My atheist boyfriend and I

[SJG1759]

I would love to hear what people in marriages where one is Catholic the other is of a different faith or a nonbeliever. I feel like their opinions would have a lot of insight. And while I wouldn’t be in a mixed faith marriage, I would be willing to bet that most people in them would tell you its worth it.

Since you asked…

I am a Catholic, reverted to the faith after about 4 years of marriage to an atheist. Four years later, I’m still a Catholic and he’s still an atheist. We don’t have children (long story, please do not ask).

I hate myself for saying this, but yes, some days I do wish I’d married someone else! It’s usually after I’ve gone to Mass on Ash Wednesday or Easter or Christmas or another major holiday alone, again, and I know that my DH is at home stewing about how he thinks I’m delusional and so is everybody else with a religious belief. Or how he makes some snarky comment about how I let other people make up my mind for me, or… ugh. You get the idea.

I’m sorry. I know that’s not what you wanted to hear. I love my DH very much, and he is a wonderful man and good provider… but being religious and married to someone who thinks that religion is idiocy and brainwashing can be a very lonely experience. I’d be doing the OP a disservice if I said otherwise. And I can’t imagine how complicated things would get if DH and I had children! Perhaps it’s just as well that that door is closed.

OP, maybe you and your boyfriend should take a break from each other. If God wants the two of you to get married, then it will happen. If He has something else planned, it will come to light and will be better than anything you had planned.

 

[Tony2255]

Just coming at this from a different angle.

Even though he says he doesn’t have a problem, now, with your future kids learning about Catholicism, it become a problem later. So while you’re wondering how you will be able to handle it in the future, you also have to take into consideration the possiblity of him not being so compromising.

Having parents of two different denominations is hard enough. But two seperate belief systems, wow.

While nothing is impossible and things could turn out better than anyone would imagine. But realistically, I think you have to prepare yourself for some serious battles and a very strained relationship in the future.

Another question you may ask yourself is how healthy is it for the child to witness that type of relationship.

Not trying to say you’re wrong. Just wanted to give you some possible scenarios

I wish you all the best and hope it works out for you.

 

[taxpuns]

My ex wife was Catholic. She cheated on me 6 months after we got married. I caught her looking for one night stands in the casual encounters section of Craigslist…

My point is, I think if he is a kind man, then everything will be fine. If he loves her and takes care of her, then in today’s world of greed, selfishness, and me me me attitude she should consider herself lucky to have found someone with character.

 

[PennyinCanada]

When I was single, I never would consider even one date with a man that was not Catholic. (An Atheist? Never.) I knew the power of God to intervene and change lives and situations, and I wanted to find a man that knew that too. Maybe you’ve never been in a situation that you needed God to come and change things, but I am pretty sure in the years you have ahead, you will. Difficulties come to all of us. Having a believing partner who knows how to open the heavens for grace to come is something that can’t be put into words. That’s someone you can spend a lifetime with. Someone who will hold your hand and walk through the flames with you. Someone who knows that strength and courage come from God. From the power of the Cross. From the Holy Spirit changing hearts.

I hope you can have a new vision and a new expectation of life with a believing Catholic might be like. A day may come when you have the rug pulled out from under you, and your hubby will be on his knees interceding for you. Calling on the Blessed Mother, the angels and saints. Placing you under the red and white rays that pour forth from the Divine Mercy Jesus. Such a partner is worth his weight in gold. Look for him. He’s praying for you today.

Jesus, I trust in You!

 

[Guernica]

It’s funny – I know a whole mob of cradle Catholic men, including my father, both grandfathers, all of my uncles and cousins, my husband, my father-in-law, my brothers-in-law, husband’s uncles and cousins, etc. –

And not ONE of ’em is the perfect, supportive, prayerful, patient, and always sterling character put forth in the hyperbolically GLOWING descriptions put forth by posters in this thread.

Sorry, but every Catholic man I know is just an ordinary guy. They’re NOT instant, automatic angels.

Some of ’em drink to excess, some smoke, some have let themselves get really fat, some of ’em like strip clubs, they’re often way too into sports or gambling or computer games at the expense of their family relationships, some have been underemployed or slacked off at work or been fired from jobs, they sometimes interrupt others during conversations, often expect their wives to do all the housework, they sometimes look at other women, and can all be selfish and ill-tempered sometimes.

My parents wouldn’t let one of my good cradle Catholic uncles visit at our house anymore after he pulled my 16-year-old self into his lap after a few too many beers, and we all breathed a sigh of relief when my aunt divorced him. Another of my good Catholic uncles is outrageously nosy and is always asking blunt personal questions at the most embarrassing moments, and this same fellow’s good Catholic son is conceited to the point where it’s become a family joke. Another of my good Catholic uncles is schizophrenic and will need to be on medication for the rest of his life, and even though he prays constantly for this affliction to be lifted, it’s still there.

My husband and every single one of his brothers are total mama’s boys, and my sister-in-law and I commiserate over how difficult it’s been to get our husbands to cut the cord already. One of my husband’s good Catholic brothers was disciplined for sexually harassing a female co-worker, and my own good Catholic dad brings bootleg recording equipment into concerts and was once ejected from a football game because he got into a shoving match with a rival team’s fan.

Sure, all of these men have a lot of fine qualities as well as failings, and they’re all different degrees of devout. Some of them (especially my own sweet husband) are really lovable gentlemen, no matter what their personal foibles.

Nonetheless, between the lot of them they possess just about every ordinary human failing known to humanity.

Indeed, if Catholic men were all as utterly superhuman specimens of moral perfection as described in this thread, no woman would ever marry anybody else.

 

[777rak]

For all the reasons 1ke mentioned and hearing the experiences of others I will give you some advice:

Don’t do it, run, now. Let him find someone who shares his beliefs. You find someone who shares yours.

Exactly!

 

[EnglishTeacher]

My aunt, who is a devout Christian, married a atheist/agnostic man (who was raised Catholic). They were very much in love, and she was sure that he was the man for her. At the time they married, he was respectful of her Christian beliefs. He agreed to a church wedding and agreed to raise the children as Christians. However, as the years wore on, it grew harder and harder for him to conceal the growing contempt and bitterness that he felt for religion and particularly for Christianity. He still let her take the children to church, but it was very obvious to anyone who spent time around them that his contempt toward Christianity was spilling out more and more into his relationship with his wife. They are currently in the process of divorcing after 18 years of marriage.

Two points: 1) Even if your boyfriend currently tolerates your Catholic beliefs, that doesn’t mean that he will still do so 10 years down the road. If truly believes that Christianity is harmful and dangerous, then eventually that is going to come out–in more ways than you can foresee at the present. 2) His views on religion are not something that you can separate from your relationship with him–at least not for long. If you are serious about your Catholic faith, then your relationship with God is the core of who you are. And if that is the case, then it follows that he deeply dislikes part of what makes you who you are.

 

[PennyinCanada]

Dear Guernica…
What a sad list of men in your family. As you posted to undermine hope of a Godly Catholic man, my reply is that you can list an army of sinful men not worthy of the name Catholic, and I would be unmoved. That is the privilege and power behind a son or daughter of God, that they come before the Creator of the Universe, the Alpha, the Omega, the Pantocrator who put the universe in motion. If a son or daughter comes before her Father and asks for a Godly spouse, that s/he does not look to kings or presidents, but has their eyes fixed on God, is that too difficult a task for Him? Would He not be pleased to answer?

John the Baptist said “Do not pride yourselves on the claim, ‘Abraham is our father.’ I tell you, God can raise up children to Abraham from these very stones.”
Even now the ax is laid to the root of the tree. Every tree that is not fruitful will be cut down and thrown into the fire. Matt 3: 9

Christ’s witness to John the Baptist…"I solemnly assure you, history has not known a man born of woman greater than John the Baptizer. Yet the least born into the kingdom of God is greater than he." Matt 11:11

If Catholics walked in the truths of our faith, and were plugged in to the power of God, the world would be turned on its head.

 

[Guernica]

Dear Guernica…
What a sad list of men in your family. As you posted to undermine hope of a Godly Catholic man, my reply is that you can list an army of sinful men not worthy of the name Catholic, and I would be unmoved.

I said they were ordinary, imperfect mortals, not necessarily sinful or irredeemable. You’re jumping to conclusions with a pogo stick.

I do hope you’re totally without sin yourself, friend, because you’re casting a whole LOT of stones here.

That is the privilege and power behind a son or daughter of God, that they come before the Creator of the Universe, the Alpha, the Omega, the Pantocrator who put the universe in motion. If a son or daughter comes before her Father and asks for a Godly spouse, that s/he does not look to kings or presidents, but has their eyes fixed on God, is that too difficult a task for Him? Would He not be pleased to answer?

Sanctimonious holier-than-thou, party of one! So pleased you’ve got a direct line to God the Father there.

Do you REALLY think that when the house payment’s sick and the baby needs repairs and the car is late, good Catholic men ALL just calmly pray rosaries with their wives? Seriously? What planet do you live on?

When the house payment needed repairs and the baby was late and the car was sick, my good Catholic dad didn’t gather us all together to pray the rosary together. I don’t know even ONE good Catholic man who fits that description.

In that situation, my dad, my grandfathers, my husband, and all my male relatives would get UPSET, like normal human beings.

My husband would probably kick the bedpost and grouse about how unfair the world was, and tell me he really needed to be alone until he calmed down, and drink a shot or two of Bushmills.

My father-in-law would smack a couple of the unruliest kids’ behinds and tell them to give Daddy a moment’s peace for heaven’s sake, then go outside to smoke a cigarette.

My own father would snap at my mother to leave him alone and let him think, then tell us kids to not even THINK about bothering him, then go upstairs and shut himself in his den and sulk in front of The Game on TV until he calmed down.

And you know what? They’re all decent, normal men who do the best they can.

All I’m saying is that Catholic men are NOT all automatic angels, without anger, without ever getting frustrated, without foibles and failings, and to tell the OP that they are all perfect saints who never ever ever EVER sin or fail to treat their wives 100% perfectly is just plain not true.

Catholic men are HUMAN, just like everyone else. I know far too many of said gentlemen in really real life to think otherwise.

 

[sw85]

OK, stop right here.

If you baptize your children Catholic, they ARE Catholic. There is no “choosing” when they are older. There is no “choosing” to be confirmed or not. You misunderstand Confirmation if you believe it to be some sort of “choice” to be Catholic. The bishop does the confirming, and what he is confirming is the candidate’s baptism. All Catholics are obligated to receive Confirmation upon the call of the bishop at the appropriate age. Together Baptism, Confirmation and Eucharist form the three Sacraments of Initiation.

Baptizing your child Catholic is an obligation of a Catholic parent, and a requirement to receive a dispensation from your bishop to marry an unbaptized person. Baptizing your child Catholic binds that child FOREVER to the Catholic Church AND to Canon Law. You place upon them all the obligations of a Catholic. So, there is no such thing as teaching them a plurality of religious beliefs and letting them choose.

You and he both need to understand this FULLY. He needs to be aware that undermining the child’s faith with atheism is not acceptable.

This is very, very, VERY important. Baptism is not something to be taken lightly. There is a very good reason why priests will not baptize children if there is not certitude that they will be raised in the faith.

Baptism leaves an indelible mark on the soul, along with confirmation and holy orders; not for nothing are these sometimes called the “sacraments of character.” If your children fall away from the faith later in life, they may well go to Hell. And to take that indelible mark with them into Hell… well, it’s like a narcotics agent going to prison. You don’t want to be that guy. We have the words of St. Leonard of Port Maurice to this effect: those who are baptized suffer far worse in Hell.

Now, whether or not you can raise your children with absolute confidence that they will live the faith is not something I’m in a position to judge. What is clear, however, is that their father will be an impediment to this. Your children will have enough impediments facing them in their life: nearly all their friends, the state, the background culture, the mainstream media, very likely their educators (especially if they’re sent to public school) will be working tirelessly to seduce them to formal or functional apostasy (yes, out of ignorance and without intention or malice, but that doesn’t make a difference). I don’t think it’s enough in the present age for the father to promise he won’t stand in the way of evangelizing. The fact is, Catholic kids need a father working tirelessly to shield them from the evils of the world and to armor them so that they can face those evils on their own later in life – they need a proactively good force in their life, not just a not-actively-evil force (at best). If your boyfriend cannot do that, that is a major, major, major problem.

Now suppose something happens – suppose you die. Where will your children’s shield be? Can you rely on hubby to provide them with good moral example? To take them to Mass every Sunday (or will they see that daddy’s not doing it so maybe it’s not that important)? To encourage them should they contemplate seminary, or to help them find a good Catholic husband or wife (or will they see that, hey, maybe the whole marrying-a-Catholic thing is overrated – an atheist was good enough for mom, after all)? Will hubby encourage them to remain resolute in the faith in the face of temptations: if your daughter’s boyfriend starts agitating for sex in high school; if your son’s wife insists she won’t have sex with him unless he uses condoms; if your daughter contemplates abortion; and so on?

I’m not going to sit here and tell you that you must leave this man. I don’t know your situation. Frankly, I think this is a really good conversation to have with a holy and orthodox priest you know and trust, probably over several sessions of spiritual direction. I will certainly tell you that it is, I think, a monstrous offense against prudence to commit to having children with this man, and very likely against charity toward your children as well. I think the odds are too great that you will regret it later in life. I think if you commit to this course of action you may well regret having gambled the fate of your children’s souls on a marriage to this man simply because you didn’t want to walk away from all the time invested in him. If you can live with that risk, go for it; I probably couldn’t. But then, I lucked out: I have a wonderful girlfriend who I’d trust to the ends of the world to raise my kids without me.

 

[Iheartcoffee]

The best way to pick a husband is to evaluate the person you are dating with one phrase, “If something happened to me, would he raise my children properly?” If the answer is “yes”, consider getting married. If the answer is “no”, then it is time to break up and find someone new.

In my opinion, this is the single best way to comprehensively evaluate a potential spouse’s pros and cons. Unfortunately, things happen to people. People die. You want to ensure the best life possible for whatever children you may have with your spouse.A good spouse will raise your children well.

 

[Viki63]

I suggest asking your boyfriend to attend RCIA, if he is serious about wanting to marry you. After he has gone through a good RCIA program, he will be in a better spot to understand where you are coming from, and whether he can support you in your faith.
But as many others have said, being married is hard enough without being yoked to an unbeliever, who denigrates the most essential part of your being.

 

[Et_Cetera]

If he’s loving and truly good to you, then you should be thankful for having such a person in your life. You might not find a Catholic who is as good to you, and if you leave him you might find yourself always regretting it.

 

[1inICXC]

I have never met anyone who makes me feel happie

When and where would you meet someone else! You’ve been wrapped up in this guy for 2 years!

It sucks to let go of “love” , most of us have been there, but it’s way worse to miss out on the real LOVE. Give yourself some time and space if you REALLY want to see what else is out there!

Also since he is not a Christian, does he respect the teachings on chastity?
Obviously I haven’t read the three so if this has already been dealt with, my appologies.

But consider this another thumbs down. Prayers for strength!

 

[Et_Cetera]

When and where would you meet someone else! You’ve been wrapped up in this guy for 2 years!

It sucks to let go of “love” , most of us have been there, but it’s way worse to miss out on the real LOVE. Give yourself some time and space if you REALLY want to see what else is out there!

Also since he is not a Christian, does he respect the teachings on chastity?
Obviously I haven’t read the three so if this has already been dealt with, my appologies.

But consider this another thumbs down. Prayers for strength!

Uhh…you don’t think he could be “true love” because he’s not Christian? If this is how the OP feels toward a bf who she describes as completely loving, caring, and supportive, then I’m going to think that maybe he would be better off moving on from her. She’s probably been “wrapped up” in him because he’s been a good boyfriend.

 

[Et_Cetera]

Also, she’s known all along that he was an atheist. She said that he’s respectful of her beliefs, so she should either be respectful of his or do him the courtesy of moving on. No use in wasting this nice guy’s time.

 

[BlueEyedLady]

Uhh…you don’t think he could be “true love” because he’s not Christian? If this is how the OP feels toward a bf who she describes as completely loving, caring, and supportive, then I’m going to think that maybe he would be better off moving on from her. She’s probably been “wrapped up” in him because he’s been a good boyfriend.

I think a lot of people on here married to non Christians would say that it could be true love. It doesn’t mean that it’s the best or easiest idea.

 

[Et_Cetera]

I think a lot of people on here married to non Christians would say that it could be true love. It doesn’t mean that it’s the best or easiest idea.

I agree with you! I think it’s really unfair to label this person as a bad guy or unworthy of this girl when she’s described him as being such a supportive person.

 

[1inICXC]

I agree with you! I think it’s really unfair to label this person as a bad guy or unworthy of this girl when she’s described him as being such a supportive person.

He is not a bad guy nor unworthy.they are simply setting themselves up for huge, unnecessary hurdles when they could both be with people aligned with their belief system and live the same vision of marriage and family.

And let’s be serious, an atheist abstaining until marriage and then not using contraception… I highly, highly doubt it. And these are two points you do not want to de dragged down on

 

[EasterJoy]

…He is an atheist, always has been but doesn’t deny the possibility (even if it is very small in his opinion) of the existence of a God. But he believes that all religion is man-made, destructive and is the cause of all worldly problems and held (or continues to hold in some ways) scientific research back. As a Catholic who is very sure of her faith, I disagree with all of his aforementioned views.

Every now and again, the topic of religion or scientific topics like evolution come about and it always ends in quite a heated discussion. Sometimes, I really hate that he disagrees with me and I get angry with him. But he has yet to get angry with me… He did not oppose to me bringing up our children in Catholicism (this included attending church, baptism, he was about dubious regarding their first holy communion) but stressed that they should be aware of other religions or the concept of no religion at all and they can make their choice when they reach that age (they could either be confirmed into the Catholic church or go down a different path). I agreed with this, as I want my children to be entirely sure of their faith and not feel like they are forced into my religion as many of my peers feel…

First Holy Communion is one of the Sacraments of Initiation; it is not negotiable. A full initiation into and formation within the guidance of the Catholic Church is the birth right of every child of a Catholic parent. This is why canon law forbids the marriage of a Catholic to any non-Catholic, excepting that a dispensation may be given if certain criteria are met:

Can. 1086 §1. A marriage between two persons, one of whom has been baptized in the Catholic Church or received into it and has not defected from it by a formal act and the other of whom is not baptized, is invalid.

§2. A person is not to be dispensed from this impediment unless the conditions mentioned in cann. ⇒ 1125 and ⇒ 1126 have been fulfilled.

Can. 1124 Without express permission of the competent authority, a marriage is prohibited between two baptized persons of whom one is baptized in the Catholic Church or received into it after baptism and has not defected from it by a formal act and the other of whom is enrolled in a Church or ecclesial community not in full communion with the Catholic Church.

Can. 1125 The local ordinary can grant a permission of this kind if there is a just and reasonable cause. He is not to grant it unless the following conditions have been fulfilled:

**1/ ***the Catholic party is to declare that he or she is prepared to remove dangers of defecting from the faith and is to make a sincere promise to do all in his or her power so that all offspring are baptized and brought up in the Catholic Church;*2/ the other party is to be informed at an appropriate time about the promises which the Catholic party is to make, in such a way that it is certain that he or she is truly aware of the promise and obligation of the Catholic party;

3/ both parties are to be instructed about the purposes and essential properties of marriage which neither of the contracting parties is to exclude.

Can. 1126 It is for the conference of bishops to establish the method in which these declarations and promises, which are always required, must be made and to define the manner in which they are to be established in the external forum and the non-Catholic party informed about them.

This is not because the Catholic Church believes that non-Catholics are bad people going to hell. The concept of invincible ignorance recognizes that there are unbelievers who are not culpable for their unbelief because they refuse to say they see what they are fully willing to see and yet do not have the grace to see. A great many atheists I have known are not anti-religion, but rather are opposed to cheap imitations of true religion, not to mention cheap adherents who talk a good game but never really venture onto the field of play. There is a big difference. I mean to say that some atheists are merely ardent theists who will not follow the first god they see walking down the street. For them, it is the real thing or nothing, because existential reality is no game.

…I figured by teaching them about Catholicism (why would I tear down my own faith?!) but not forcing them to do whatever I say without understanding what they are doing and why, I would raise children who turned out like myself…I will probably figure out the best method to ensure my children don’t live as “Catholics” by name. I would rather my children be true, believing Catholics or don’t be one at all.

Do you believe the Catholic faith is true? Really think about that. If you believe that the Catholic faith is true, then it is up to you to live it so that your life shouts the truth of it. You would not dream of conceding the idea to your children (of all people!) that perhaps the faith that ought to be at the center of your life if you believe it at all is merely a pleasant (or not so pleasant) mirage.

If you don’t believe the faith is true to the point that you believe it is personally incumbent upon you to witness the truth of it to all of those around you, particularly your family, then your boyfriend who won’t give his soul to a half-baked idea of a religion isn’t the biggest of your spiritual concerns. He may be the litmus test that pushes you to consider whether you truly have all your chips in the game. It is in the plainest meaning of the Sospel that you have to have all your chips in, or desire at least to have them all in, or else don’t fool yourself:

“If any one comes to me without hating his father and mother, wife and children, brothers and sisters, and even his own life, he cannot be my disciple. Whoever does not carry his own cross and come after me cannot be my disciple. Which of you wishing to construct a tower does not first sit down and calculate the cost to see if there is enough for its completion? Otherwise, after laying the foundation and finding himself unable to finish the work the onlookers should laugh at him and say, ‘This one began to build but did not have the resources to finish.’ Or what king marching into battle would not first sit down and decide whether with ten thousand troops he can successfully oppose another king advancing upon him with twenty thousand troops? But if not, while he is still far away, he will send a delegation to ask for peace terms. In the same way, everyone of you who does not renounce all his possessions cannot be my disciple. "Salt is good, but if salt itself loses its taste, with what can its flavor be restored? It is fit neither for the soil nor for the manure pile; it is thrown out. Whoever has ears to hear ought to hear.” Luke 14:26-35

You aren’t going to evangelize that bright and principled boyfriend of yours with a faith that does not treat service to God as if it were really service to God. Rather, your marriage will go in the direction of the one of you who actually is strong in his convictions. Think about that, OK?

PS The Church does allow discussions of evolution and the meaning of life. It is a topic of great interest to our Holy Father and to the scientists at the Vatican. (Yes, they do have scientists at the Vatican.) vatican.va/roman_curia/pontifical_academies/acdscien/documents/newpdf/acta20.pdf