How was he working it out and for what purpose?Working out means just that, something that is already within being worked out.
Agreed the fear means respect for God.When we come to understand Gods assurances of our salvation we come into a new respect for His love which is translated fear.
Why would Paul be fearful of offending God? What would be the consequence of offending Him?Trembling is the fear (actual) of offending God.
Do you truly understand what God really means? If so, how so? Is the Holy Spirit guiding you to this truth in the same way you thought the Holy Spirit was guiding you to the “truth” you came to realize wasn’t really the truth?It is easy to misunderstand fear and trembling without truly understanding what God really means.
I do not understand your entire response here. Could you dumb it down for me? Did you answer my question in your response somewhere?Bt your words I am condemned by not being of the same view as you.
Where I condemn you not, but rather present my views for your judgment.
The Holy Spirit leads me to believe that God is the lover of the whole world as is His creation and as He has given His Son for a Ransom of it.
He teaches me that God looks at the heart and not at the outside of a person, therefore, if the heart is not right with God, then “mission control, we have a problem”.
I have no heart problem for the Holy Spirit leads me to as promised.
Peace>>>AJ
The “old man” in us is the old nature as we inherited by Adam and in which brought separation from God, meaning death of the soul.How was he working it out and for what purpose?>>>Lampo
Sorry if I didn’t address your question to your understanding.I do not understand your entire response here. Could you dumb it down for me? Did you answer my question in your response somewhere?
Did the Holy Spirit lead you to a lie when you "stumbled across a view that was basically Jewish in nature yet had some Christian views integrated in it as well.
It called for me to observe the Sabbath as the Sabbath day Saturday, and also eliminated all souls from salvation after 1999."?
Did you think it was a lie at the time? Is the Holy Spirit currently leading you to believe the doctrine of OSAS? Do you think OSAS is a lie?
Okay I will answer your question, then you can answer mine. But I don’t understand your question I think if what you are saying is do your have to obey these 2 commandments if that’s it. Yes you do. But here is the problem there are 10 commandments you gotta do them all. In my faith 2 just won’t cut it.Jesus left us two commandments: Mat 22:37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
Mat 22:38 This is the first and great commandment.
Mat 22:39 And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
Mat 22:40 On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.
On these two, rinnie, rests all your good works.
If your beliefs, whatever it might be Catholic or other, if these two commandments are not practiced, than James has some words for you.
Jam 2:20 But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead?
If we love God, then our faith is demonstrated in love towards our neighbor.
But if works is the motive than love has no place and is as dead works.
Now answer me this question, if a religion practices not these two commandments is that religion works dead works?
Peace>>>AJ
Okay lets go with number 3. now you said I can never lose my salvation. Okay lets do that one. What do you mean by that?Quite the contrary, Gods works are not mans works.
My works (Deeds if you will) have absolutely nothing to do with God’s works of salvation.
God saves mankind and not mankind saves self.
Now, if after I have received the precious gift of life (Jesus) and live not righteously, I will be spanked, sort of speak, for God says He chastens whom He loves, but never will I loose my salvation.
Now, you think I am still confused?
The condition for my salvation is not based on my “good deeds” but only on the “good deed” that Jesus did.
Life (Gods love) has to come from within me by will and not by requirement.
If by requirement, then it is no longer by life. (Gods love).
Does love animate from you willingly or is someone, institution requiring it from you as a condition?
2Jo 1:5 And now I beseech thee, lady, not as though I wrote a new commandment unto thee, but that which we had from the beginning, that we love one another.
If you were a Mormon, a Jew, a Buddhist, a Catholic, a Baptist, a Jehovah’s Witness, an atheist, I would love you!
I wouldn’t have a problem with how you choose to worship if only love is at the core of your actions.
Who did Jesus die for, a Mormon, a Jew, a Buddhist, a Catholic, a Baptist, a Jehovah’s Witness, an atheist?
I don’t recall reading where Jesus had discriminated.
Peace>>>AJ
The 10 commandments are contained in the two.Okay I will answer your question, then you can answer mine. But I don’t understand your question I think if what you are saying is do your have to obey these 2 commandments if that’s it. Yes you do. But here is the problem there are 10 commandments you gotta do them all. In my faith 2 just won’t cut it.
Now I agree faith without works is dead yes. Its useless.
Can you after being born in the flesh go back into your mothers womb and be born again?Okay lets go with number 3. now you said I can never lose my salvation. Okay lets do that one. What do you mean by that?
Ok now that last line what does that mean? And can you show me where in the bible it shows your salvation is sealed? I guess what I am saying is I still don’t see where scripture says we cannot lose salvation?Can you after being born in the flesh go back into your mothers womb and be born again?
Once you are born of God, you can not again go back and be reborn.
Eph 1:13 In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,
Is that not a bit of good news?
Joh 6:27 Labour not for the meat which perisheth, but for that meat which endureth unto everlasting life, which the Son of man shall give unto you: for him hath God the Father sealed.
That meat is the meat of the gospel or the good news of God’s gift to mankind, therefore if we labour to seek it and do find it, then we are sealed by the Father.
Rom 5:18 Therefore as by the offence of one judgment came upon all men to condemnation; even so by the righteousness of one the free gift came upon all men unto justification of life.
By you acknowledging Gods gift to you in Jesus, you are reborn in spirit, never to again die.
Your salvation is then secured (sealed).
Now what you do with it, good or bad, is up to you.
Peace>>>AJ
Fair enough.Sorry if I didn’t address your question to your understanding.
Yes, the Holy Spirit led me out of that view because I asked to be corrected if I were on the wrong track.
You see, by studying that view I learned allot about the behavior of mankind throughout the ages as relating to God.
I asked God by placing out a fleece, I asked God that if the furniture I had in my store for a year would sell promptly, that I would take that as a sign that I should change my course.
This was on a Monday or Tuseday when I made the request.
Guess what, with in 3 or 4 days a couple came in and not only bought the furniture I had for a long time but bought much more than what I requested.
I quickly changed my direction of study,
I don’t think it was a lie, but an understanding of what it is not what God wanted me to know.
This story perhaps is important only to me because this confirms my relationship I have with God via His Holy Spirit.
You on the other hand have to experience the Holy Spirits promptings in your search for understanding.
Peace>>>AJ
When taken as a whole and coupled with the living Tradition of the Church founded by Jesus Christ, Scripture says the exact opposite of OSAS. So therefore, you won’t find where Scripture says we cannot lose our salvation. The false doctrine of OSAS came into existence about 1,500 years after Christ walked on the Earth. It’s a man-made tradition. I believe people adhere to this false doctrine because it fits their lifestyle and requires them to do less. It’s easier, in other words.I guess what I am saying is I still don’t see where scripture says we cannot lose salvation?
Originally, did you ask the Holy Spirit to lead and guide you to the truth when you "stumbled across a view that was basically Jewish in nature yet had some Christian views integrated in it as well.Yes, the Holy Spirit led me out of that view because I asked to be corrected if I were on the wrong track.
If I gave you a million dollars, what would you do with it?Ok now that last line what does that mean? And can you show me where in the bible it shows your salvation is sealed? I guess what I am saying is I still don’t see where scripture says we cannot lose salvation?
Yes, all my searching are the desires of my heart that the Holy Spirit is very well aware of.Originally, did you ask the Holy Spirit to lead and guide you to the truth when you "stumbled across a view that was basically Jewish in nature yet had some Christian views integrated in it as well.
It called for me to observe the Sabbath as the Sabbath day Saturday, and also eliminated all souls from salvation after 1999."?
Very well. Just know that the doors to the Catholic Church are always open for you and would welcome you back so you could once again receive the Body, Blood, Soul and Divinity of Jesus Christ.Yes, all my searching are the desires of my heart that the Holy Spirit is very well aware of.
I understand that it was a journey that He sent me through in order to attain knowledge of and experience.
Having being taken through it and than redirecting me, I have now what I believe to be a very clear picture of Gods work in mankind.
I no longer discriminate between beliefs structures, but rather look at the heart, as God does, to judge the existence of love.
One can be a dedicated Catholic, Baptist, Mormon or any other belief,and if Godly love is not being exercised there in, that persons belief is of no use to mankind and or self.
Religion is a school master that directs us to God.
We can either remain at a plateau in our beliefs, or become more engrossed in the word of God and have our faith straighted.
We have the right to manage the ability to do good in a evil environment.
How we do that, is up to us to seek and find God who is our ever present help via His Holy Spirit.
Peace>>>AJ
This is all good scripture but it does not say that we are guaranteed salvation.If I gave you a million dollars, what would you do with it?
If God gives you life everlasting, something you did not have before because you were unable on your own to accomplish it, what would you do with it?
Read Chapter 5 of Romans and you will see:
v-1 Our justification is by faith through our Lord Jesus Christ
v-2 Our direct access by grace, with rejoicing in hope
v-3 Our strength in tribulations becomes a joy
v-4 Resultants of v-3, gain patience, experience; and experience, hope:
v-5 Confirmation of the Holy Ghost in our hearts makes us not ashamed to declare it.
v-6 Reason why we could not do it ourselves (Yet without strength)
requiring God to act on our behalf.
v-7 Here is a clue as to who Christ died for, not for the righteous only but for the unrighteous also.
v-8 Affirmation from God who commanded His love for us, as was His desire even while we are yet sinners.
v-9 Confirmation to us that His blood justified (past tense)us and has saved us from the death of hell (Separation) and from it’s wrath.
v-10 Confirmation-“being reconciled” made whole again in Jesus and “we shall be saved”.
v-11 Joy in our salvation because “we have now received the atonement” present tense.
v-12 Here we have Gods works declared 1. Sin and death entered by 1st Adam and 2. Life entered with the 2ndAdam, Jesus to life everlasting.
Note: you will find that the whole of the bible speaks to verse 12 as its center piece.
v-13 In order to forgive sin there must be a trespass, hence the law.
v-14. Here is a clue that death came to all mankind regardless of the law. Reason not shown here is because of the knowledge of good and evil.
v-15 Important key clue, the offense and the gift are God generated.
Offense= the gaining of knowledge of good and evil= separation from God=death
Gift=offense acknowledged and reparations granted by God as a free gift.
v-16 Key to understanding; Judgment was death by one (1st Adam to all offspring) and Judgment is to one 2nd Adam for all His offspring.
The rest of the chapter confirms the cause and correction by God.
Based on just that one chapter save the rest of the bible, one can conclude Gods gift to us is salvation via the judgment of Christ for all our sins.
If a gift, work for our own salvation than is not necessary but having it provided for us.
Sealed by the Holy Spirit. Recall reading where Jesus said, I must go so that the Father may send the Comforter?
Ref:Joh 16:7 Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you.
This same spirit is Christ with ability to be omnipresent in all of us.
If He speaks to your heart, rest assured you are sealed, for the simple reason that you are touched by your faith in Him.
You may not understand what all it means but with a little understanding, you will find that you are experiencing the joy of your salvation.
Now, what will you do with it once you confirm it in your heart?
Live righteously and not for the world, for you are in the world as the salt of the earth.
Peace>>>AJ
Thanks for the invitation! I enjoy the joy of my salvation daily and know that He is ever looking out for me as promised.Very well. Just know that the doors to the Catholic Church are always open for you and would welcome you back so you could once again receive the Body, Blood, Soul and Divinity of Jesus Christ.
The first part of your response is pertains to earthly, fleshly desires which is if you can understand it, the environment by which we are to rise up from to the attitude of the second part of your response which is faith in God.Oh and a million bucks, the first thing I would do is get on a nice big boat and cruise around. Sit in the sun in my bathing suit. Slide down a couple of 7 and 7’s. Get a good book and then just take a time out thank God and rest.
Leave my husband and kids home for at least 2 days. Then my husband could come, kids probably not. They can wait. Then figure out how I am going to share the money. after another 7 &7.
Everlasting Faith, if I had to choose between the million and that. The faith wins hands down. But to be honest it would probably be easier to hold on to the million then keep the everlasting Grace. But it would be nice if we could never lose it. then we would all be getting in to heaven. But the bible tells me different.