Is it ok to listen to Dr Taylor Marshall?

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There are lots of solid orthodox ministries that somehow manage to remain in union with their Ordinary, including EWTN and Catholic Answers. There are some I don’t especially like, but even they are likely not nearly as bad as they would be if they went independent.

You might argue it’s better to read “independent” ministries, but what information do you get that you, personally, act on? Independent Catholic Ministries whether Catholics for Choice, Call to Action, or whatever, can out anything out there. I don’t know what they, or OnePeterFive, are leaving out.

What the independents Right and Left do offer is thrills and chills. (You heard it HERE first!)
 
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Taylor Marshall is to the Church, what Donald Trump is to America.
And Pope Francis is to the Church, what Barrack Obama was to America.
If you can’t see the parallels you’re blind.
 
The question may be what will the bishops, or some of the laity even, say about the exposure of the USCCB’s donations that was made today by his interview with the guy from Lepanto.
 
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No, it won’t

Maybe, sort of…but you wade through a lot of Calumny, innuendo, conspiracy theory, to get some very relevant facts also stuck in. He seems to have a blind spot for evils produced by people outside the Catholic hierarchy

His argument is “why we should stay in the Faith,” not necessarily the Church.
He doesn’t explicitly say it but leads you up to the door of (guess where), and if you go in, that’s up to you. And if you don’t go in, he leads you to an equivalent position, outside the Guess Where, but complementary.
 
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Fr. Pacwa and EWTN work in union with the Church. (That doesn’t stop them from addressing abuses). They are in agreement with Pope St Pius X,
on communications, Pascendi section 52.

Taylor Marshall does not work in union with the Church. He does not work in agreement with Pascendi, regarding communications. (He even references Pascendi in his book!)

Most people would agree that a heretic can do more damage working on the inside than outside. If that is true, it would follow that an orthodox Catholic can do more good working on the inside than outside, which I think is consistent with Pascendi.
 
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That is kind of easy. The Church is not a political entity. Most political systems are a mixed of good and bad. Even capitalism, unrestricted, has been condemned. The underlying principle is that the Lord hears the cry of the poor. Injustice to wage earner is, in traditional Catholicism, one of the four sins that cry to Heaven.

On the other hand, we know that we are sojourners and strangers in this life. All that we do must be geared toward Heaven. So, if in the case of communism, the State becomes god, even if it was benevolent and free of corruption, there is still an idolatry that must be condemned.
 
What happens when the clergy becomes corrupt?

Being in union is nice but it’s not always reality.
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I hear ya. I am uncomfortable with my current bishop, and for other reasons, my current pope.

Even so, I stick with the Church. I support, and listen to, only ministries that are working in union with the Church. I think my staying “inside” has helped me make some minor improvement. I have confidence that this is the reliable path.

I have confidence that going outside is the unreliable path, if not today, then tomorrow. It’s tempting to say I’ll come back in, in the future, when the Church is perfect.

The problem is, the Church will never be perfect, and neither am I. If I am not in union, how will I know when the Church is ready to fully be united?

Christianity is littered with countless “temporary” solutions that hardened into permanent denominations, which themselves split into new “temporary” solutions.
 
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Taylor Marshall does not work in union with the Church.
When we say in union do we mean Church approved? Many people have apostolates and do not have Church approval. That doesn’t mean they are outside the Church.
 
There are many Protestant writers and speakers who are also solid on prolife, traditional marriage, and much of the core doctrine of Christianity. But how do I know whether they are reliable? In the long run, I tend to find a source in union with the Church.

Dr. Marshall himself is Catholic, but his ministry is Protestant, in the sense of Christian not united with the Magisterium.
 
I am willing to bet Cardinal Burke has also applauded some Protestant apologists, such as Dr James Dobson or Franklin Graham. But if you were to write to him, I bet he would recommend you support and listen to orthodox writers in union with their Catholic bishop.
 
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Dr. Marshall himself is Catholic, but his ministry is Protestant, in the sense of Christian not united with the Magisterium.
Um. I’m not sure how you came to that conclusion. Not sure even if you are the one who is allowed to make that conclusion.

It’s kind of popular here at CAF, that if we dont like or agree with someone we call them protestant or being like Luther.
 
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It would help to reread Pascendi, including section 52. Section 53 is also relevant. Also important is his Encyclical on Catholic Action, relevant to this discussion.

Keep in mind St Pius X lived in a time of imperfect bishops, imperfect dioceses, some theologians and seminaries shaped by heresy. He wasn’t writing for ideal times.
 
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He was a bishop, you know.
Um. I’m not sure how you came to that conclusion. Not sure even if you are the one who is allowed to make that conclusion.
Such decisions are made by the bishop under whose authority a ministry is located. No one is saying Dr. Marshall is outside of the Church, or any other independent apologist. But the point is that the ministry is outside of the Catholic Church, canonically. I will not even comment if that is a good or bad thing, except it is a situation where each has to do their own thing in evaluating the ministry, interpret for themselves, so to speak, what the message is. I will not label what this looks like so as not to be “popular at CAF.”

When a ministry is under the authority of a diocese, there is some accountability to orthodoxy. I am not going to get into the whole issue of bishop against bishop, my favorite bishop is more orthodox than your, or any such partisan squabbling. Again, I know what this resembles, even if I shouldn’t say it.
 
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Dr. Marshall himself is Catholic, but his ministry is Protestant, in the sense of Christian not united with the Magisterium.
Um. I’m not sure how you came to that conclusion. Not sure even if you are the one who is allowed to make that conclusion.

It’s kind of popular here at CAF, that if we dont like or agree with someone we call them protestant or being like Luther.
If a ministry does not meet the criteria of the Church (not just present Church but St Pius X) to be “Catholic”, nor to be Eastern Orthodox or Oriental Orthodox, some would call it Protestant. If that term bothers you, call it non denominational.
How would Pius X describe a ministry not in agreement with Pascendi?
 
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No one is saying Dr. Marshall is outside of the Church, or any other independent apologist
Agree that is not what you are saying
. But the point is that the ministry is outside of the Catholic Church, canonically.
That was my point earlier. Not everyone has approval of their bishop for their ministry or apostolate. It doesn’t make them protestant.
! I always get a chuckle out of irony.
There is a difference between saying there is protestantism in something and personally accusing or judging someone of being protestant or being outside the Church.
 
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There is a difference between saying there is protestantism in something and personally accusing or judging someone of being protestant or being outside the Church.
What was said was,
but his ministry is Protestant, in the sense of Christian not united with the Magisterium.
The statement was not about someone, but something, that is one aspect of that person, and even then in a limited way, his ministry is not united with the Magisterium (though more correctly it should have been united with the bishop. What is orthodox, magisterial, right, etc., is not something always universally agreed upon, which is why authority is so important. Jesus left a living Church. That Church must stay living. By this I mean that authority is vital in avoiding individual interpretation.

Modernism is condemned, as is legalism. We must not divide into sides, where progressives only condemn traditionalists as legalistic Pharisees while blind to their own influence of humanism; and traditionalists condemn progressives as heretical, while blind to their own Pharisee-ism. So, ministries like Dr. Marshall can be a great positive, but the limitation of listening only for confirmation should temper our condemnation of others.

I would think most all of us sometimes disagree with the Church hierarchy at some time and think (at least somewhat) protestant.
 
What was said was,
but his ministry is Protestant, in the sense of Christian not united with the Magisterium.
Definition of protestantism: a member or follower of any of the Western Christian churches that are separate from the Roman Catholic Church and follow the principles of the Reformation and oppose Catholicism,

Principles of the reformation: faith alone, scripture alone, grace alone.

I will give you that his ministry is protestant if you can point out where he promotes in his ministry one of those three principles or where he has said he is protesting the teachings of the Church.
more correctly it should have been united with the bishop.
If you want to say his works were not united with his particular bishop okay, sure, then say that.
As I said earlier it is popular here at CAF to call Catholics protestant or question them, “are you really Catholic?” but that is usually an incorrect accusation and more likely used just to insult. And that is what bothers me. It is not just about Dr. Marshall but how we treat each other.

His book did have a forward from Bishop Schneider, and with the situation the bishops are in today, that makes union with the Magisterium debatable.
I would think most all of us sometimes disagree with the Church hierarchy at some time and think (at least somewhat) protestant.
There are times we can disagree with the Church hierarchy, in things that are not infallible. That does not make a person protestant. (see principles of being protestant above). Many Church hierarchy publicly express opinions on many issues, especially with today’s internet. You are not going to agree with every opinion or every action of every bishop.
 
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