K
katherine2
Guest
There is also a social duty to charity and a social duty to justice. Read the papal social encylicals.
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T
Trelow
Guest
There is a vast difference between charitable giving and taxation.
T
Trelow
Guest
This is no social duty that is not first a private duty.
K
katherine2
Guest
"The right to have a share of earthly goods sufficient for oneself and one’s family belongs to everyone.
– Second Vatican Council
Minimum material resources are an absolute necessity for human life. If persons are to be recognized as members of the human community, then the **community **has an obligation to help fulfill these basic needs unless an absolute scarcity of resources makes this strictly impossible. **No such scarcity exists in the United States today. **
– Economic Justice for All (#70)
There are needs and common goods that cannot be satisfied by the market system. It is the task of the state and of all society to defend them. An idolatry of the market alone cannot do all that should be done.
– **C****entesimus Annus **
Society as a whole, acting through public and private institutions, has the moral responsibility to enhance human dignity and protect human rights. In addition to the clear responsibility of private institutions, government has an essential responsibility in this area. This does not mean that government has the primary or exclusive role, but it does have a positive moral responsibility in safeguarding human rights and ensuring that the minimum conditions of human dignity are met for all. In a democracy, government is a means by which we can act together to protect what is important to us and to promote our common values.
– Economic Justice for All (#18,PM)
The complex circumstances of our day make it necessary for public authority to intervene more often in social, economic and cultural matters in order to bring about favorable conditions which will give more effective help to citizens and groups in their free pursuit of man’s total well-being.
– The Church in the Modern World (#75)
By its nature private property has a social dimension which is based on the law of the common destination of earthly goods. Whenever the social aspect is forgotten, ownership can often become the object of greed and a source of serious disorder, and its opponents easily find a pretext for calling the right itself into question.
– The Church in the Modern World (#71)
As for the State, its whole raison d’etre is the realization of the common good in the temporal order. It cannot, therefore, hold aloof from economic matters. On the contrary, it must do all in its power to promote the production of a sufficient supply of material goods, “the use of which is necessary for the practice of virtue.”[7] It has also the duty to protect the rights of all its people, and particularly of its weaker members, the workers, women and children. It can never be right for the State to shirk its obligation of working actively for the betterment of the condition of the workingman.
– Mother and Teacher (#20)
The government should make similarly effective efforts to see that those who are able to work can find employment in keeping with their aptitudes, and that each worker receives a wage in keeping with the laws of justice and equity. It should be equally the concern of civil authorities to ensure that workers be allowed their proper responsibility in the work undertaken in industrial organization, and to facilitate the establishment of intermediate groups which will make social life richer and more effective.
– Peace on Earth (#64)
The very nature of the common good requires that all members of the state be entitled to share in it
– John XXIII
**Governments must provide regulations and a system of taxation **which encourage firms to preserve the environment, employ disadvantaged workers, and create jobs in depressed areas. Managers and stockholders should not be torn between their responsibilities to their organizations and their responsibilities toward society as a whole.
– Economic Justice for All (#118)
– Second Vatican Council
Minimum material resources are an absolute necessity for human life. If persons are to be recognized as members of the human community, then the **community **has an obligation to help fulfill these basic needs unless an absolute scarcity of resources makes this strictly impossible. **No such scarcity exists in the United States today. **
– Economic Justice for All (#70)
There are needs and common goods that cannot be satisfied by the market system. It is the task of the state and of all society to defend them. An idolatry of the market alone cannot do all that should be done.
– **C****entesimus Annus **
Society as a whole, acting through public and private institutions, has the moral responsibility to enhance human dignity and protect human rights. In addition to the clear responsibility of private institutions, government has an essential responsibility in this area. This does not mean that government has the primary or exclusive role, but it does have a positive moral responsibility in safeguarding human rights and ensuring that the minimum conditions of human dignity are met for all. In a democracy, government is a means by which we can act together to protect what is important to us and to promote our common values.
– Economic Justice for All (#18,PM)
The complex circumstances of our day make it necessary for public authority to intervene more often in social, economic and cultural matters in order to bring about favorable conditions which will give more effective help to citizens and groups in their free pursuit of man’s total well-being.
– The Church in the Modern World (#75)
By its nature private property has a social dimension which is based on the law of the common destination of earthly goods. Whenever the social aspect is forgotten, ownership can often become the object of greed and a source of serious disorder, and its opponents easily find a pretext for calling the right itself into question.
– The Church in the Modern World (#71)
As for the State, its whole raison d’etre is the realization of the common good in the temporal order. It cannot, therefore, hold aloof from economic matters. On the contrary, it must do all in its power to promote the production of a sufficient supply of material goods, “the use of which is necessary for the practice of virtue.”[7] It has also the duty to protect the rights of all its people, and particularly of its weaker members, the workers, women and children. It can never be right for the State to shirk its obligation of working actively for the betterment of the condition of the workingman.
– Mother and Teacher (#20)
The government should make similarly effective efforts to see that those who are able to work can find employment in keeping with their aptitudes, and that each worker receives a wage in keeping with the laws of justice and equity. It should be equally the concern of civil authorities to ensure that workers be allowed their proper responsibility in the work undertaken in industrial organization, and to facilitate the establishment of intermediate groups which will make social life richer and more effective.
– Peace on Earth (#64)
The very nature of the common good requires that all members of the state be entitled to share in it
– John XXIII
**Governments must provide regulations and a system of taxation **which encourage firms to preserve the environment, employ disadvantaged workers, and create jobs in depressed areas. Managers and stockholders should not be torn between their responsibilities to their organizations and their responsibilities toward society as a whole.
– Economic Justice for All (#118)
K
katherine2
Guest
I do not debate the dual obligation. it is both/and, not either/or.
I even give private charity the the first place. In a society where private charity has eliminated all poverty, there is no place or need for social welfare.
T
Trelow
Guest
katherine2 said:
What point exactly are you trying to make?
T
Trelow
Guest
Agreed. But throwing more tax dollars into the situation is not going to help. Using the moneys already in place effectively will. And faith based organizations have time and time again shown to be much more effective at fixing the problem, rather than treating it.
It does no good to give someone money if they have no idea how to get more except by asking you again.
J
jlw
Guest
This should be posted 20 times in a row.
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Island_Oak
Guest
How DO you do it? You can find a soapbox to rail against sexual immorality even in the midst of an otherwise tame discussion about taxes.
K
katherine2
Guest
I agree with you about the effectivness of faith based organizations. Taht is why I trust the judgement of those people who actually run these programs in Minnesota. Most of the proposed cuts would come out of their budgets.
I also think cutting taxes on the well off and raising them on the poor is not a good idea. I thank the Minnesota bishops for their wisdom on this.
J
jlw
Guest
Nobody raises taxes on the poor!!! They pay less than they did before!!!
If you mean they “shoulder more of the burden” because the rich got to keep largER sums of money (make more, taxed more, get to keep more IN RAW DOLLARS) otherwise meant for social programs, I see your point, but that is silliness, because when the “poor” sit down at the kitchen table to pay bills, they have more money in their bank account AFTER A TAX CUT!
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StJeanneDArc
Guest
I want to recommend a website for all of the socialists posting on this forum. It’s www.acton.org. The Acton institute is run by Fr. Robert Sirico. His theory is that most of the Christian clergy in this country are not trained in and don’t have a basic understanding of economics–hence their lopsided support for ineffective social programs and growth-retarding fiscal policies.
IMO, I would run the other way whenever I see bishops taking a stand on any issue that is not a matter of faith or morals (i.e. those of political prudence). They have a very poor track record in predicting the outcome of such legislation and/or policies. Two examples that come to mind right away are welfare reform and Reagan’s missile programs.
IMO, I would run the other way whenever I see bishops taking a stand on any issue that is not a matter of faith or morals (i.e. those of political prudence). They have a very poor track record in predicting the outcome of such legislation and/or policies. Two examples that come to mind right away are welfare reform and Reagan’s missile programs.
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swampfox
Guest
Society and government are two different things. For example, separation of church from state can be a good while separation of religion from society is the road to self-destruction. There is no Catholic form of government and certainly Christ did not recommend one form of taxation over another–These bishops know not what they do, but I guess they’ve been busy excusing or turning a blind eye to Catholic democrat politicians who have been enabling abortions for the last 30+ years
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Catholic2003
Guest
Or how many people suddenly become much more knowledgeable than the bishops when those bishops’ teachings don’t follow the Republican party line!
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jlw
Guest
No, when they don’t follow Catholic teaching, that’s what makes us upset. Socialism is not Catholic, charity is Catholic.
K
katherine2
Guest
Social justice is Catholic. Private chairty alone is Calvinist.
J
jlw
Guest
Really? So I’m a calvinist if give my money to charity?? But if I vote for a big-government liberal I’m Catholic???
K
katherine2
Guest
Not in Minnesota where they are cutting the income tax for the upper brackets but raising the regressive property tax.
K
katherine2
Guest
A Catholic does both!!!
J
jlw
Guest
Even at the expense of freedom and the lives of MILLIONS of unborn??
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