Police: Approximately 20 dead inside Florida nightclub after mass shooting

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Why weren’t the security guards armed? I was talking about the people at the club: their being armed might have resulted in mass chaos and shootings as well.
Good question. Many of the nightclub bouncers I know are moonlighting police officers who legally carry. This club may not have used them. I don’t know what the Florida laws are on carrying in a place that serves liquor as an employee rather than a customer. In some states, security personnel and owners can arm themselves. It also depends on what the policy of the owners/management was.
 
It looks like you cherry-picked part of Trump’s tweet to try to make your point. The full tweet was:

Appreciate the congrats for being right on radical Islamic terrorism, I don’t want congrats, I want toughness & vigilance. We must be smart!

Trump’s initial tweet was

**Really bad shooting in Orlando. Police investigating possible terrorism. Many people dead and wounded. **

He followed this with a request for prayers:

**Horrific incident in FL. Praying for all the victims & their families. When will this stop? When will we get tough, smart & vigilant? **

The above tweet is similar to the one that Hillary sent, although at least Trump suggested prayer rather than just “thoughts”.

**Woke up to hear the devastating news from FL. As we wait for more information, my thoughts are with those affected by this horrific act. -H **

The tweet you excerpted was his third tweet, and was in response to tweets that said he and been prescient in seeing this coming. His follow-on comment, which you did not include, seem appropriate in that it was a call to action rather than self-congratulation.
The Huffington post posted the snippet of the tweet and many ran with it not realizing it was incomplete.
 
Why were these loose requirements in place to begin with? This is the first I have heard of this. Is there a link regarding what the specific requirements are?
justice.gov/sites/default/files/ag/legacy/2008/10/03/guidelines.pdf

They are the Attorney General’s requirements on CT investigations. They strictly limit the types of investigative methods that can be used (which are much tighter than criminal investigations) and the length of time that investigations can be conducted without positive confirmation of activity before they must be closed. Most European security forces do not have to work under those restrictions. If a subject of investigation becomes aware the FBI is looking at him (due to necessary interviews, etc,), he can simply cease operational activity until the time period for the investigation runs out. That may have happened in this case.
The Obama administration is quite tough when it comes to deportation of immigrants as well as drone attacks; why is it lax with regard to counterterrorism?
Probably an excessive concern for “civil liberties.”
 
The trouble, of course, is that Mateen was a US-born citizen. He wasn’t a recent immigrant who might be affected by the immigration policy of the next President. What’s interesting to me is that this man, who has a violent history and was questioned by the FBI about ISIS, worked as an armed security guard and legally owned weapons that could murder 50 people. I find this incredibly odd.

36 hours or so and the info is pouring out. We are in a war and our Commander in Chief is an obstacle to our self defense. 7 and 1/2 years of this and what is a truthful, honest assessment of our condition and what will we do about it?

ISIS is here, has been here, and the chickens are flapping around in the hen house.

The name of the man who is up for job of President of the USA is Trump. Can he get started on the job early?
 
Thorolfr;13968369:
Yes, yes, we all know that the attack was about Islam and that a white American could never have done any thing like that…:rolleyes:

QUOTE]

Mateen looks pretty “white” to me. Remember, most Afghans and Pakistanis are “Caucasian”. It’s not a matter of “race”.
Yeah, given the location of the Caucasus Mountains, it’s hard to be more “Caucasian” than that!
 
justice.gov/sites/default/files/ag/legacy/2008/10/03/guidelines.pdf

They are the Attorney General’s requirements on CT investigations. They strictly limit the types of investigative methods that can be used (which are much tighter than criminal investigations) and the length of time that investigations can be conducted without positive confirmation of activity before they must be closed. Most European security forces do not have to work under those restrictions. If a subject of investigation becomes aware the FBI is looking at him (due to necessary interviews, etc,), he can simply cease operational activity until the time period for the investigation runs out. That may have happened in this case.

Probably an excessive concern for “civil liberties.”
Not for undocumented Hispanic and Asian immigrants who were born in this country, who have been deported continuously by the Obama administration, much more so than by the previous Bush administration. Civil liberties only for potential terrorists?
 
Restricting the law abiding from exercising their Second Amendment rights will not do anything to stop the criminal or the terrorist. If Mateen could go out on the street and buy heroin, which he could have easily done, there is no reason to think he couldn’t have bought an “illegal” gun as well.
I don’t think I agree with you. He was able to do as much damage as he did because he had an AR-15 rifle with high capacity clips. If he couldn’t get that, it may not have prevented the tragedy, but it may have lessened it significantly. Furthermore, he may have been caught trying to obtain the weapon and not had the chance to commit the murders.
 
Thorolfr;13968369:
Yes, yes, we all know that the attack was about Islam and that a white American could never have done any thing like that…:rolleyes:

QUOTE]

Mateen looks pretty “white” to me. Remember, most Afghans and Pakistanis are “Caucasian”. It’s not a matter of “race”.
Race is more than melanin. The genetics of the Afghans has a significantly different lineage than Europeans.

voices.nationalgeographic.com/2012/03/30/afghans-share-unique-genetic-heritage-dna-study-by-the-genographic-project/
 

36 hours or so and the info is pouring out. We are in a war and our Commander in Chief is an obstacle to our self defense. 7 and 1/2 years of this and what is a truthful, honest assessment of our condition and what will we do about it?

ISIS is here, has been here, and the chickens are flapping around in the hen house.

The name of the man who is up for job of President of the USA is Trump. Can he get started on the job early?
Is ISIS here or is this a lone wolf like Dylan Roof or Robert Dear who claimed to be ISIS?
 
Now Trump is insinuating on Fox that Obama sympathizes with radicalized Muslims:
Look, we’re led by a man that either is not tough, not smart, or he’s got something else in mind. And the something else in mind – you know, people can’t believe it. People cannot, they cannot believe that President Obama is acting the way he acts and can’t even mention the words ‘radical Islamic terrorism.’ There’s something going on. It’s inconceivable. There’s something going on…He doesn’t get it or he gets it better than anybody understands – it’s one or the other and either one is unacceptable.
I think Trump is off his rocker.
 
Now Trump is insinuating on Fox that Obama sympathizes with radicalized Muslims:

I think Trump is off his rocker.
Trump is already a master politician. All he has to do is plant the seed of doubt in people’s minds concerning Obama’s and Hillary Clinton’s intentions, and he can divert criticism from himself onto Hillary.
 
ISIS is here. They slink under rocks and when they need to mingle with their victims they pretend they are a fellow countryman.
 
ISIS is here. They slink under rocks and when they need to mingle with their victims they pretend they are a fellow countryman.
Is ISIS here or is this a lone wolf like Dylan Roof or Robert Dear who claimed to be ISIS?
 
Thanks for the information about licenses and rifles. But do you really think that if people at the club were armed, the number of casualties would have been different, given the loud music, which caused some to misidentify the gunshots, the darkness, the probability that some people were drunk, and the overall confusion? It sounds to me like a recipe for a lot of friendly fire. Of course we will never know for sure.
Under the conditions that you specify, I believe that 1) armed patrons would have eventually taken the shooter out; 2) that there would likely (but not necessarily) have been friendly fire casualties; and, 3) the overall number of casualties would have been considerably lower. The last point is the most important.
 
ISIS is here. They slink under rocks and when they need to mingle with their victims they pretend they are a fellow countryman.
They should think about what Isis said and let it sink in and think about where we are today with them in Iraq and how this affair has gone in sequence under Obama.
Islamic State spokesman Abu Mohammad al-Adnani recently called on Muslims to “get prepared, be ready … to make it a month of calamity everywhere for nonbelievers…especially for the fighters and supporters of the caliphate in Europe and America.”
He said caliphate “IN” the USA.
 
If the murderer was Christian, I’m not sure that the Christian population would feel the urge to say “let’s wait for the authority’s find out before we react” because they fear retaliation, since it isn’t uncommon of mosques to be vandalized or brown-skinned people assaulted after an attack like this. Therein lies the difference.

I understand that people are angry, but it isn’t politically correctness to encourage people to focus more on his crime than his religion. Nor is it political correctness to encourage not to politicize this. And when folks say things like “this leftist administration isn’t keeping us safe” they are doing just that.
It is political correctness when people ignore the motive of his crime. It is political correctness when right after a man driven by extreme ideology commits a horrible crime, and immediately people write columns about how Christianity is to blame, or that guns are to blame, basically mention any other possible motive than his ideology, simply because that ideology is radical Islam.
 
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