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placido
Guest
That is faulty human reasoning. You can give birth to something that already existed IF that is what God wills.
The Incarnation – the eternal God becoming flesh – is indeed a mystery.
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The Incarnation – the eternal God becoming flesh – is indeed a mystery.
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Rumpelstiltskin
Guest
Which brings us BACK to the question…! If you say God is your Father and you INSIST that Mary is the mother of God, then there is no question that Mary must be your grandmother.
Right?
We really have to apply the same sequence of logic throughout, otherwise it would be very lame.
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Rumpelstiltskin
Guest
A surrogate mother also gives birth to a child who is not hers. But is she the real mother?
She’s not.
.
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Rumpelstiltskin
Guest
You cannot give birth to something that already exist in the case of God because if you do, you are implying that there is a point in time where just before God appears again (re-birth), there was no God.
Let’s not confuse ourselves here. There is no mystery.
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campeador
Guest
What is lame is you trying to understand God on human terms. You show the Mighty Creator much disrespect.
- May the most holy, most sacred, most adorable, most incomprehensible and ineffable Name of God be forever praised, blessed, loved, adored and glorified in Heaven, on earth, and under the earth, by all the creatures of God, and by the Sacred Heart of Our Lord Jesus Christ,in the Most Holy Sacrament of the Altar.
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placido
Guest
Not at all. Mary if Mother of God the Son not God the Father. Therefore, God the Father is my father; Mary is my mother and God the Son is my brother.
Exactly!!!
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placido
Guest
The only confusion I see here is when people who claim to be Bible believing Christians actually refuse to believe what the Bible says.
The Bible says the son born of virgin is God (Isaiah 7:14, 9:6).
To redeem humanity God sent His only Son. And how did God do that? Did JGod the Son jump out of heaven and landed in Palestine? No!
He was conceived in Mary’s womb (Luke 1:31, 42). And was born in Bethlehem (Luke 2:4, 7). Jesus has a mother (John 19:25).
And who is Jesus’ mother? Mary (Luke 1:27). Jesus is Mary’s FIRSTBORN (Luke 2:7). Can someone who was not born be a firstborn? No!
I think you need to calm down and prayerfully consider the Biblical evidence again.
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placido
Guest
A surrogate what? Mother! Yet you fail to see the word “mother” in a the very phrase you are writing? Does the bible say Mary was a surrogate mother? Do you always believe what the Bible says or only when it fits you?
Mary is Jesus’ mother, says the Bible.
“No,” says Rumpelstiltskin.
That is, unfortunately, how some “Bible believing Christians” actually reject the Bible.
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LilyM
Guest
Rump, the WHOLE durn idea of the Incarnation is a mystery. Or are you really deluding yourself that it’s entirely logically and rationally comprehensible that infinite, immortal, all-powerful God became finite, mortal, limited man? Of course it isn’t, which is why the majority of the world’s people believe no such thing occurred.
But you take it on faith that it DID happen, in a manner impossible for the human mind to grasp, and that He did take on humanity, although that concept also certainly can’t compute by human reasoning either. After all, how is it possible when the Holy Spirit is eternal - GOD is eternal - and the fleshly body of Jesus wasn’t?
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GaryTaylor
Guest
You need to actually “read” scripture. Read LUKE. Here we go one more time with the Truth. Debating semantics is only a diversion of Truth. When you say the Bible never said? Your wrong and you need read the Bible. Matter of Fact if you get you hand on a copy of REV ROSWELL translation of the BIBLE it would be well worth it. Its first release was 1869. I use an original 1st edition copy. And its one of the Best translations to English EVER. Copys are inexpensive, the 1st edition though is $2000-$5000.
Luke…
1:26 -And in the 6th month the angel Gabriel was sent “from GOD” to a city in Galilee named Nazareth.
1:27- To a Virgin espoused to a man whose name was Joseph, and the Virgins name was MARY.
1:28-And the Angle came in unto her, and said, HAIL, thou that are “HIGHLY FAVOURED” , the LORD is with thee: “Blessed ART THOU AMONG WOMEN” [BTW- This is also where the Prayer Hail Mary originates].
1:30-And the Angel said unto her, Fear Not MARY, for thou has found favor with GOD"
1:31- And, behold, thou shall conceive in thy womb, and bring forth a Son, and shall call his name JESUS.
1:32-He shall be GREAT, and shall be called the Son of the Highest: and the Lord GOD shall give unto him the throne of his father David:
1:33-And he shall reign over the house of Jacob forever; and of his Kingdom there shall be NO END.
1:34- Mary said to the Angel, How shall this be, seeing I know NOT a MAN?
1-35- And the Angel answered and said unto her, The HOLY GHOST shall come upon thee, and the Power of the Highest shall overshadow thee: therefore also “the HOLY which shall born of thee”, shall be called “the SON OF GOD”.
1-37- For with GOD NOTHING is IMPOSSIBLE
1-41- And it came to pass, that, Eliabeth heard " the salutation of Mary", the babe leaped in her Womb, and Elizabeth was filled with the Holy Ghost.
1-42 Eliazabeth spoke with a loud voice { remember now she’s filled with the Holy Ghost} BLESSED ART THIOU AMONG WOMEN, AND BLESSED IS THE FRUIT OF THY WOMB {and the Prayer Hail-Mary and she’s BLESSED and her child Jesus is BLESSED}
1-46 And Mary said “MY SOUL MAGNIFYS THE LORD”
1-47- And my Spirit has rejoiced in God my Saviour.
LUKE
2-11 For unto you is born a “SAVIOUR which is CHRIST the LORD”
2-13- And suddenly there was with an Angel a mulitude of the Heavenly Host praising GOD and saying ,
2-14- Glory to God in the Highest, and on Earth Peace, and Good will towards Men.
And the chapter go’s on with John the Baptist claiming the one I Baptise will be greater and than me. And another Mystery of Faith with Jesus being left at the Temple by Mary and Joseph, And when they returned Jesus is speaking to the Teachers and the Elect and they amazed at the Boys understanding and Intellect.
Summary. Mary is the Mother of the Lord Jesus Christ. Jeusu Christ is the Trinity which “IS GOD”. Maryt has GREAT FAVOR with GOD. And if read the Wedding of CANA its eveident JESUS/GOD cannot refure MARY anything she asks of him. THus we have MARY the Co REDEEMER of mankind through the Trinity.
SO LETS TALK about LUKE? What is not understood? Mary is the MOTHER of JESUS. Jesus is the SON of GOD. This is the TRINITY. Of all ANGELS even they refer to her as HAIL MARY, THE LORD IS WITH THEE, BLESSED IS THE FRUIT of thy WOMB, JESUS. Mary has be given FAVOR by GOD.
How much clearer can this possible be? Think about this. And this is just LUKE.
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KathleenGee
Guest
People need to know this issue of True God and True Man was defined in the Nicene Creed, and thus the full revelation of God ended with Jesus Christ.
People don’t understand what a tremendous gift of love the Heavenly Father gave us through His Son by allowing God to become Man, and bring His divinity to daily, earthly human life…Christ among us…
It is a concept so simple and yet so profound…Christ among us, Christ’s Divinity united among us.
This past weekend I spent time reading ancient documents affirming the presence of Christ’s flesh in the Eucharist. Catholicism calls upon certitude of faith, not endless doubting and disputes. Our sacraments are concrete.
I was in another home. They have a book there written by a Protestant explaining the different Christian denomination and that his attempt was to be factual about every single church. As I read the description of Catholicism, I was impressed with the author’s veracity…He admitted that the Church went back to Apostolic days, back to the very beginning.
He also covered history, but got stuck on the corruption of the Middle Ages, assuming this was widespread and in every country and class. He was objective in his studies of the monasteries and the great work they have done. Overall, I was impressed with the book, written prior to Vatican II if I am correct…
People don’t understand what a tremendous gift of love the Heavenly Father gave us through His Son by allowing God to become Man, and bring His divinity to daily, earthly human life…Christ among us…
It is a concept so simple and yet so profound…Christ among us, Christ’s Divinity united among us.
This past weekend I spent time reading ancient documents affirming the presence of Christ’s flesh in the Eucharist. Catholicism calls upon certitude of faith, not endless doubting and disputes. Our sacraments are concrete.
I was in another home. They have a book there written by a Protestant explaining the different Christian denomination and that his attempt was to be factual about every single church. As I read the description of Catholicism, I was impressed with the author’s veracity…He admitted that the Church went back to Apostolic days, back to the very beginning.
He also covered history, but got stuck on the corruption of the Middle Ages, assuming this was widespread and in every country and class. He was objective in his studies of the monasteries and the great work they have done. Overall, I was impressed with the book, written prior to Vatican II if I am correct…
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KathleenGee
Guest
The other problem people have is they have no history of the development of faith into the churches throughout the world, just those mentioned in the Epistles. People have no concept of how faith was incarnated into the culture.
It has been our tradition, how we have practiced our faith for the past 2,000 years, that we have always honored the Mother of God…
If people can venerate Rose Kennedy and the Queen Mother, how much more we should venerate and honor the Blessed Mother of Jesus, God and Man. Mary is the Mother of God and the Mother of Mankind in Christ. Who saved and restored us to the Heavenly Father.
It has been our tradition, how we have practiced our faith for the past 2,000 years, that we have always honored the Mother of God…
If people can venerate Rose Kennedy and the Queen Mother, how much more we should venerate and honor the Blessed Mother of Jesus, God and Man. Mary is the Mother of God and the Mother of Mankind in Christ. Who saved and restored us to the Heavenly Father.
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Tomster
Guest
Moon,
Well, well, well. Your true colors are shining brightly for all of us to examine.
Have you ever heard of the terms Gnosticism and Nestorianism?
Your fallible and unauthoritative teachings are riddled with them.
G
GaryTaylor
Guest
Through Luke we conclude, Mary is the mother of GOD. Mary is Blessed. Mary is above all the Angels, Saints. Mary recieves much Favor from GOD, and, at this point, RESPECT. More than any other Woman ever. Jesus/God are of the same, the Trinity. Thus we conlude through Marys live of service to Jesus, LORD/GOD. She forefills her obligations, remains sin free, thus gains ever “more respect” of GOD. MARY is the Queen of Heaven. Anything and Everything she asks of the Trinity? She is granted. MARY being the mother of Jesus has much concern for MAN. As a mother and now Queen of Heaven. She has much love and concern for all the followers of the Catholic/Christian faith who have accepted the Bible as the Word of God, who accept that GOD is there one and only TRUE GOD. Mary tells us there is GREAT concern in Heaven and GOD for man. She offers us the path to Heaven through her she promise’s to deliever those who accept the Bible and Scripture of GOD. And then also tell us “In the end my IMMACULTE HEART will Triumph” So what she said will happen, WILL HAPPEN, If man does not ammend his ways and accept her Son as GOD and the Savior.
She interceeds for us on Gods behalf, to save us, and brings us to GOD. And this “is” the teachings of the Catholic Faith. Mary tells us, if “you” become children of the ROSARY, my children, you will become my SON and Brothers and Sisters of my Son. God, in Heaven.
Is MARY the ONLY way in the Bible? Well that would be to say, that GOD can’t save. This is not true. GOD can save and he has saved, Mose, John and others “are” examples of this. But GOD in the New Testament, chose to come to us through MARY, Now wouldn’t it make perfect sense that GOD would want us to come to him by the “EXACT” way he chose to come to us, through MARY?
She interceeds for us on Gods behalf, to save us, and brings us to GOD. And this “is” the teachings of the Catholic Faith. Mary tells us, if “you” become children of the ROSARY, my children, you will become my SON and Brothers and Sisters of my Son. God, in Heaven.
Is MARY the ONLY way in the Bible? Well that would be to say, that GOD can’t save. This is not true. GOD can save and he has saved, Mose, John and others “are” examples of this. But GOD in the New Testament, chose to come to us through MARY, Now wouldn’t it make perfect sense that GOD would want us to come to him by the “EXACT” way he chose to come to us, through MARY?
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Tomster
Guest
Moon,
Hoping the Holy Spirit will enlighten your mind, I give you these links:
oce.catholic.com/index.php?title=Nestorius_and_Nestorianism
and
oce.catholic.com/index.php?title=Gnosticism
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Tomster
Guest
Moon,
Have you ever heard of the term Hypostatic Union?
Just for you:
oce.catholic.com/index.php?title=Hypostatic_Union
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placido
Guest
According to Rumpelstiltskin & Co the Bible is lying – the Saviour was not born and even if He was born, Mary was not involved. So strong is the hatred towards Mary (Rev 12:13) …
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Tomster
Guest
Moon,
Within the context of the authoritative teaching we are providing for you, you would do well to review the following since it was demonstrated on another thread that your Incarnational Theology is seriously lacking:
oce.catholic.com/index.php?title=Incarnation
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Tomster
Guest
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VetA
Guest
To OP
[BIBLEDRB]Luke 1:41-44[/BIBLEDRB]
incase you missed it
[BIBLEDRB]Luke 1:43[/BIBLEDRB]
now you claim the inerrant bible cannot be wrong right? then how could it be wrong here when it calls Mary “The Mother of my LORD”
[BIBLEDRB]Luke 1:41-44[/BIBLEDRB]
incase you missed it
[BIBLEDRB]Luke 1:43[/BIBLEDRB]
now you claim the inerrant bible cannot be wrong right? then how could it be wrong here when it calls Mary “The Mother of my LORD”
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