you think they can be wrong… that doesn’t mean they are…
The abuses of the CC leading up to the Reformation included nepotism at the highest levels (mostly involving the de Medicis), simony, and abuse of indulgences. These things happened. It’s not a matter of opinion.
God would not give us a Church that could not be trusted.
The Church is people. People are fallible. The only loophole is if you happen to have some kind of divine revelation from the Holy Spirit, but the canon is closed because that no longer happens.
now the question is: Did God give us one Church?
Sure. Well, not per se…He didn’t “give us” a Church. He caused us to become His Church. If you really think God “gave us” a church, can I ask what it’s made of? Does it look cool? What kind of architecture is it?
and if so, which one is it?
Christians. That’s Christ’s Church.
the one that came at the beginning or the one (ones) that began to exist after 1521?
How 'bout both?
I don’t know if anyone’s ever pointed this out to you, but you started existing after 1521. So are you the one who’s part of Christ’s Church, or is it the people who were alive when Christ was around? See, I’m making you choose between two things that are clearly not mutually exclusive. That’s what you did, too.
Are you starting to see how these kinds of dichotomies (the false kind) don’t make very much sense?
See, there’s a difference between you and me that I’m not so sure you fully understand yet. There are 30,000 plus Protestant denominations, it’s true. However, we’re not like you. We haven’t excommunicated one another. We have our differences, some of which lead to debate and minor conflict, but we all understand that all Christians are part of one global Church, regardless of denomination. It’s not like there’s 30,000 schisms going on, and it’s not as if each denomination must come up with 30,000 separate reasons for casting out their brothers and declaring them all anathema. It just doesn’t work that way. We’re distinct parts of one unified whole.
Now, you may have come up with 30,000 separate reasons for calling each and every Protestant “heretic” and declaring at least one teaching in each denomination “anathema,” but I’m suggesting that it’s not a good idea. It’s not good for the Church, which really is much bigger than just Rome. You also need to know this, and in no uncertain terms: You like to make fun of the Protestant denominations and bring up large numbers because you see them as entirely separate entities, but you need to stop yourself from making the mistake of copying your perspective and pasting it onto that of Protestants. We aren’t 30,000 separate churches. We’re 30,000 denominations within one global Church that encompasses all Christians.
If you think there’s 30,000 Protestant denominations saying “We are Christ’s One Church on Earth and none of you are part of it,” you must be dreaming…or maybe you’re hearing echoes of what some Catholics say. It’s funny how you’re supposed to be the “catholic” ones, which means “universal”…yet you have a strange tendency to be some of the least universal people in terms of your description of which Christians are actually in Christ’s Church.
I answered your questions and then some, so don’t repeat them unless you have a good reason. I know you don’t like the answers, but they won’t change just because you ask the same thing twice.
