How do Catholics feel about whether countries should ban Niqab/Burka (full face covering) or not?

  • Thread starter Thread starter Rozellelily
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GiftofMercy said:
looks photo shopped
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Possibly, but I’ve been to that beach (two years ago), and there are bikinis aplenty. There are numerous snaps of that place on line, if you care to look. Or go to a travel agent and peruse their stuff. Best of all…visit the beach, and see for yourself!

It has to be said, of course, that skimpy beachwear is not permitted away from the sand. Wearing such clothing in town will get you arrested (be you male or female!).

The fact is that non-Muslim women are not bound by the Sharia, and therefore are under no obligation to wear headscarves. I have - in Muslim lands - seen Western women with headscarves (presumably worn out of respect for local custom and culture), and others without…mostly without.
 
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My personal opinion is that it is ok to use, however if the authority asks the person to uncover to be able to fully id the person (for example when requesting a passport, boarding a plane, etc) this should not be considered being a bigot or discriminating against someone.

My main concern is how to ensure terrorist and other people wanting to do harm, will not abuse this to make it harder for authorities to id them.
 
Realistically isn’t it the case though,that some women who dress full covered like in the photo have negative/disparaging/snobby/disdain thoughts about the girls in bikinis on Jumeirah beach?
So while it’s not illegal (in this case the Bikinis instead of the Niqab) doesn’t it still point to the social issues that can occur because of being “two vastly different worlds”?
Sure not everyone has to friends with each other but I’m not sure it’s a good thing either when people aren’t “open to each other”.

I’m not sure would Dubai even be this mixed/progressive/whatever if it wasn’t that they want/need tourists and expats money now that oil is not looking as economically prosperous for UAE future?
Is it tolerance or is it strategic thinking (economics)…
 
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You realize of course that nowhere in the Koran does it say that women should wear veils. But St Paul does say that women should wear veils.
 
Rozellelily said:
Realistically isn’t it the case though,that some women who dress full covered like in the photo have negative/disparaging/snobby/disdain thoughts about the girls in bikinis on Jumeirah beach?
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I imagine those thoughts are just as commonly reciprocated.
 
I’m sure they probably are.
To me though,even to dress in “moderate” modesty as according to culture/religion (eg:long dresses or hijab) can attract others to think negative things so why the need to “go extreme”.
I don’t mean that women should be overly concerned of others opinions but I mean more that modesty is already covered by wearing a hijab so what’s the necessity of Niqab etc anyway?

It just seems to me to be an extremist/unbalanced/unhealthy interpretation of the quran.
I guess people are free to think/wear whatever they want but I don’t think either extreme is good for society-either covering the face or very skimpy clothing like rubber dresses or shorts that show your bum cheeks etc.

Considering that some men from Muslim middle eastern or African nations can be really pervy/sleazy anyway seems to suggest that wearing Niqab or similar has not solved the lust issue for them.
 
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I understand your point because there are different Islamic “sects” with different interpretations but at the same time I take the view that people are free to have opinions in any topics.

An analogy like saying that a Chinese university academic can’t be an expert or opinion on Australia foreign policy and politics or vice versa etc…

Here we also have Islamic studies courses,Indigenous affairs course etc that are open to everyone.
There’s a saying:a person doesn’t have to be a chef to know (“judge”) good or bad food.
Besides, there are Muslim women who also say they believe those people’s interpretation is extreme.

I am not a expert on the Quran by any stretch,or an expert on the Bible by any stretch either but I have a general idea based off what I have heard/read through moderate Muslim friends.
Also I have Muslim neighbours,interact with Muslims all the time,
45 % of my ethnic background is Muslim,muslim family friends etc…
It is not “foreign” to me.

My opinions/perceptions are based on human behavior.Sometimes human behavior has religious cause,sometimes it has other causes but the person believes it’s purely religious cause.

If some Muslims want to have opinions/concerns about for example some Christians living in bunkers because they believe a “rapture” is imminent or some extremist Christians not allowing dancing I don’t really have an issue with that at all.🤷‍♀️

Personally I believe that the Christians with these beliefs it’s just as “unhealthy” but those Christians are generally foreign to Europe and Australia and it seems more prevalent in USA so I can only really raise topics that are relevant locally.
 
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Rozellelily said:
Also I have Muslim neighbours,interact with Muslims all the time,
45 % of my ethnic background is Muslim,muslim family friends etc…
It is not “foreign” to me.
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You’re still not Muslim. If an atheist hung out with me and had many Catholic neighbors, family members, etc I wouldn’t appreciate him telling me my interpretation of the Bible was unhealthy. Actually, many atheists do just that, telling us we believe in a fairy tale and that Jesus is no more real than the Easter Bunny and it’s psychologically unhealthy and bad for society and used to oppress people. And we don’t like it.

My impression however is that this is falling on deaf ears and you feel quite entitled to give your opinions on how Muslims should interpret your own holy book. Good luck with that. Don’t be surprised if they don’t like, want or appreciate your (name removed by moderator)ut. I personally think you are showing a lot of disrespect towards their faith. Muting now.
 
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I feel the same concern with Christian extremists.Things are called extreme for a reason.If a person is viewed as not respectful for questioning extremes and not accepting all extremes and all extreme mindsets should just be accepted…then I don’t know…

There has to be a balance between being respectful vs not addressing healthy choices.
Australia,Bulgaria,France etc…they must of had societal issues and reasons to ban it.They wouldn’t just have done it for no reason.

I don’t support a legal ban but I don’t think a woman who chooses this is always thinking clearly either.

Just like many commentators share their opinion about Christianity openly (and sometimes really derogatory ones) on tv etc and I’m happy for them to talk about it I don’t think topics relating to Islam should be taboo either.

I even know Muslim parents who have become very upset and distraught because their daughter has decided to start wearing a niqab.

Is it being disrespectful to not accept something as healthy?
I don’t think people becoming transgender like Bruce Jenner is healthy either.
Its a bit far fetched but if Bruce/Caitlin now made a new religion which said part of his religion was that transgender ideology was accepted under God would I be disrespectful I didn’t agree with this either and had an opinion?

Surely there has to be a way to discuss these issues?
 
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Rozellelily said:
I don’t mean that women should be overly concerned of others opinions but I mean more that modesty is already covered by wearing a hijab so what’s the necessity of Niqab etc anyway?
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The women who choose to wear it usually tell me it’s their way of showing extra devotion. Like if covering up everywhere but their palms, face and feet is God’s will, they will please God if they take a step further and cover their face and wear gloves as well.

Now I don’t understand it, even the idea of covering one’s head even in chapels. But it’s their business. I’m not a moral relativist, but some sort of relativism when it comes to dress and the law is good.
 
poche said:
You realize of course that nowhere in the Koran does it say that women should wear veils. But St Paul does say that women should wear veils.
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Christian veiling was about covering the hair, not the face.

D
 
Looking at this picture, so someone who would need to wear a mask for medical reasons is not allowed to or would be stopped and have to remove it to explain?
 
Tis_Bearself said:
I don’t care if somebody wears a burka, as long as they agree to show their face for necessary security purposes, for example picking a child up from school, going through airport security, showing that they match a picture on their drivers license, etc.
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This!..
 
The erlaubt unter … means allowed under certain conditions (for reasons of medicine) so technically they are allowed due to medical reason but how it would actually work out on a practical sense who knows.
My assumption is that the person would wear it but if the police approached them they would need to provide an explanation.
 
Dan_Defender said:
They did this in the province of Quebec:
Act respecting the laicity of the State - Wikipedia
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It’s not about security. Quebec is very big on protecting its distinct French but not exactly French identity.
Or it may just have something to do with them being French since the same attitude is prevalent in France yet Quebeckers care nothing about what happens in the Old World. It might be genetic. (Please Note: This uploaded content is no longer available.)
 
One of my best friends is Modern Orthodox Jewish. She covers her hair in public, wears long skirts, and blouses with long sleeves. She is the least oppressed woman I know.
 
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