Most Catholic women use birth control banned by church

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Serap said:
and I would stay out of that thread b/c I would call on every Catholic, that was uncharitable, to be accountable for pushing more people away.

Hostility breeds more hostility. Kindness wins people over.
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and sugar coating the truth gives us Cafeteria Catholics that don’t know their faith.

Now, back to the thread…NFP good, ABC bad
 
crazzeto said:
I don’t disagree that if what she says is true, then these preists need to spend some time in discernment. But your claim is very grandios and pointed directly at a fellow CAF poster. You act as if serap is trying to attack the gates, she is not… She is just a poster whom in my opinion also needs to spend some time in prayer about this issue.

So in the words of Dr. Evil, “Scott, bring it down a notch”.
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Serap claims that they aren’t priests, but that they will be ordained even though they profess to reject Church teaching on faith and morals.

Serap claim this is true, yet will not reveal this to the bishop. If true, this is a scandal and a sin of omission.
 
1holycatholic said:
Serap claims that they aren’t priests, but that they will be ordained even though they profess to reject Church teaching on faith and morals.

Serap claim this is true, yet will not reveal this to the bishop. If true, this is a scandal and a sin of omission.
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:banghead: :banghead: :banghead:
 
kimmielittle said:
Hmmm I didn’t remember listing as one of my faults being: “uncharitable”.

I do demand, in a debate, supporting reference / evidence for statements made as being “factual”…, though. 🤷
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Then you are not uncharitable. 🙂 You have been very good in this thread also.
 
Serap, I understand what you’re saying, but here’s why I’m puzzled. I’ve read all the posts you claim are mean or arrogant or whatnot, and they don’t come across that way to me at all. Some do, but most aren’t.

Do you think it’s possible you are being too sensitive, and misinterpreting things as a result?

For example… when I said, “Protestants have descended into moral relativism,” you seemed to think I was insulting Protestants. But I had no intention of doing so and was merely stating a fact that I believe is true and can be proven as such. I don’t see how the above is an insult. Can you clarify?

Also, I think you didn’t see the question I asked in my last post, and I think it would help clarify things…

Do you believe that the Catholic Church was given teaching authority by Jesus Christ? Yes or no?
 
Tigg said:
I once read a book entitled “Authenticity.” It was about the dangers of self-delusion!

Affirming someone in their path of darkness is not a kindness. It is grave omission!
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He still gets the truth across and is a great evangelizer. He doubles the attendence at every parish he goes to.

I hardly see him as being inauthentic 🤷
 
crazzeto said:
:banghead: :banghead: :banghead:
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Would you remain silent if a cleric admitted to you that he was engaged in child abuse and that it was OK, or would you post his claim on a forum?

Same situation, different sin.

Bang your head all you want, a man who will be ordained in two months who admits that he rejects Church teaching on faith and morals doesn’t need discernment, he needs the boot.
 
The Greatest in the Kingdom of Heaven

1At that time the disciples came to Jesus and asked, “Who is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven?”

2He called a little child and had him stand among them. 3And he said: “I tell you the truth, unless you change and become like little children, you will never enter the kingdom of heaven. 4Therefore, whoever humbles himself like this child is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven.

5And whoever welcomes a little child like this in my name welcomes me. 6But if anyone causes one of these little ones who believe in me to sin, it would be better for him to have a large millstone hung around his neck and to be drowned in the depths of the sea.

7“Woe to the world because of the things that cause people to sin! Such things must come, but woe to the man through whom they come! 8If your hand or your foot causes you to sin, cut it off and throw it away. It is better for you to enter life maimed or crippled than to have two hands or two feet and be thrown into eternal fire. 9And if your eye causes you to sin, gouge it out and throw it away. It is better for you to enter life with one eye than to have two eyes and be thrown into the fire of hell.

A Brother Who Sins Against You

15If your brother sins against you,go and show him his fault, just between the two of you. If he listens to you, you have won your brother over. 16But if he will not listen, take one or two others along, so that ‘every matter may be established by the testimony of two or three witnesses.’ 17If he refuses to listen to them, tell it to the church; and if he refuses to listen even to the church, treat him as you would a pagan or a tax collector.

18“I tell you the truth, whatever you bind on earth will bed bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth will be loosed in heaven.

Matthew 18:1-9
Matthew 18:15-18
 
1holycatholic said:
Would you remain silent if a cleric admitted to you that he was engaged in child abuse and that it was OK, or would you post his claim on a forum?

Same situation, different sin.

Bang your head all you want, a man who will be ordained in two months who admits that he rejects Church teaching on faith and morals doesn’t need discernment, he needs the boot.
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Look above you serap, that’s my point flying over head.
 
wanner47 said:
Do you believe that the Catholic Church was given teaching authority by Jesus Christ? Yes or no?
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Yes, and I also see the reformer point of view that the Catholic church went on a very different path at some point.

Even though I have chosen the Catholic church and I choose to live as a Catholic, I do not assume that a Protestant is a lost sheep.

I appreciate your concerns for me. I am not going to leave the CC anytime. I am genuinely seeing things from both sides and trying to understand.

I am sure that everyone here in this thread is a good person; it’s just that debates can go south very easily when people get defensive. I try to debate without sparking a defensive attitude in people. I try to be kind and allow the person to first let down their guard. It’s when the guard is down, they will begin to listen.
 
Serap said:
Yes, and I also see the reformer point of view that the Catholic church went on a very different path at some point.

Even though I have chosen the Catholic church and I choose to live as a Catholic, I do not assume that a Protestant is a lost sheep.

I appreciate your concerns for me. I am not going to leave the CC anytime. I am genuinely seeing things from both sides and trying to understand.

I am sure that everyone here in this thread is a good person; it’s just that debates can go south very easily when people get defensive. I try to debate without sparking a defensive attitude in people. I try to be kind and allow the person to first let down their guard. It’s when the guard is down, they will begin to listen.
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How is this logically possible?
 
crazzeto said:
How is this logically possible?
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I don’t believe it either, but someone else’s perception is their reality.

edited to add: …and I have to respect another person’s reality even if I don’t agree. I win them over with kindness and then talk to them at a compassionate level to see why they believe what they believe.
 
1holycatholic said:
Would you remain silent if a cleric admitted to you that he was engaged in child abuse and that it was OK, or would you post his claim on a forum?

Same situation, different sin.

Bang your head all you want, a man who will be ordained in two months who admits that he rejects Church teaching on faith and morals doesn’t need discernment, he needs the boot.
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Boy, I’m glad Jesus was different.

Abusing a child…:eek: I’m not going there! I was abused as a child and it’s not something to throw around.
 
Serap said:
I don’t believe it either, but someone else’s perception is their reality.
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When it comes to truth you have to identify the objective truth, and proclaim it. This is all the more true when it comes to the truth of Christ. So I take it that you believe that the Sea of Peter has the authentic, infallible teaching authority of Christ yes?

Well given this truth, I invite you to reread wanner47’s comments which you thought uncharitable in light of this truth and what we know as Catholics regarding the flow of divine authority. Was it really uncharitable? Or is it an observation of the current state of thing?

I’m not asking for what someone elses opinion might be, what I want to know is how objectivly true is the statement made by wanner47 in light of the objective truth that the church in communion with the Sea of Peter is infallible and protected by the spirit.
 
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