Men - how do you feel about your wife seeing a male physician?

[Homers]

Doctors are capable of professional detachment you know - they’re not going to fall in love or lust with a patient just by seeing them naked. Like most people, they’re just as likely to fall in love or lust with a fully clothed person as a naked one.

So if you’re going to worry about your wife being ‘exposed’, you should be just as worried about her being clothed. For that matter you should worry about every other male she comes into contact with - her boss and co-workers, your pastor and fellow parishioners, and so on.

I’ve got plenty of doctors in the family of both genders - and have been treated often enough myself by them AND other doctors - to know that it’s a totally false assumption that women are better than women or men with men. Does a doctor have to suffer cancer him or herself to be able to effectively treat it? Do they have to go through brainsurgery themselves to be able to effectively perform it? No.

And what, pray tell, makes you think that exposing oneself to a strange WOMAN doctor is any different in terms of embarrassment? I know it isn’t for me, and I suspect it isn’t for most women - it’s the fact that it’s a stranger rather than the fact that the doctor is male or female that makes it difficult. Again, you’re assuming you know women better than we know ourselves.

And less chance for funny business? Again, you’re assuming that you know our doctors better than we, who are the ones who are treated by them, know them.

Lily, I am concerned about my wife in all facets of life, clothed or not! Sorry to say, there have been a great many doctors that have had affairs with their patients. While I definitely do not have that concern with my wife. Being my wife’s husband it is my position to try to protect her. Women doctors have the same plumbing as other women. I have never seen an article involving any liberties referencing a woman doctor.

 

[whatevergirl]

And here again we come full circle, back to what I said about 5 pages ago…that it’s really about you Homers, and not your wife’s safety, or fear of her being assaulted, bla bla bla…it’s more about you not wanting another man to see her naked, because you view this somehow as a betrayal of her, to do this. If she were to arrive to her appt one day, in need of an exam, and a female doctor suddenly wasn’t available, say, left to go home, sick or something–and your wife opted to take her appt with the male physician, would you be irate with her? That is the problem with what you’re saying here…that it’s not so much that any of us ‘care’ that you feel your wife should only see a male ob/gyn, but rather your reasons seem to stem from respect issues with wives to husbands…perhaps trust issues as well (thus your reason for bringing up that ‘some’ wmen become aroused during the exams)

The bottom line Homers is that if you don’t trust your wife around other men…or trust other men around your wife…this ‘logic’ of yours will seep into other areas of your life, I imagine it has already. Your ‘respect’ issues and so forth are not healthy, and again, I say that out of Christian charity. It’s not healthy to distrust medical professionals simply because they are men. It’s not healthy to create this distrust in your wife, and your marriage.

Your wife choosing to see a male physician shouldn’t leave you feeling disrespected or betrayed as a husband. You’re entitled to your opinions, but I’m just observing how things have come full circle back to you saying it’s NOT really about being assaulted it’s about your wife’s respect for you.

 

[Homers]

That’s tragic, and you’re disrespecting a lot of perfectly modest, wonderful women who trust, as they should, their male gynaecologists to do a professional job in a professional way.

I think the very use of the term ‘intimate’ is completely misleading and fallacious. ‘intimate’ suggests that there’s always or often an emotional component involved. Candelit suppers for two between a loving couple are ‘intimate’. Candlelit suppers for two between lawyer and client where all that is discussed is an upcoming court case are anything but.

Someone, male or female, sticking cold steel or a gloved finger - or worse still a colposcope - into your privates is anything BUT intimate.

It’s no more ‘intimate’ than an ear or throat exam, or having a stethoscope against your chest.

I’m sure some women might get aroused by a pelvic exam, but then some men get aroused by a woman in high-heeled shoes - and you’re not suggesting female doctors should do away with THEM because of it

Lily…I mean you can call it anything you want “intimate exam” or not. The fact is that a person is exposing their most private parts is the issue. The ears and throat aren’t sexual organs.

 

[Homers]

I beg to differ - if she trusts her doctor and you don’t, then you’re showing no respect whatsoever for her judgement, instead you’re substituting your own for hers because you think your judgement is superior and hers isn’t as good.

You can be sure just as many men have thought they could trust THEIR (male, for argument’s sake) doctors and were also deeply hurt and violated by them - either sexually or in other ways. With equally devastating and lifelong results, sure. But it goes to show that even the greatest of protectors cannot eliminate risk either for themselves or others.

And you are barking up the wrong tree if you think disapproving of a male gynaecologist is protecting her from anything. She is far more likely to be raped in your own home - by you her loving husband - as in any surgery by any doctor.

I actually beg to differ regarding your last paragraph on this one. I submit that any women is at a higher risk of improprieties occurring while being exposed to a male doctor then they are at home by any family member. My opinion opinion is just as valid until you show any stats?

 

[Homers]

What reason would you have to see a gynaecologist? And why would your wife not trust another man with you?

sure, I have a male doctor…I try not to have a double standard.

 

[LilyM]

Lily…I mean you can call it anything you want “intimate exam” or not. The fact is that a person is exposing their most private parts is the issue. The ears and throat aren’t sexual organs.

Neither are the ‘private parts’ sexual organs to a doctor, but mere parts of the body. This is what I’m trying to stress - it’s *just another *part of the body, about as arousing to a doctor, in itself, as an ear or throat.

By the way, I’ve heard of plenty of psychiatrists and dentists - every bit as much as gynaecologists or anyone else - either having affairs with their patients or abusing them during consultations. I know I’ve certainly never taken off a stitch of clothing for my dentist or my shrink, or shown either my ‘private parts’. Goes to show clothing or lack thereof, private parts or display thereof, is no issue at all.

 

[Homers]

Why should any woman respect a man who doesn’t trust her to choose her own doctor wisely? What makes you think you’re better able to choose a doctor for her than she is for herself?

Why does your wife need protection ‘from making a mistake’ - unless you think she’s more prone to making mistakes (and thus less intelligent) than you are?

Lily…my wife choses all of her own doctors. Fortunately she has enough respect for herself and for me to chose a female doctor for all of her annual exams, etc.

 

[LilyM]

I actually beg to differ regarding your last paragraph on this one. I submit that any women is at a higher risk of improprieties occurring while being exposed to a male doctor then they are at home by any family member. My opinion opinion is just as valid until you show any stats?

libraryindex.com/pages/2057/Rape-Sexual-Harassment-Around-World-MARITAL-RAPE.html

Knock yourself out. Particularly these two bits -

“More than three-quarters of women who were raped and/or physically assaulted from the age of eighteen were assaulted by a current or former husband, cohabiting partner, or date” and

“Diana Russell reported on interviews with a random sample of 930 women in the San Francisco area. Of all the women who had been married, 14% had been raped by their spouses at least once. Of this number, one-third reported being raped once; one-third reported between two and twenty incidents; and one-third said they had been raped by their spouses more than twenty times.”

You seriously think 14% of all women who’ve seen a male doctor for an intimate exam have been raped on that occasion - even once? Or one third of all women who have been raped during intimate exams by doctors have been raped during in those circumstances MORE THAN TWENTY TIMES?

It’s crystal clear that husbands are much more of a threat.

 

[LilyM]

sure, I have a male doctor…I try not to have a double standard.

Oh my apologies, that was a misreading.

Interesting though - according to you, women doctors either can’t or never have (to your knowledge) assaulted patients - in fact they’re so trustworthy that you’re happy to leave your wife to their tender mercies.

So why would either you or your wife have concerns about you with a female doctor, after all you can trust a woman … right? And you can’t trust a man … right?

Aren’t you putting yourself in most grave danger of assault by exposing your most intimate parts to a male? By your logic you’re better off with a female, since they’re supposedly so much less likely or capable of assault, no?

 

[Homers]

And here again we come full circle, back to what I said about 5 pages ago…that it’s really about you Homers, and not your wife’s safety, or fear of her being assaulted, bla bla bla…it’s more about you not wanting another man to see her naked, because you view this somehow as a betrayal of her, to do this. If she were to arrive to her appt one day, in need of an exam, and a female doctor suddenly wasn’t available, say, left to go home, sick or something–and your wife opted to take her appt with the male physician, would you be irate with her? That is the problem with what you’re saying here…that it’s not so much that any of us ‘care’ that you feel your wife should only see a male ob/gyn, but rather your reasons seem to stem from respect issues with wives to husbands…perhaps trust issues as well (thus your reason for bringing up that ‘some’ wmen become aroused during the exams)

The bottom line Homers is that if you don’t trust your wife around other men…or trust other men around your wife…this ‘logic’ of yours will seep into other areas of your life, I imagine it has already. Your ‘respect’ issues and so forth are not healthy, and again, I say that out of Christian charity. It’s not healthy to distrust medical professionals simply because they are men. It’s not healthy to create this distrust in your wife, and your marriage.

Your wife choosing to see a male physician shouldn’t leave you feeling disrespected or betrayed as a husband. You’re entitled to your opinions, but I’m just observing how things have come full circle back to you saying it’s NOT really about being assaulted it’s about your wife’s respect for you.

Hey, Whatevergirl, welcome back. Wrong, wrong, wrong…like I said before, my wife has enough respect for herself, and also for me to see a female doctor for her intimate needs. Yes, my wife would not see a male subsitute doctor if it involved any disrobing, and if she did, it would be considered a violation to the marriage. But, I contend that she would not do it anyways. It’s about respect for each other. I don’t distrust my wife. It again seems your trying to justify some of your past choices, which is between you and your husband.

 

[Homers]

Neither are the ‘private parts’ sexual organs to a doctor, but mere parts of the body. This is what I’m trying to stress - it’s *just another *part of the body, about as arousing to a doctor, in itself, as an ear or throat.

By the way, I’ve heard of plenty of psychiatrists and dentists - every bit as much as gynaecologists or anyone else - either having affairs with their patients or abusing them during consultations. I know I’ve certainly never taken off a stitch of clothing for my dentist or my shrink, or shown either my ‘private parts’. Goes to show clothing or lack thereof, private parts or display thereof, is no issue at all.

Lily…Have you kindly reviewed the previous student-doctor link within this very thread? I would like to think that the gyn exam is simply clinical, however, too many doctors have crossed the line, and the aforementioned website definitely supports this contention.

 

[LilyM]

Lily…Have you kindly reviewed the previous student-doctor link within this very thread? I would like to think that the gyn exam is simply clinical, however, too many doctors have crossed the line, and the aforementioned website definitely supports this contention.

Have you reviewed my link about marital rape? I repeat, you are much more of a threat to your wife than any male gynaecologist could possibly be.

 

[Homers]

libraryindex.com/pages/2057/Rape-Sexual-Harassment-Around-World-MARITAL-RAPE.html

Knock yourself out. Particularly these two bits -

“More than three-quarters of women who were raped and/or physically assaulted from the age of eighteen were assaulted by a current or former husband, cohabiting partner, or date” and

“Diana Russell reported on interviews with a random sample of 930 women in the San Francisco area. Of all the women who had been married, 14% had been raped by their spouses at least once. Of this number, one-third reported being raped once; one-third reported between two and twenty incidents; and one-third said they had been raped by their spouses more than twenty times.”

You seriously think 14% of all women who’ve seen a male doctor for an intimate exam have been raped on that occasion - even once? Or one third of all women who have been raped during intimate exams by doctors have been raped during in those circumstances MORE THAN TWENTY TIMES?

It’s crystal clear that husbands are much more of a threat.

Lily, I dont disagree with you that there is sometimes domestic abuse, but this does not show a comparison between that percentages of male doctors vs. domestic abuse. Plus, again, I have never seen an article involving any proprieties by a female doctor.

 

[LilyM]

It again seems your trying to justify some of your past choices, which is between you and your husband.

Not according to you. According to you NO couple who took their marital vows seriously would consider disrobing in front of a doctor of the opposite gender, no? So you’re very much passing judgement on her for something that, according to you, is between herself and her husband.

 

[whatevergirl]

Um, no…not justifying any prior choices. Seeing male doctors never violated my marriage, Homers. I find it surprising, your views, that’s all…that you really consider your wife seeing a male physician as a betrayal of some sort.

As a violation of your marriage.

Hmmm. That’s just surprising to me. Sorry, it just is.

I will say this though…if my husband did have an issue with me seeing a male ob/gyn, I wouldn’t want to hurt him by seeing one. I wouldn’t debate it with him. That would be strange, me arguing that I must see a male ob/gyn. lol Then, he might be suspicious.:ehh: But, thankfully, this never had to happen, and my husband loved the docs that delivered our babies…they were both men. He attended some of my exams, way back when with these men as my docs, and told me one day…'yuck, no wonder they get paid so much. ’ Definitely not fun.

So, really, he saw first hand, there is no intimacy going on during these exams. My husband is a pretty level headed guy, not jealous, and reasonable. Not saying you are not reasonable, but likening an annual pap smear to a potential, intimate sexual liasion is a little out there, Homers.

That being said, I must be heading off. G’night for now.

 

[Homers]

Oh my apologies, that was a misreading.

Interesting though - according to you, women doctors either can’t or never have (to your knowledge) assaulted patients - in fact they’re so trustworthy that you’re happy to leave your wife to their tender mercies.

So why would either you or your wife have concerns about you with a female doctor, after all you can trust a woman … right? And you can’t trust a man … right?

Aren’t you putting yourself in most grave danger of assault by exposing your most intimate parts to a male? By your logic you’re better off with a female, since they’re supposedly so much less likely or capable of assault, no?

Lily…I understand your point. Statistically, I would say your correct…, but then I would kind of have a double standard. I guess we’re mainly talking about the exposure issue to the opposite sex…and the risk associated with it. It is very easy for a male doctor (a man) to overpower a woman, plus with a woman being naked/vunerable. Why would any woman put herself in that position.

 

[LilyM]

Lily, I dont disagree with you that there is sometimes domestic abuse, but this does not show a comparison between that percentages of male doctors vs. domestic abuse. Plus, again, I have never seen an article involving any proprieties by a female doctor.

The comparisons are self evident for anyone with even a basic grasp of mathematics.

THREE QUARTERS of all rapes are ‘domestic’. ONE QUARTER, by definition, are not - these ones are either committed by strangers, doctors, other acquaintances or family members other than husband or partner.

It’s abundantly clear that even if EVERY non-domestic rape were committed by a doctor, your wife would still be THREE TIMES more likely to be raped by you (since I assume she doesn’t cohabit with other non-related adult males, or date males other than yourself) than by a doctor.

 

[Homers]

Um, no…not justifying any prior choices. Seeing male doctors never violated my marriage, Homers. I find it surprising, your views, that’s all…that you really consider your wife seeing a male physician as a betrayal of some sort.

As a violation of your marriage.

Hmmm. That’s just surprising to me. Sorry, it just is.

I will say this though…if my husband did have an issue with me seeing a male ob/gyn, I wouldn’t want to hurt him by seeing one. I wouldn’t debate it with him. That would be strange, me arguing that I must see a male ob/gyn. lol Then, he might be suspicious.:ehh: But, thankfully, this never had to happen, and my husband loved the docs that delivered our babies…they were both men. He attended some of my exams, way back when with these men as my docs, and told me one day…'yuck, no wonder they get paid so much. ’ Definitely not fun.

So, really, he saw first hand, there is no intimacy going on during these exams. My husband is a pretty level headed guy, not jealous, and reasonable. Not saying you are not reasonable, but likening an annual pap smear to a potential, intimate sexual liasion is a little out there, Homers.

That being said, I must be heading off. G’night for now.

Thank you for saying that you wouldn’t want to hurt him, and that you would be receptive towards his feelings, if he would have an issue. take care.

 

[LilyM]

Lily…I understand your point. Statistically, I would say your correct…, but then I would kind of have a double standard. I guess we’re mainly talking about the exposure issue to the opposite sex…and the risk associated with it. It is very easy for a male doctor (a man) to overpower a woman, plus with a woman being naked/vunerable. Why would any woman put herself in that position.

Yes, you do have a double standard. There is every bit as much danger from being exposed to someone of the same sex who is gay as someone of the opposite sex, so why is sex an issue? I doubt that you’ve ever asked most if any of your male doctors whether they’re gay, have you?

Plus, you’re assuming that physical overpowerment is a necessity.

A lot of assaults that I’ve seen reported have happened on patients while they were sedated - it’s far easier. You ever been given gas to numb you in the dentist’s chair? Ever been put under sedation or anaesthetic by any other doctor? Makes you a heck of a lot more vulnerable than most woman, even naked ones, if they aren’t sedated.

You’re probably assuming that stirrups are usually used, thus rendering the woman less mobile, right? Wrong. All bar one of the pap smears I’ve had during the course of my life didn’t involve the use of stirrups at all, and that’s about the only reason the majority of women see a gynaecologist.

And no gynae exams are done under anaesthetic - only surgeries/births, where loads of nurses, relatives etc are present making the likelihood insignificant.

 

[Homers]

The comparisons are self evident for anyone with even a basic grasp of mathematics.

THREE QUARTERS of all rapes are ‘domestic’. ONE QUARTER, by definition, are not - these ones are either committed by strangers, doctors, other acquaintances or family members other than husband or partner.

It’s abundantly clear that even if EVERY non-domestic rape were committed by a doctor, your wife would still be THREE TIMES more likely to be raped by you (since I assume she doesn’t cohabit with other non-related adult males, or date males other than yourself) than by a doctor.

Well, your point is quite concieved. However, we’re all human, and full of emotions, and feelings and at the end of the day we all have to go home to our spouses, being able to look into the eyes of your spouse, saying that I did all I could do to fight the good fight, and to limit one’s exposure and chances of any improprieties from occurring.