Mich. governor signs 48-month welfare limit

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qui_est_ce said:
Why?
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Crime rates will undoubtedly go up even though many in here will deny that and claim its nothing more then Liberal hysteria.

Since there are really no jobs out there for the 14 million out of work, some, but not everyone, will turn to illegal activities (robbery, shoplifting, violence, etc) in order to survive for whatever the reason. Many, if not most, will be caught, prosecuted and be incarcerated in prision for who know’s how many years. With that comes the cost of prosecuting the accused; medical, food, clothing, sheltering the prisioner, maintaining the building housing the prisoners, paying corrections officers to supervise the inmates, dental care, support services, appeals, etc.

I hope the Governor of Michigan implores those not incarcerated to work harder and make much more money then they already are since they are going to have to foot the bill for this.
 
Ridgerunner said:
We sometimes get applicants who are doing their obligatgory “job search” for the employment office that are in no way qualified to do our work, but who could do other kinds of work. We require extremely good written English, and some at least basic familiarity with word processing. They apply here in order to get turned down. Some turn up looking as nasty as possible, or initiate the conversation by telling me how they can’t do this or that or the other thing, or won’t. I have even had two tell me they came in to be turned down.
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I would tell that to the FCS office. And this is the reason why I think they should be monitored closely. There should be a person in that office who can help them find jobs and send them on interviews. Treating them like children? You bet. Obviously they can’t take care of themselves, so someone has to show them the way…and make sure an honest effort is being made to find employment.
 
qui_est_ce said:
s.

What many of us here are objecting to is the FEDERAL government’s involvement in “charity.”
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Correct, they enabled generations to live off others…As for unemployment I know people who could take other jobs if they wanted to but are taking advantage of the benefits.
 
qui_est_ce said:
Well, I keep hearing the crime rate is up due to the bad economy. I don’t believe that people in this country turn to robbing banks because they lost their jobs.
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Even otherwise decent people turn to crime when they reach despair (less than decent ones often do of course without having to experience despair). The attitude that people are just either good or bad, criminals or not, and that’s that, nothing to do with mthe circumstances, is just naive. Why are criminals flled with people are poor and destitute? They weren’t naturally that way, but again, their circumstances make it all the more tempting.
There’s not a reason in the world for a child in this country to go hungry or shelterless. If it’s the parents’ fault, they should be taken away from the parents. Irresponsible parents should not benefit from programs for children.
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I agree. I hold what may be a controversial view, that too many children are left to their irresponsible parents in this country. They may cry when the social service worker takes them away, but so does any child cry when you take a way his pet, that doesn’t mean he’s capable of taking care of it. The welfare of the children needs to come far before the feelings of the parent in that situation.

While I definitely agree that it is fundamentally the parents’ responsibility to take care of their children as well, they often don’t flfill that responsibility, and I don’t think it would be Christian at all (it would I think be purely un-Christian) to say ‘oh well, let the kids suffer anyway, it’s not our fault.’ When parents fail to be parents, the state does in fact need to intervene; punish the parents for negligence by all means, but their kids shouldn’t suffer for their ineptitude.
 
Rence said:
I would tell that to the FCS office. And this is the reason why I think they should be monitored closely. There should be a person in that office who can help them find jobs and send them on interviews. Treating them like children? You bet. Obviously they can’t take care of themselves, so someone has to show them the way…and make sure an honest effort is being made to find employment.
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Re: The two who admitted they just wanted a turn down, I wouldn’t sign the paper the employment office sent showing they had applied. The others? Hard to know who is a faker and who is just an unkempt whiner.
 
qui_est_ce said:
At one point in my life, I was looking to buy a two family flat an live in one unit. I was shocked by the garbage bags full of clothes lying all over the place.
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How many rental units have you owned? I’ve owned about 21, both “slummy” and nice, and both “decent” and “low-class” tenants have left their apartments dirty and full of junk when they left. Not all, to be sure, but the presence of garbage is not much of an indicator of the class of the tenant. 🤷
 
gamewell45 said:
Crime rates will undoubtedly go up even though many in here will deny that and claim its nothing more then Liberal hysteria.

Since there are really no jobs out there for the 14 million out of work, some, but not everyone, will turn to illegal activities (robbery, shoplifting, violence, etc) in order to survive for whatever the reason. Many, if not most, will be caught, prosecuted and be incarcerated in prision for who know’s how many years. With that comes the cost of prosecuting the accused; medical, food, clothing, sheltering the prisioner, maintaining the building housing the prisoners, paying corrections officers to supervise the inmates, dental care, support services, appeals, etc.

I hope the Governor of Michigan implores those not incarcerated to work harder and make much more money then they already are since they are going to have to foot the bill for this.
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This is a very real scenario!
 
qui_est_ce said:
That’s a rather uncharitable characterization of the CAF posters. You’ve seen no evidence suggesting that. Most of us here donate time and money to charities.
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Have you seen evidence of that?

My take is that CAF posters are a varied lot; some like you generous to a fault, maybe even most that way (though I have no evidence to back this up), and some who would make the buffalo on a nickel holler before giving it up. Catholics can be as goodhearted or mean-spirited as any other people though I like to believe that there’s more goodheartedness among our fellow CAF posters. 🙂
 
Rich_Olszewski said:
How many rental units have you owned? I’ve owned about 21, both “slummy” and nice, and both “decent” and “low-class” tenants have left their apartments dirty and full of junk when they left. Not all, to be sure, but the presence of garbage is not much of an indicator of the class of the tenant. 🤷
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The garbage bags were full of clothes. They weren’t being thrown away. I don’t know why they were in garbage bags, maybe that’s they way they got them. Maybe that’s they way they store them. Maybe that’s how they get them to and from the laundromat. The people were still living there. There were bags and bags of clothing. There is no reason for anyone to go without decent clothing, shelter, and food in this country.
 
Rich_Olszewski said:
My take is that CAF posters are a varied lot; some like you generous to a fault, maybe even most that way (though I have no evidence to back this up), and some who would make the buffalo on a nickel holler before giving it up. Catholics can be as goodhearted or mean-spirited as any other people though I like to believe that there’s more goodheartedness among our fellow CAF posters. 🙂
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Exactly. That’s why Ringil was wrong to assume we CAF posters would push for stricter time limits. I think it was a mean-spirited post.
 
Sad to see how children are used as an political club only after they are born.:mad:
 
qui_est_ce said:
The garbage bags were full of clothes. They weren’t being thrown away. I don’t know why they were in garbage bags, maybe that’s they way they got them. Maybe that’s they way they store them. Maybe that’s how they get them to and from the laundromat. The people were still living there. There were bags and bags of clothing. There is no reason for anyone to go without decent clothing, shelter, and food in this country.
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Even if they had so many bags of clothing that the place looked like Collier’s mansion, it didn’t mean that they weren’t going hungry.

And, hey! Even I use a garbage bag to drag all the stuff that has to be washed into the garage where my washer and dryer are! Women are so much more refined than men, using laundry bags, sorting things, and the such. I just need the easiest way to get the stinky stuff to where it can meet soap and water! 😛 😃
 
stinkcat_14 said:
Like Social Security recipients?
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Social security is paid by workers and by their employers. Every year you get a report that shows how much you put in to date and what your estimated payments will be. It is essentially your money though the government has control of it. If we had 40 million youth SS would not be risk.
 
So what happens if people can’t find a job after four years, I wonder?
 
We just lowered our time limit to 48 months, also. Now, it only applies to adults. Kids can be on it for as many years as they qualify until 18. A time limit for those under 18 does apply, though, if that person has a child. I’m sorry, but I work at a welfare office. So many of the people on it do not want to work. Yes, many do, and those are the ones who find jobs and get off it. We can’t just give, give, give forever to the others, though.
 
Rence said:
I would tell that to the FCS office. And this is the reason why I think they should be monitored closely. There should be a person in that office who can help them find jobs and send them on interviews. Treating them like children? You bet. Obviously they can’t take care of themselves, so someone has to show them the way…and make sure an honest effort is being made to find employment.
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They already do a lot of that. Here they have to go to what is called Job Club. They practice doing resumes, filling out applications, and interviewing. Heck, we even give them clothes they can wear to an interview. We give them job leads and all. Still, many just won’t do it. They can still get welfare for all of their kids even if the time limit on the adult is over.
 
No offence, but how much money does your government give these people that they want to stay on welfare? Where I live, a single person on welfare would not even have enough money to be able to pay my rent, never mind live off of it. A person (or family) gets a basic amount, and then can supplement it through odd jobs or part time work up to a certain amount per month before it is deducted from their benefits. It is actually in a person’s best interest to get a job, even part time. Then they have subsidies to help those transitioning from welfare to work, to help pay medical costs which are covered under welfare, so the sudden increase in costs doesn’t put them back on welfare. Sure it’s not perfect, but it seems, to me at least, a little more compassionate.
 
buffalo said:
Social security is paid by workers and by their employers. Every year you get a report that shows how much you put in to date and what your estimated payments will be. It is essentially your money though the government has control of it. If we had 40 million youth SS would not be risk.
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No, social security is a welfare program where you take from people who work and give to those who don’t work. It would be one thing if these people couldn’t find jobs, but the fact of the matter is the vast majority of recipients are too lazy to work. As I have said time and time again, 100 years ago 75% of men over 65 were in the labor force and today it is around 17%. At a time when people are healthier and living longer and more able to work, they are less likely to work. There is only one explanation for this: pure laziness.

Second, there is the moral issue. The fact that these greedy seniors think that they have the right to my hard earned money is downright immoral. Just because they sat on their hands while their income was redistributed to others does not give them a claim on my money. Second, I have no moral obligation to give the able bodied any social security.
 
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