Is the silent treatment acceptable? (Womanly opinions welcome...I can't really read women's minds)

[kage_ar]

Multi Level Marketing selling vitimins, like Amway or Shacklee, that is another way her parents can control her. They are her “upline”.

Send this girl a cake with a file in it so she can escape.

 

[Belgarion]

Multi Level Marketing selling vitimins, like Amway or Shacklee, that is another way her parents can control her. They are her “upline”.

Send this girl a cake with a file in it so she can escape.

I may just do that!

 

[Pro-Life_Teen]

I’m agreeing with everyone who is frustrated with this tip-toeing around. Just call her. Right now. Pick up the phone and call. Somehow I doubt she has a cell, so it’s her house-phone.

I know she isn’t allowed, but this is hardly the worst rule you can break. Romeo and Juliet snuck off and got married- you’re just sneaking in a phone call. And asking her out.

Again, this… these excuses upon everything we say, followed by knowing what her family’s doing is bull, it’s… I’ve had friends who tiptoed around each other in terms of love. You know what we did? We shoved them in a room and got them to express their feelings.

Life is short, and all that. Even if you begin seriously dating today, it’ll be a year or two before you marry, presuming all goes perfectly. And frankly, she can’t think that this is normal behavior. If her idea of freedom is asking her father for permission to leave the house at the age of 20, and consenting to his no, how do you think she’ll act with children?

It’s a mess, this whole thing.

 

[Liberanosamalo]

I’m just coming here for the novelty of saying I agree with every word Pro-Life Teen just said.

(He’s going to argue with you, PLT. I’ll just sit and watch. You argue back! )

 

[Belgarion]

I’m agreeing with everyone who is frustrated with this tip-toeing around. Just call her. Right now. Pick up the phone and call. Somehow I doubt she has a cell, so it’s her house-phone.

Well, for the sake of not wanting to disappoint Liberanosamalo, let’s play out that scenario:
I pick up the phone, dial her number
Ring…Ring
Her dad answers it, not her, because they recognize my phone number
“Hello,” He says.
“Hi, can I talk to (her name here)?” I ask him.
“Uh, I don’t really think that’s a good idea.”
“Please?”
“No.”
click

I know she isn’t allowed, but this is hardly the worst rule you can break. Romeo and Juliet snuck off and got married- you’re just sneaking in a phone call. And asking her out.

Oh yeah! I totally agree that such an action is not really that bad at all. But to be honest, its just not an effective method to talk to her secretive-like

Again, this… these excuses upon everything we say, followed by knowing what her family’s doing is bull, it’s… I’ve had friends who tiptoed around each other in terms of love. You know what we did? We shoved them in a room and got them to express their feelings.

Wow, I wish I had friends like that.

Life is short, and all that. Even if you begin seriously dating today, it’ll be a year or two before you marry, presuming all goes perfectly. And frankly, she can’t think that this is normal behavior. If her idea of freedom is asking her father for permission to leave the house at the age of 20, and consenting to his no, how do you think she’ll act with children?

Her own kids, you mean? Because she’s seriously good with kids.
But with her own, it’d be something that would be decided together, not simply by her.
And that’d be another barely-to-non-negotiable item for me.

It’s a mess, this whole thing.

I know
Its so much fun /cheerful sarcasm

I’m just coming here for the novelty of saying I agree with every word Pro-Life Teen just said.

(He’s going to argue with you, PLT. I’ll just sit and watch. You argue back! )

HA!!

 

[Jay53]

Well, for the sake of not wanting to disappoint Liberanosamalo, let’s play out that scenario:
I pick up the phone, dial her number
Ring…Ring
Her dad answers it, not her, because they recognize my phone number
“Hello,” He says.
“Hi, can I talk to (her name here)?” I ask him.
“Uh, I don’t really think that’s a good idea.”
-]“Please?” /-]"Why Not?"
“No.”
click

Continue the conversation from the bolded part, please.

 

[Belgarion]

Continue the conversation from the bolded part, please.

lol
Sure!

I pick up the phone, dial her number
Ring…Ring
Her dad answers it, not her, because they recognize my phone number
“Hello,” He says.
“Hi, can I talk to (her name here)?” I ask him.
“Uh, I don’t really think that’s a good idea.”
“Why Not?”
“Well, we have our rules.”
“What’s wrong with talking with her on the phone?”
“Well, I believe that you both deserve God’s best, and talking together like that may not be that.”
“Why not?” I ask, yet again.
“Well, we have prayed about it, and we have decided that she isn’t ready to do that just yet.”

“We?”

“I had a talk with her, and we agree that she isn’t ready for that. I have no ulterior motive here, she really agrees.”

~Now, let’s interrupt this for a second. This is actually based on a conversation I’ve had with him. Including the “God’s best” phrase, as well as the “We prayed about it, and we talked about it…” “I have no ulterior motive” etc.
I have a hard time believing that last part. Both from what I’ve heard from people who have experience in this matter, and from the actions of the young woman as well.

Let’s get a little bit more radical in this “conversation”:

“Well, I really have a hard time believing that, sir.”

“Why’s that?”

“Because it seems to me that she likes me more than you’re allowing her to.”

“Well, I wouldn’t say that. After all, she’s given me charge of these affairs.”

“So why does she hug me, etc. at one point, but then suddenly stop? She was happy to do that before, and even hugged me herself without me expecting it.”

“She told me about that time where you hugged her, and said you missed her. I felt that that action was a little too much, and I talked with her. We both agreed that that shouldn’t happen anymore.”

“I appreciate openess and honesty. And simply “cutting me off” is neither of those…”

Blah blah blah…on and on…and it turns into a classic conversation full of evasion and “God’s best.”

Its not longer about wanting to talk to her, and instead becomes a futile discussion of their rules which will be stubbornly enforced.

This is why I think its more effective to just deal with a letter. That way, I can ask her to read it herself before she does anything. If she doesn’t like what I say, she can go ahead and take it to her dad, because we’re through.

But if she does, she needs to fill me in here and be a little more honest with me, WITHOUT her father’s interference. I’ve been trying to do it their way for 2 years, and all its led to is stress and some serious headaches. Sure, there’s happiness dabbled in there…but only when I’m actually speaking to this woman.

 

[dakotagirl]

Continue the conversation from the bolded part, please.

 

[Belgarion]

Please??

Did

 

[whatevergirl]

*The better question–why do you want to be with a woman who can’t make her own decisions? Why is a 20 yr old who has her own business living at home with her parents? Why doesn’t she have a cell phone that you can call? Why can you only call her at home, and not at her place of work to talk to her without her dad’s interference?

And finally…is she the only single girl left in Oregon?

And…did you do anything at all that you can think of to make the father think you’re not a good ‘candidate’ for his daughter? *

 

[ack]

“What’s wrong with talking with her on the phone?”
“Well, I believe that you both deserve God’s best, and talking together like that may not be that.”
“Why not?” I ask, yet again.
“Well, we have prayed about it, and we have decided that she isn’t ready to do that just yet.”

“We?”

“I had a talk with her, and we agree that she isn’t ready for that. I have no ulterior motive here, she really agrees.”

So she’s not interested in having a relationship with you right now. Why are you pursuing this?



I guess I don’t understand why this is so complicated for you. If she wanted a relationship, then she would want to talk to you on the phone. She doesn’t want to talk on the phone, so she’s not interested in dating you right now. Move on and find someone else.

 

[Belgarion]

*The better question–why do you want to be with a woman who can’t make her own decisions? Why is a 20 yr old who has her own business living at home with her parents? Why doesn’t she have a cell phone that you can call? Why can you only call her at home, and not at her place of work to talk to her without her dad’s interference?
*
Her place of work is at home. lol
The only other business that I know of ATM that functions like that is Mary Kay. She’s a distributor for GNLD.

So she doesn’t have a cell. But she can make her own decisions…just not with THIS stuff…

And finally…is she the only single girl left in Oregon?

Absolutely not. I was friends with him before I was interested in her.
Besides, the game playing STARTED before I talked to him the second time where he was actually going to let me come over. I didn’t do anything before or after that. And I certainly didn’t do anything so serious that he’d feel that way. Because if he did, he’d suddenly change his mind on being open and tell me “Go away”/

So she’s not interested in having a relationship with you right now. Why are you pursuing this?

Good Lord in heaven…facepalm
Please read the previous posts…I’m tired of posting this info over and over again…
she likes me…We’re pursuing a relationship, but we’re doing it slower than a snail.
AND, those closest to their family say that we don’t even know if its HER decision anyways! Chev sure was right about control.

I guess I don’t understand why this is so complicated for you. If she wanted a relationship, then she would want to talk to you on the phone. She doesn’t want to talk on the phone, so she’s not interested in dating you right now. Move on and find someone else.

Yet again, its not that she doesn’t want to. Heck, I’m fairly certain it’d make her day, week and year. But her dad…

and yet again (yet again ) I’m not moving on unless its decided through lots of prayer, and actual action.

 

[Jay53]

lol
Sure!

I pick up the phone, dial her number
Ring…Ring
Her dad answers it, not her, because they recognize my phone number
“Hello,” He says.
“Hi, can I talk to (her name here)?” I ask him.
“Uh, I don’t really think that’s a good idea.”
“Why Not?”
“Well, we have our rules.”
“What’s wrong with talking with her on the phone?”
“Well, I believe that you both deserve God’s best, and talking together like that may not be that.”
“Why not?” I ask, yet again.
“Well, we have prayed about it, and we have decided that she isn’t ready to do that just yet.”

“We?”

“I had a talk with her, and we agree that she isn’t ready for that. I have no ulterior motive here, she really agrees.”

~Now, let’s interrupt this for a second. This is actually based on a conversation I’ve had with him. Including the “God’s best” phrase, as well as the “We prayed about it, and we talked about it…” “I have no ulterior motive” etc.
I have a hard time believing that last part. Both from what I’ve heard from people who have experience in this matter, and from the actions of the young woman as well.

Let’s get a little bit more radical in this “conversation”:

“Well, I really have a hard time believing that, sir.”

“Why’s that?”

“Because it seems to me that she likes me more than you’re allowing her to.”

“Well, I wouldn’t say that. After all, she’s given me charge of these affairs.”

OK, if that’s really how the conversation would go - that is REALLY creepy. I have to take your word for it that she is not being abused, but all of this would send up a BIG red flag. Maybe other daughters have different relationships with their Dads, but IMHO this is really creepy.

OTOH, what you need is some subterfuge. You need to borrow a cell phone of a mutual friend or go to their house where you can have them make the initial phone call so that you can get past the ‘guard’, so to speak. Or have the friend set up a meeting somewhere, i.e. library, park etc. - whatever she does with her girlfriends. (I can’t believe I’m actually suggesting this for a grown woman.)

Or the letter might work, but how long will it take you to write it, mail it etc.? Does she have e-mail?

 

[Jay53]

I also need to ask - where is her Mom in all of this? Why doesn’t she answer the phone or anything? I’m only going by my own personal experience, but my Dad pretty much left the romantic discussions up to my Mom to have with us. Not that he didn’t have any (name removed by moderator)ut because he definitely spoke to my Mom, but my Mom is the one that talked to us and gave us “motherly” advice.

 

[Liberanosamalo]

Why do you think he doesn’t censor her mail too?

 

[Pro-Life_Teen]

I’m just coming here for the novelty of saying I agree with every word Pro-Life Teen just said.

(He’s going to argue with you, PLT. I’ll just sit and watch. You argue back! )

Wait, we’re agreeing?

“What’s wrong with talking with her on the phone?”
“Well, I believe that you both deserve God’s best, and talking together like that may not be that.”
“Why not?” I ask, yet again.
“Well, we have prayed about it, and we have decided that she isn’t ready to do that just yet.”

]

That is creepy- agree with Jay56. I’ve only heard hardcore Fundamentalists talk like that, and it’s never a good thing. And agreed further- get a friend to call. A female friend even, and then switch the phone. Or meet her at the library. That her father screens her calls, and that she doesn’t have a cell… it is a prison. She is a prisoner. This isn’t being protective, this is a power-trip. And she’s either so used to it she doesn’t see it, or she’s scared. Or perhaps accepts it.

Oh yeah! I totally agree that such an action is not really that bad at all. But to be honest, its just not an effective method to talk to her secretive-like

Yes it is. It’s more not effective to sit online and talk to us about how hopeless the situation is.

Her own kids, you mean? Because she’s seriously good with kids.
But with her own, it’d be something that would be decided together, not simply by her.
And that’d be another barely-to-non-negotiable item for me.

One is different with their own then with others’ children.

Oh, don’t be so sure of that. If her father is so deathly controlling now, you can bet a good deal of money that he’ll have (name removed by moderator)ut on her and any grandchildren. One doesn’t relinquish control so easy. You can’t even get to talk to her now.

So she doesn’t have a cell. But she can make her own decisions…just not with THIS stuff…**
*
Good Lord in heaven…facepalm
Please read the previous posts…I’m tired of posting this info over and over again…
she likes me…We’re pursuing a relationship, but we’re doing it slower than a snail.
AND, those closest to their family say that we don’t even know if its HER decision anyways! Chev sure was right about control.

Dude. She can make decisions all on her own, but not who she will date/marry? And this extents to talking to any possible suitors, interacting with them at all, or owning a cell phone / email? Does she have a car- can she drive?

You’re not pursuing a relationship. You’re following her around like a puppy while her dad glares at you. Doesn’t know if it’s her decision? It better be- unless they’re into arranged marriages. Which aren’t all that bad, but haven’t heard of them very often in Catholic societies. She’s 20. Most families into arranged marriages see that as around the age to marry- so even in that place you might be more welcome to see her. Those traditions include things like family dinners.

I thought this was amusingly romantic at first, but it quickly dissolved. I think you should leave it. I am all for love and romance and overcoming the odds, but this is too much. She’s either a prisoner or pulling you around, and you’ll defend her manner of going about this until we can no longer argue because we’ve mentioned everything already. This is not a healthy way to start a relationship. You mentioned her engaged siblings were barely about to walk about the house out of view- that is complete and total control. This will not go away when you marry, this will extend to grandchildren, she is brainwashed.

I am 19. Two months before I turned 19, at 18, I went to London. Alone. To see my boyfriend for ten days. I had a hotel, nothing inappropriate happened so let’s not even go there. My family, who I love dearly, decided I was mature and responsible enough to fly halfway around the world and chill in a major city for over a week with my beloved.

The one you’re pursuing can’t even pick up the phone at 20.

 

[chevalier]

Belgarion, do see the light. While we aren’t attacking her character in a moral sense, here, it’s kinda obvious she’s not all that. You’ve got to stop idolising her and realise what kinda thing they have running in the house and what you’re getting into. Give her a chance before you cross her out but don’t promise yourself too much. And until she’s ready to tell dad no, she’s not ready for anything anyway.

 

[whatevergirl]

Yeah, Belgarion…something is really odd here. If anything, she doesn’t behave like an adult. My dd is 13, she’s not permitted to date yet…and needs our permission to do things. That is how this 20 yr old girl is behaving…and yeah, her dad is controlling, but it sounds like she is not very mature, otherwise she’d have enough of it, and get out on her own.

Unless this is a smokescreen, and she just doesn’t want to tell you she isn’t into you. Immature girls do that you know, just sayin’.

I am not sure what else to say, but I think you deserve better. What are your parents’ thoughts on this?

 

[tyuf]

trade9shoes.com

 

[Belgarion]

OK, if that’s really how the conversation would go - that is REALLY creepy. I have to take your word for it that she is not being abused, but all of this would send up a BIG red flag. Maybe other daughters have different relationships with their Dads, but IMHO this is really creepy.

Yeah, well she’s pretty close to him. They talk about a lot, and even work together sometimes (When she does work at the properties that they fix up, or something) I can imagine him doing all this because he doesn’t want to let her go.

OTOH, what you need is some subterfuge. You need to borrow a cell phone of a mutual friend or go to their house where you can have them make the initial phone call so that you can get past the ‘guard’, so to speak. Or have the friend set up a meeting somewhere, i.e. library, park etc. - whatever she does with her girlfriends. (I can’t believe I’m actually suggesting this for a grown woman.)

Sounds good, but if I value honesty, I need to be honest myself.
A letter is going to be just fine.

Or the letter might work, but how long will it take you to write it, mail it etc.? Does she have e-mail?

No email, and I’m going to GIVE it to her, rather than mail it

I also need to ask - where is her Mom in all of this? Why doesn’t she answer the phone or anything? I’m only going by my own personal experience, but my Dad pretty much left the romantic discussions up to my Mom to have with us. Not that he didn’t have any (name removed by moderator)ut because he definitely spoke to my Mom, but my Mom is the one that talked to us and gave us “motherly” advice.

I have no idea where she stands. She’s probably a little more relaxed when it comes to these things, she’s a nic woman. I wish SHE was in charge of it, to be honest