John 3, especially Jesus’ conversation with Nicodemus, very clearly points to baptismal regeneration. To say that one is “born again” in any way other than baptism (water and the Spirit) completely distorts the text of John 3.
John 3:5
It amazes me how you can believe Johns gospel that in the beginning the Word was God, and the Word became flesh, but you refuse to believe the Word of Jesus who is God incarnate, to eat his body and drink his blood? and have the blasphemy of comparing our dear Lords word to a zombie movie?Sure, let’s do the gospel of Mark after John. Do you think the disciples ate the actual flesh of Jesus and drank his literal blood in the upper room while Jesus was still with them? I’m sorry if this offends, but I just watched a zombie movie with my son. Your comment reminded me of that flesh eating zombie movie. The 2nd feature should have been a vampire movie. Well, at least my comments are in-line with Halloween (Reformation day).
He has apologized for this. We are called to forgive him.
Anglicans & Lutherans. Church of Christ ARE Protestants, however they may look at the situation and they DO believe in baptismal regeneration – while at the same time accepting only believer’s baptism.
If we consider all Christians who are not in full communion with the Roman Church to be Protestants, then Orthodox Christians are protestants too. I think we should let Anglicans, Lutherans and Church of Christ believers on this site to speak for themselves. Church of Christ like Mormons both believe in baptismal regeneration, restoration theology and reject being protestants and both reject jusification by faith alone along-side with Catholics.
This is off topic but I’ll answer it.
There is no way that the Orthodox can be called Protestants. This is impossible by way of doctrine and history. Doctrinally they are about 98% in agreement with Catholics and they do not profess any of the Protestant doctrines. The Orthodox are in schism which is an entirely different issue. The schism predates the Reformation by an easy 500 years. They are completely unrelated.
Does the Orthodox Church submit to the Catholic Magesterium? Does the Orthodox Church claim to be the “One True Church”? The Church of Christ and The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints deny being Protestants along-side with the Orthodox Chruch. What makes The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints Protestants and not the Orthodox Church?
Once again I think it is not “either/or” Faith is a faculty, and ability built into our human nature. God kindles it with His word and His grace. If we respond to the grace, then we receive His grace. If we don’t respond to the call, then there is no way to access His grace, because faith is the avenue through which it flows. Even fallen people have faith, they just put it into fallne things, like the money market, and other things of that nature. You can’t have an idol without faith, either, so faith is functioning whenever someone places their worldly pursuits above the spiritual.
This much is Catholic.
This much is not. I do see how you tie it together, but the Apostles did not teach that a person could not desire Christ prior to being born again. That is why we call drawing grace “prevenient” (before coming). I think we are all in agreement, though, that no one comes to Christ unless the father draws them.
Clearly, NIcodemus was drawn to Christ, so much so that he snuck out there at night to see Him. He also recognized that Jesus was “with God” (even if he did not know He was God).
How do you reconcile your posting with infant baptismal regeneration and your view of free will. The infant is not capible of faith, and it seems you are invading his apparent God given free will to freely choose Christ. So much for free will, right? And think about it, God determined if the infant would be born in a pagan, Protestant, Catholic, Muslim, Hindu, etc household.
Check the roots, doctrines, and history and you’ve got the answer. If you study the great schism and what separates the Orthodox and Catholics you will see the closeness of the two and you will understand that which separates us. They do not profess the “solas” proclaimed by Protestants and they hold to all of the sacraments just as we do.
Even though these infants are given the gift of faith at baptism, they can choose to reject it later in life. That’s free will.
Love is PatientThat’s the issue. The new birth is regeneration and a new heart given to love God. The new birth changes our inclination from rebelllion and enmity to God, to love and worship of God because we receive a new nature and a new heart to love God. We are all born into this world loving darkness and hating God because of our sinful nature. We are spirituality blind unable to see Jesus as He is. Within regeneration and new birth, God grants us a new heart or new spirtual eyes to enable us to see Jesus as He is in degrees.Even though these infants are given the gift of faith at baptism, they can choose to reject it later in life. That’s free will.
Well at least that much we agree on!
So why do you call them “Mormon Christians” when you don’t believe they are?
I don’t understand why you would think this would be tough for the Catholic position (which is not Roman).
People who have been separated from the Apostolic Tradition. Once that happens, all kinds of strange doctrines emerge. I had one protestant on here tell me that baptism had nothing to do with water!
