is off the beaten path.

How can I be sure that St.“so and so” is hearing me?

**We and you can’t be sure they are hearing us or that they are actually in heaven for that matter. It is a best guess IMHO based on the fruits of the Saint. What we do know is that those in Heaven are very much aware of what is going on here on Earth according to Revelations. **

Rev. 6:9-11 – the martyred saints in heaven cry out in a loud voice to God to avenge their blood “on those who dwell upon the earth.” These are “imprecatory prayers,” which are pleas for God’s judgment (see similar prayers in Psalm 35:1; 59:1-17; 139:19; Jer. 11:20; 15:15; 18:19; Zech.1:12-13). This means that the

Now how they know, could be debated for years. We also know that the prayers of the saints are presented to God, so there is some indication that the prayers on our lips do not go directly to God at times. These prayers are held somehow and presented along with Incense.

Rev. 5:8 - the prayers of the saints (on heaven and earth) are presented to God by the angels and saints in heaven. This shows that the saints intercede on our behalf before God, and it also demonstrates that our prayers on earth are united with their prayers in heaven. (The “24 elders” are said to refer to the people of God – perhaps the 12 tribes and 12 apostles - and the “four living creatures” are said to refer to the angels.)

Rev. 8:3-4 – in heaven an angel mingles incense with the prayers of all the saints on the golden altar before the throne of God, and the smoke of the incense rose with the prayers of the saints from the hand of the angel before God. These prayers “rise up” before God and elicit various kinds of earthly activity. God responds to his children’s requests, whether made by his children on earth or in heaven.

And what’s the advantage of doing that when I know Christ hears me and so does the Father?

**Well let me answer that with a similar question: What’s the advantage of asking another person(such as your best friend) to pray for you? Since Christ and God hear all, it would seem pointless to ask anyone to pray for you at all. **

Or is it that they cannot always hear me?

Where did you get that Idea?

When did this practice of praying through Mary and the saints begin?

I do not know. The when is irrelavant to me since it is supported in Scripture. Other than it probably started when the last verse that supports the concept was put in ink for all the ages.

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NOW Eilish Maura Have I answered everything with some reasonable modicum?

 

[TLara]

I just find it funny that a few people on this thread will not accept the Catholic churches interpretation of the Bible but accept the Bible that the Catholic church Alone put together.

 

[Peter_Da_Rock]

I just find it funny that a few people on this thread will not accept the Catholic churches interpretation of the Bible but accept the Bible that the Catholic church Alone put together.

Most will deny that the Catholic Church was responsible. Some will even claim that the Councils in the 300s were not Catholic Councils but Protestant Councils. You can’t deal with that type of Invincible Ignorance.

 

[Eilish_Maura]

Do you believe in the Communion of Saints…that’s not a “pious story”, but a doctrine of the Church. From the Roman Canon of the Mass:

Either we ARE in Communion with all of the saints, both living & dead,…or we aren’t. What do you think??

Nothing here addresses the OP’s initiating post for this thread.

 

[Peter_Da_Rock]

I did in Post 143

 

[Eilish_Maura]

Do you believe in the Communion of Saints…that’s not a “pious story”, but a doctrine of the Church.

Seems you overlooked the specific part of your post I remarked on – that is the idea the priest steps back to allow room for the Communion of Saints. That is a ‘pious story’ unless you have found something in the GIRM that explains it.

 

[Eilish_Maura]

If it is easier and more effective for 2 people to lift something…or three…or four…why limit it?

Is it really more ‘effective’? Does God answer prayers based volume of folks praying for your concern?

 

[Eilish_Maura]

Good for you!
You have my sympathy
If it feels silly, then don’t do it. Only do what is comfortable to you provided what you do is not a mortal sin.
Good.
Yes you are
It’s optional. You don’t have to. If someone has told you, “You SHOULD” then that person is off the beaten path.
**We and you can’t be sure they are hearing us or that they are actually in heaven for that matter. It is a best guess IMHO based on the fruits of the Saint. What we do know is that those in Heaven are very much aware of what is going on here on Earth according to Revelations. **Now how they know, could be debated for years. We also know that the prayers of the saints are presented to God, so there is some indication that the prayers on our lips do not go directly to God at times. These prayers are held somehow and presented along with Incense.

**Well let me answer that with a similar question: **What’s the advantage of asking another person(such as your best friend) to pray for you? Since Christ and God hear all, it would seem pointless to ask anyone to pray for you at all.
Where did you get that Idea?
I do not know. The when is irrelavant to me since it is supported in Scripture. Other than it probably started when the last verse that supports the concept was put in ink for all the ages.

---

NOW Eilish Maura Have I answered everything with some reasonable modicum?

You might want to watch out how you use the quote feature - like making sure to keep the ID of the person quoted attached to the quote. It improves readability and won’t misrepresent what the OP’s concerns are.

At least you have not gone off on some of the tangents others have.

 

[Peter_Da_Rock]

You might want to watch out how you use the quote feature - like making sure to keep the ID of the person quoted attached to the quote. It improves readability and won’t misrepresent what the OP’s concerns are.

At least you have not gone off on some of the tangents others have.

Well Pardon Me My Lady, I should have used a different color for the Revations Quotes. Thank you so kindly for being so asinine. May I return the favor one day.

 

[LilyM]

Matthew 4:1-11. Three times Jesus was tempted by the Devil and each time Jesus replied exactly the same three dangerous words that defeated the Devil: “IT IS WRITTEN” Read it for yourself! If any one could have used oral tradition, it was Jesus, yet he chose the only safe and sure way to defeat Satan: Scripture. We just with that the Roman Catholic and Orthodox churches held scripture alone in the same high regard!*

NO! Jesus’ death on the cross and resurrection defeated the Devil and nothing else - his quotes of scripture did nothing more than stump him for a while and make him go away ‘until a more favourable season’. And remember the Devil quoted scripture right back at Jesus too, so it doesn’t have any sort of magical power over him.

2 Timothy 3:16-17: No matter how traditionalists twist it, it still says that scripture alone is all-sufficient to equip us for EVERY good work.

 

[Fortuna]

God clearly teaches His children how to pray and He expects His children to obey His teaching on prayer. Therefore He doesn’t need a verse that says don’t pray to Mary. God has already made it clear that His children on earth should be praying for each other and that they should be praying to Him.

None of the Bible verses that you have posted teach Christians to pray through Mary.

There is no biblical evidence for praying through Mary, period.

.

HOLY COW ! Just say the rosary and ask Mother Mary to intercede. If She thinks you are worthy, you will be amazed at how quickly the intercession or answer to your prayer is.

Why does everyone have to make it so complicated? SHE HEARS US! OK?

At least She has interceded for me and I bless Her for it.

We intercede when we pray for others, what is the big deal?!!

St. George has recently intrceded for me as well.

If you are praying “alone”, she makes the two or more criteria to be heard!

Sorry, religion is not in the neat and tidy little package you would like it to be. Grow up!

Fortuna :banghead: uch:

 

[Eilish_Maura]

If you are praying “alone”, she makes the two or more criteria to be heard!

Where does the Church list the ‘criteria to be heard’?

 

[LilyM]

Where does the Church list the ‘criteria to be heard’?

I think this poster was thinking of Matthew 18:19 which says ‘if any two of you shall agree upon earth about anything for which they shall ask, it shall be granted …’

 

[Ceil-1]

Through Gods written word, all Gods teaching re prayer is in His written word. (By EmeraldIsle)

Really, says who?

(Could someone send me advice on how to pass on quotations? It doesn’t seem to work anymore. )

 

[dmelosi]

Through Gods written word, all Gods teaching re prayer is in His written word. (By EmeraldIsle)

Really, says who?

(Could someone send me advice on how to pass on quotations? It doesn’t seem to work anymore. )

Hit the quote button to the bottom right, then notice when you are starting with quote ] the text here shows as the quote / ending quote]

 

[Fortuna]

I think this poster was thinking of Matthew 18:19 which says ‘if any two of you shall agree upon earth about anything for which they shall ask, it shall be granted …’

Precisely! Thank you for finding this so quickly.

 

[Fortuna]

Where does the Church list the ‘criteria to be heard’?

I was stating this a little tongue-in-cheek, but the Matthew 18:19 is perfect, not to mention St. Chrysostom’s prayer. . .“and you have promised through your well-beloved Son that when two or three are gathered together in His Name you will be in the midst of them. . .”

With Mary petitioning with me, I never feel “alone” and I feel her support and love as we pray together.

Regardless, I feel that all who love and accept Jesus as their lord and savior are heard, it is just nice to have prayer “friends” and intercessors don’t you think?

God Bless, Fortuna

 

[SORROWS]

HOLY COW ! Just say the rosary and ask Mother Mary to intercede. If She thinks you are worthy, you will be amazed at how quickly the intercession or answer to your prayer is.

Why does everyone have to make it so complicated? SHE HEARS US! OK?

At least She has interceded for me and I bless Her for it.

We intercede when we pray for others, what is the big deal?!!

St. George has recently intrceded for me as well.

If you are praying “alone”, she makes the two or more criteria to be heard!

Sorry, religion is not in the neat and tidy little package you would like it to be. Grow up!

Fortuna :banghead: uch: