Lost, Best Written TV Program

[Kay_Cee]

Hey, remember how we saw the breakup of the plane and the subsequent crash from the point of view of the Others?

Why on earth was that plane flying so low?

 

[Dandelion_Wine]

Why on earth was that plane flying so low?

Great question! Initially I thought - “I have no idea!”

But now I have one. When Desmond was late pushing the button and the whole magnet thing started up, possibly it pulled the plane down? Remember in the flashbacks we see the plane suddenly drop.

That’s my best guess.

My wife said she saw a preview last night and a survivor is going to die. My first thoughts were the guy golfing that we saw last week. Then I wondered about Mr. Echo.

Whatdya think?

 

[Kay_Cee]

When Desmond was late pushing the button and the whole magnet thing started up, possibly it pulled the plane down? Remember in the flashbacks we see the plane suddenly drop.

That’s my best guess.

Not a bad guess! I’d have to see the first episode again to see if that “flies.” Anybody out there have the first episode on DVD? Just how much time did the plane spend dropping? Is it conceivable that it could have dropped several hundred feet in the time shown?

 

[lukefan]

Okay after last nights show I’m still thinking this is purgatory. Echo wouldn’t confess, a black cloud comes and gets him so I’m thinking he is going to hell. However our beliefs are if you go to purgatory you won’t go to hell, you are only waiting for heaven. But then again, do all Catholics know that

Off topic - I was talking to my 10 year old CATHOLIC SCHOOL STUDENT about my theory on the show and purgatory - he doesn’t know what purgatory is Parent teacher conferences are tomorrow and this will be the topic of conversation.

 

[Kay_Cee]

Does anybody else find it just too coincidental that Ben needs a spinal surgeon and Jack happens to be one?

And, if Ben needs surgery so badly, why doesn’t he go back to civilization for it? Why would he choose to have the surgery in a place that obviously is not adequate (no crash cart, no cardiac paddles).

Could it be Jack is being tested? Could it be he is being set up here?

And, then again, doesn’t the island heal spinal injuries? Didn’t it do that for Locke?

 

[Dandelion_Wine]

Could it be Jack is being tested? Could it be he is being set up here?

THAT is an interesting premise. I’m curious to see how it plays out (note - I missed last nights episode and won’t see it until tonite!)

At first, with the revelation that Benjamin needs a spinal surgeon and Jack’s one, I thought - well that’s why they need Jack. Why do they want Kate & Sawyer. But I forgot about:

And, then again, doesn’t the island heal spinal injuries? Didn’t it do that for Locke?

EXACTLY! Also didn’t Rose have some sort of cancer and now she’s cured?

So maybe it is a test for Jack…

 

[JimR-OCDS]

Last evening’s episode was a good one!

There is no denying the spiritual aspect of the story.

Now I know why Echo was building a church on the Island. After he killed the thugs in his home church, the village woman said that they would send more thugs and they would burn the church down. She told Echo, you will have to build a new Church. He was carrying this out, on the Island, after his first religious experience.

 

[Contarini]

Okay after last nights show I’m still thinking this is purgatory. Echo wouldn’t confess, a black cloud comes and gets him so I’m thinking he is going to hell. However our beliefs are if you go to purgatory you won’t go to hell, you are only waiting for heaven. But then again, do all Catholics know that

Just because the show uses Catholic imagery doesn’t mean that it’s based on orthodox, traditional Catholic theology.

I think Eko’s final stance is supposed to be admirable. Note that most if not all the survivors have dark secrets of some sort, and much of the story line involves them coming to terms with their own past. I think the show is setting up a conflict between the “Others” with their desire to create some sort of perfect race of superbeings (hence the kidnapping of children, the experiments on Claire, Goodwin’s remark that the guy he killed was not on the list because he was “not a good person,” etc.), and the flawed but deeply human survivors.

This has been one of the main themes in literature, etc., for the past century–that the very flaws of humanity are something to be embraced–that we should celebrate who we are instead of wallowing in guilt. I think this is where the show is going, but I could be wrong. I would like to think that it will end up on a more nuanced note and one friendlier to Christian orthodoxy. The theme I’ve just described is not exactly orthodox, but not completely wrong either. Christians do, after all, believe that God loves us as we are (although he wants us to become holy), and we don’t believe in some sort of utopian social engineering.

I keep thinking of the movie *Serenity *and the villain’s declaration that he believes in a world without sin. I think that’s where *Lost *is headed, but we’ll see if I’m right.

Edwin

 

[Emly]

Maybe Eko was sorry for everything but what he did for Yemi. He thinks it was right to steal for him, and kill a man so Yemi wouldn’t have too.

But should the ends justify the means? I say no.

 

[Glutamine]

Regarding the theory about purgatory…the producers’ have said that…it is not purgatory. (((highlight space to read)

 

[Glutamine]

The producers of the show have already stated that the island is not purgratory.

 

[THutch04]

I love LOST!!! The only thing about it is that you really have to watch every episode or you’ll get confused. I do enjoy the storyline though, and it has very good music!!!

 

[YinYangMom]

Okay after last nights show I’m still thinking this is purgatory. Echo wouldn’t confess, a black cloud comes and gets him so I’m thinking he is going to hell. However our beliefs are if you go to purgatory you won’t go to hell, you are only waiting for heaven. But then again, do all Catholics know that

I didn’t understand Yemi saying “You speak to me as if I was your brother”…does that mean Ecko wasn’t seeing his brother? If it wasn’t his brother, who was it? He didn’t behave as God or Jesus, in my opinion…

If it’s the island seeking confession and casting judgement then it can’t be purgatory but something else.

I also did not get the impression Ecko was damned to hell…instead I considered his death by the cloud a release from this reality - ultimately freeing him to be with his brother.

Remember, we see the two of them walking as younger boys…certainly Yemi would be in heaven, don’t you think?

Perhaps the brutal nature of his death was the result of not repenting of killing people…that if he had the cloud would have brought about his death in a more peaceful manner??

 

[NPS]

Errr…To me, last night’s episode validated some criticisms of the show. Namely:
*They skirt around the issues too much, and baby-step their way to any sort of real revelation to what’s going on.
*They don’t really understand Catholic theology and cherry-pick things that fill out the mystery simply for the feel of it.

I’ve heard several people who suspect that the producers really don’t have any sort of long-range plan and I’m starting to believe that myself. If it wasn’t for Eko dying, last night’s show was basically humdrum. If a show relies on a character dying to get emotion this early in the season that’s usually a bad sign.

A couple of "for instance"s:
They invariably mangle Catholic things, such as last night when Mr Eko was told he MUST go to confession to be JUDGED.
And there’s no way that in all the survivors there wouldn’t be many (dozens?) of Catholics and when they hear a priest is among the survivors, he would have to do all sorts of priestly duties where he would easily be found out as a fake priest.

I am convinced they had no plan for The Others and how they fit into the story. First they were going to be a ragtag bunch of competing survivors from another crash with the bearded guy as their leader. Then they made the mole (Henry Gale) into the actual leader/evil genius and transplanted the whole thing to a civilized area. Why would Henry Gale, the evil genius who masterminds everything and gives orders, send himself to be the mole/hostage? Especially when he is under threat from an apparent coup? And most especially when he is dying of a spinal tumor. (Remember that on LOST we are only talking about a handful of days. His captivity in the hatch was only about a week ago–we can even still see his split lip)

I don’t know—it’s still one of my favorite and “don’t miss” shows. I’m just becoming a bit skeptical and ( I guess) worried that it’s not going to pan out as good as it first seemed.

 

[Kay_Cee]

I don’t know exactly why, but I keep seeing the island as more a Garden of Eden than purgatory.

The black “cloud” seems very evil and in a way “snake-like.” The Hebrew word in Genesis that is used to depict Satan is nahash, which means both snake and dragon. I think a case could be made to describe the cloud as either one.

Wouldn’t it also be kind of the opposite of the glory cloud that God appeared to the Israelites as?

Opinions?

 

[Kevin42]

I don’t know exactly why, but I keep seeing the island as more a Garden of Eden than purgatory.

That is what occured to me last night. Especially right before Eko died, when he was walking through all of the flowers with the mountains in the background. It just hit me…maybe this is the Garden of Eden.

I’m not happy Eko died though…I really wanted him to stay with the group and be their spiritual leader .

Alsooooooo, I just finished looking at the LOST Discussion Forums, and the arguments that the black smoke is the Islands version of God is quite persuasive.

"Smokey is written as a God, asking for a confession, a repentance, through the realization that one has done bad things. And that doing bad is bad.

Yet Eko has taken the philosophy that by doing these bad things he is actually doing some greater good. It’s the age old argument that if I kill you for the bad you are doing, I am saving others from your action. Even still, I have done bad.

Smokey’s ‘you speak to me like your brother’ is a duality saying to Eko ‘you expect me to accept the bad things you’ve done by the same reasoning as other men would.’

But God, Smokey in this scenario, shows us there is no such thing as greater good. It is a man made excuse allowing men to perform bad acts without fear, in hopes there will be no retribution from God.

It is the same lamentable thinking by which men lie, cheat, steal, rob, rape, and kill polishing it like a diamond and claiming some greater good. But the acts are still bad."

“In Eko’s case, God (Smokey) rejected the excuses a man would use in reasoning with him and simply says, ‘you didn’t even know me.’”

-Go.com | The Walt Disney Company

 

[lukefan]

I don’t know—it’s still one of my favorite and “don’t miss” shows. I’m just becoming a bit skeptical and ( I guess) worried that it’s not going to pan out as good as it first seemed.

But it sure does beat all the reality shows:thumbsup:

 

[dranzal]

First, the show producers have stated that the show is not “purgatory”.

Regarding Smokie…I have read some theories that Smokie is a plot device basically allowing the viewer to “see” the person’s conscience. When Eko first encounters Smokie, he stares at it and images from his past appear in the smoke. Is it possible, therefore, that what we saw as Smokie beating him to a pulp was merely a physical representation of Eko’s guilt getting the better of him and him killing himself by climbing and jumping from a tree? Smokie’s last move was to lift Eko high in the air and then slam him into the ground.

Likewise, when John Locke saw the “heart of the island” he saw a bright light which he described as beautiful. While he had some hard times in his past, he was usually the guileless victim.

I also agree with the poster that pointed out that if Ben does have a tumor and if he does know how to get back to civilization, what need has he of Jack? Why all the mind games? Why not just say, “hey, we saw your plane crash. Can we help? We have cheeseburgers and fries. By the way, is anyone here a spinal surgeon who can work on a tumor?” What is with all the game playing and mind control?

 

[leaner]

I didn’t understand Yemi saying “You speak to me as if I was your brother”…does that mean Ecko wasn’t seeing his brother? If it wasn’t his brother, who was it? He didn’t behave as God or Jesus, in my opinion…

If it’s the island seeking confession and casting judgement then it can’t be purgatory but something else.

I also did not get the impression Ecko was damned to hell…instead I considered his death by the cloud a release from this reality - ultimately freeing him to be with his brother.

Remember, we see the two of them walking as younger boys…certainly Yemi would be in heaven, don’t you think?

Perhaps the brutal nature of his death was the result of not repenting of killing people…that if he had the cloud would have brought about his death in a more peaceful manner??

An interesting point our priest brought up on All Souls Day was that purgatory isn’t necessarily “one step up from Hell” as many see it, but rather being denied the immediate presence of God upon death (which should seem like Hell, no?) – while the soul purges the sins so as to become worthy to enter the Kingdom…neither here nor there, just triggered the memory of that sermon…

 

[gmarie21]

Is it just me, or does Ben kinda remind anyone else of Gene Wilder when he played Willy Wonka? YOu know, kinda twisted and creepy and disturbed?