Mary Mediatrix of All Graces

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I won’t argue with Pope Leo XIII on this question, either.
"Pope Leo XIII, Iucunda semper, said:
“… when He [the Father] has been invoked with excellent prayers, our humble voice turns to Mary; in accordance with no other law than that law of conciliation and petition which was expressed as follows by St. Bernardine of Siena : ‘Every grace that is communicated to this world has a threefold course. For by excellent order, it is dispensed from God to Christ, from Christ to the Virgin, from the Virgin to us.’”

https://www.ewtn.com/faith/teachings/marya4.htm
 
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For some reason I haven’t put very much thought yet into Mary’s presence at Pentecost.
It’s like she does the most possible good that can be done with the most minimal action. “Okay this next event will be necessary to fulfill in order for there to be any salvation in the world: better make sure Mary’s there.”
She appears so infrequently in the NT–but only at all the most important events: the Annunciation/His conception, His nativity, His presentation to the temple, an exclusive place in His hidden childhood, His first public miracle, His Passion, and the Descent of the Holy Spirit…

“Jesus gave more glory to God his Father by submitting to his Mother for thirty years than he would have given him had he converted the whole world by working the greatest miracles. How highly then do we glorify God when to please him we submit ourselves to Mary, taking Jesus as our sole model.”
St. Louis de Montfort (TD, 18)

Very mysterious! I’ve been quoting TD a lot lately, not to treat it as an infallible authority, but it’s actually a really interesting thought: If Jesus could have given more glory to God the Father by converting the whole world during those thirty years, then He would have done it, wouldn’t He? But instead He remained in a hidden life with Mary. One of the ways it seems God teaches us through Scripture and His Church, is to first show us how little we understand about Him.
 
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The Eucharist is a grace that I think of as “through” Mary because she bore Christ.

The graces I was mentioning are the ones I specifically ask Mary to give me. I pray to Our Lady of Grace frequently. My mother had a plastic statue of her that was about the first Mary I remember at all. I have it myself now.

I ask Our Lady to distribute me the graces I need and I feel confident she gives them to me.

All this other stuff just seems to me to be a lot of overthinking. I’m a pretty simple bear though and I love Mary whatever anybody says. She’s my adopted mom.
 
Tis_Bearself said:
The Eucharist is a grace that I think of as “through” Mary because she bore Christ.

The graces I was mentioning are the ones I specifically ask Mary to give me. I pray to Our Lady of Grace frequently. My mother had a plastic statue of her that was about the first Mary I remember at all. I have it myself now.

I ask Our Lady to distribute me the graces I need and I feel confident she gives them to me.

All this other stuff just seems to me to be a lot of overthinking. I’m a pretty simple bear though and I love Mary whatever anybody says. She’s my adopted mom.
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Yes, you can think of it that way; that is one of the meanings attached to the title “Mediatrix.”

For as long as this theology is understood (as Vatican II states it) in terms of her intercessory and cooperative role, there are no issues. Other imagery such as “distribute” even if ensconced in a papal encyclical do not conjure up accurate images, at least for me. Where you say “distribute” I would rather use the more precise term “obtain.”

As for overthinking, I would rather understand the best I can. One can love only as far as one knows. So I seek to know and understand more so that I can love more.
 
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Catholics don’t go by Bible alone.

The authentic teaching authority of the Church is my compass. (Magisterium).

We have a three-legged stool: 1. Sacred Scripture, 2. Magisterium, and 3. Tradition with a capital “T”.
 
Fauken said:
How about her espousals, then? She was espoused to Joseph, that is doctrine, is it not? Are those questionable because they’re not celebrated in the OF? Is her humility questionable because it’s not in the OF? Her interior life blemished? Is she not the Mother of the Divine Shepard anymore because it’s not in the OF?
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We’re talking about titles here.
 
Please refute logical syllogism, above. Also please reference EWTN citation containing statements by St. Pius X, Pope Leo XIii, St. Bernardine, etc., above.
 
How is her espousal to St. Joseph a title? Or her humility? Or interior life?
 
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I’ve tried to explain this to Agathon previously and it seems to have made no impact. A simple way to understand this is to remember the Holy Trinity’s eternity and foreknowledge of all things. Not one thing was made in creation without the Holy Virgin in mind. It is only through her that God chose to enter into creation, making the relationship between all creatures and God deified. Even the Angels benefit greatly from the incarnation. It is hard to fathom since we exist in time, and think of her birth as meaning the beginning of her role, but Christ makes it clear that the saints have been known from the beginning of creation. This is also how Christ redeems all of mankind, even before His incarnation. A choice is given, but the means of this choice go through the Holy Virgin’s role given to her because of her Holiness.
 
Fauken said:
Could you please point out then where exactly in his logic that his premises fail to follow? Or that one of them are false?
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That doesn’t work as great in religion.

It’s well known in Judaism that an utterly perfect, incorruptible God couldn’t possibly incarnate. Flesh decays! How can God be made flesh?!?

Yet Christ…
 
Again, there is a feast of Mary, Mediatrix of ALL Graces in the liturgy. This isn’t a matter open to discussion.
 
There were a list of premises and a conclusion, whether it works well or not, that was what I was referencing:
anon10271182 said:
I repeat, in logical form:

A simple syllogism:

If Christ, the Second Person of the Trinity, is the source of all graces, and

Mary is Mediatrix between humanity and Christ, then

Mary is Mediatrix of all graces.
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What you said was “Mary is the only means of salvation” which, in fact goes against Church teaching.
 
Fauken said:
There were a list of premises and a conclusion, whether it works well or not, that was what I was referencing:
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anon10271182:
I repeat, in logical form:

A simple syllogism:

If Christ, the Second Person of the Trinity, is the source of all graces, and

Mary is Mediatrix between humanity and Christ, then

Mary is Mediatrix of all graces.
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No, you’re not reading here.

Crafting logical syllogisms isn’t fool-proof in religion because Christ’s existence itself violates the logic of the religion from which Christianity grew. God-man is an impossible contradiction yet here it is.

-But because I loved logic in college…

You have a term issue in your syllogism. There is no clear, unambiguous term shared by both the first and second premises so you can’t even clearly draw a conclusion from them.

But whatevs.
 
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Salvation is a Grace. If the Holy Virgin is the mediator of all Graces, this would mean she is the mediator of Salvation. What I was saying is actually just a part of this larger view of her, which includes the purpose of creation in it as well. It’s okay if you don’t understand it fully, because no one does, but you should be cautious in labeling it as wrong.
 
I think the word “Christ” is rather clear and unambiguous.
 
anon10271182 said:
I repeat, in logical form:

A simple syllogism:

If Christ, the Second Person of the Trinity, is the source of all graces, and

Mary is Mediatrix between humanity and Christ, then

Mary is Mediatrix of all graces.

If one accepts both premises one must accept the conclusion.
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I’m almost certain that this is the logic that Saints like St. John of Damascus and others of that time used to emphasize the glory of the Holy Virgin Mary.
 
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