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SamH
Guest
You seem to think “profile” is a bad thing.
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maryjk
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And some women carry things in their purse that could kill a child.
A five year old sits next to me and I am moving my purse too. Even if there is a divider between us.
Kids are quick. I am not. So, I move my purse.
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rlg94086
Guest
Well, if this happens to you, you should hand your purse to the five year old, so their parent won’t think you’re a racist.And some women carry things in their purse that could kill a child.
A five year old sits next to me and I am moving my purse too. Even if there is a divider between us.
Kids are quick. I am not. So, I move my purse.
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seekerz
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You learn to recognize the looks on people’s faces when they do these things, the averted eyes, the studied obliviousness to your presence … To get anywhere near the woman, my son would have had to walk halfway across the room and go round the divider, so it was just a reflex thing. I’ve been many places, near many people, and I can recognize racial profiling when I see it. This was just one case, but we’ve had our share (maybe none so ridiculous as this), mostly from overly “helpful” store attendants who follow you around a boutique while others are left to browse in peace…In most cases, “the look” is the same.
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Jeanne_S
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This is a good point,as far as GZ could have approached things differently.Yet,I do not agree with your assessment that this wasn’t done by GZ simply because TM was black.
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seekerz
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It’s not hard to find heinous crime period. If the perp is white (which by pure numbers alone, not necessarily percentages, would be often) that does not make white people subject to similar profiling. The usual reaction is to distance the criminal from ‘normal’ society: he’s evil, ***he’s ***mentally disturbed…make him an anomaly. With the black criminal it’s the opposite; it gets generalized: they’re violent, they’re lawless…
No amount of explaining could really convey the tension I feel (I’ll freely admit it) when there’s breaking news of an atrocious crime, or the relief that comes if the suspect is not black. I don’t wish it on some other race, I just don’t want another mark on MY profile. Is that selfish? Maybe, but it’s my reality born out of experience.
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seekerz
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That’s the defense his lawyer offered: put yourself in his place, you see a young black male and your neighborhood has been burglarized repeatedly by young black males…By not convicting him of manslaughter, the jury accepted the claim of self-defense and this line of argument, no?This is a good point,as far as GZ could have approached things differently.Yet,I do not agree with your assessment that this wasn’t done by GZ simply because TM was black.
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LisaA
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UGH…I am sure you are right. Although I do know this happens in certain stores say when teen girls (unfortunately a lot of shoplifters are teens) start hanging around the costume jewelry or hair stuff. Again it’s not fair the the majority of teens who are good kids but the demographic and the group moving like a swarm of bees is a profile of a would be shoplifter. But I imagine black skin is a “red flag” to some proprietors and in some stores. I will relate a story that made me aware of what I’d call subtle racism. One of our (best incidentally) employees is black. One day I got a call from a bank saying M____ A_____ was there with a check from our company and they wanted to verify that it was legit. I was really surprised although I realize it’s unusual to CASH an entire paycheck it was a situation where she’d closed one account and was in the process of opening another. Of course I said the check was fine and that they should cash it. But I called up our account manager and gave her a piece of my mind. I believe the person thought “how could some young black girl be cashing a $____ check…” It was suspicious but I think had she been white and a bit older, not a second thought. At any rate our manager said she would contact the branch and tell them about this and how inappropriate it was. Thankfully this was the only time I was aware of potential racism so I asked the employee and she was pretty blase about it…that stuff sometimes happened but she didn’t get too wrapped around the axle. (not that it shouldn’t have made her angry just that’s her take on the subject).
Long story short, I do recognize that while the country is much better, there are still more subtle forms of racism that are entrenched. I hope by being sensitive to the issue we can monitor our own behavior and reaction to give this issue the death it deserves.
Lisa
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Jeanne_S
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All right starting at the beginning,I see your point that this incident might very well have had a different outcome if GZ had only introduced himself as a neighborhood watch representative. As stated by the defense GZ was suspicious given the recent rash of break ins in his neighborhood.This is all speculative as there are no guarantees that TM would have complied and thing would have gone smoothly.There still could have been trouble.So I guess based on the info the jury was presented they had to come to this conclusion of self defense.
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BroomWagon
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Where does the Jury state they came to the conclusion of self defense?
Here are the jury instructions that explicitly state Zimmerman did not even have to prove anything at all.
news965.com/news/news/local/document-instructions-george-zimmerman-jury/nYnm3/
You are correct, you “guess”.
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livingwordunity
Guest
What if it would have gone the other way and Trayvon Martin was the one on trial and charged with the murder of George Zimmerman? The same rule should apply which is that the accused is innocent until proven guilty in a court of law.
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MaryT777
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In my opinion, all circumstances the same, the jury would acquit TM and Zimmerman would be dead.
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Nicea325
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U-huh…and Bush was so great and the made the office great? War dodger!
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LisaA
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If what you mean by “Zimmerman did” you refer to the killing of Martin, no I don’t think a series of burglaries would justify killing a young black kid on his way home from the store. But that is NOT what the evidence shows. I know this is a very long thread but please have the courtesy to read some of the evidence. In short:
Martin is in the neighborhood after buying Skittles and Arizona Tea. Zimmerman is on his way to the grocery store to buy supplies for next week’s lunch. Both innocent of any wrongdoing. Zimmerman calls some kind of police non emergency line and reports Martin’s behavior. Not his race, his behavior. It’s a rainy night, he’s walking sort of aimlessly between the homes, not on the sidewalk, appears to be looking around. And yes the perpetrators of the previous crimes including a HOT burglary had been young black males. Zimmerman does NOT offer the race of the youth just describes his behavior and I think what he’s wearing. The dispatcher asks what race. He hesitates (this is on the tape you can listen) and he says “He looks black.” Unfortunately NBC DOCTORED the tape so many think Zimmerman profiled Martin. He didn’t. He was asked the race of the person reported. Apparently Martin comes up to Zimmerman in the truck, sort of looks him over and then at some point he runs away. Zimmerman is talking to dispatch stating he’s running away. Calls him a “punk” not a N… or anything racial. Dispatch asks if he’s following Martin. He says yes. Dispatch says we don’t need you to follow. Zimmerman says OK.
According to Zimmerman, according to Rachel Jeantel, Martin HAD “escaped” and was in his father’s backyard. She later stated Martin broke off the call, saying he had to take care of something. This comports with the phone and earbuds being in his pockets along with the can of tea. There is a gap in time when NO ONE but Zimmerman knows what is happening but connecting the dots, Martin has left his father’s yard and returned to confront Zimmerman. There was a verbal exchange that escalated to a fight. Witnesses said Martin was on top of Zimmerman (multiple witnesses including of course Zimmerman) and beating the **** out of him. Zimmerman who had arranged to meet police was screaming his head off trying to get help or get the attention of the police when they arrived. Zimmerman tried to “shrimp” as the cop called it to get out from under Martin. He said he thought Martin was going to get his gun. He got the gun first and shot Martin who was killed.
Now my conclusion from the evidence including forensic evidence, Zimmerman’s injuries and testimony was self defense. Martin was not shot for being black, for buying Skittles or even his suspicious behavior that drew Zimmerman’s attention. He was shot because he was beating Zimmerman severely and Zimmerman was afraid of death or serious bodily harm.
Does that make sense?
Lisa
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DeniseNY
Guest
U-huh, when an Obama supporter can’t defend his actions, just throw out “Bush!”.
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LisaA
Guest
And if you are still having trouble add “Iraq War” “Cheney” “Haliburton” or “Katrina.”
It’s getting old huh?
Lisa
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livingwordunity
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George W. Bush flew jets in the Air National Guard. That’s doesn’t exactly fit him in with the dope smoking hippies who dodged the draft. And by the way, the Vietnam war itself was a Democrat war. But even if George W. Bush would have been a war hero in the Vietnam war he would have still been hated by the left. Sen. John McCain is proof of that.
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livingwordunity
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Yep those are the default buzz words used by the left. Obama still has troops fighting, dying, and getting maimed in a war.And if you are still having trouble add “Iraq War” “Cheney” “Haliburton” or “Katrina.”
It’s getting old huh?
Lisa
I wonder where all the left-wing war protesters went.
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rlg94086
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President George W Bush dodged wars? Weird. I could have sworn we had a couple wars during his presidency…
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Jeanne_S
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