Pope Bluntly Faults Church's Focus on Gays and Abortion

  • Thread starter Thread starter AdvanceAlways
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
Sensus fidelium literally means “sense of the faithful.” The term originated with the early Church Fathers, and refers to unerring truth sensed or recognized by the entire body of the faithful-from the Magisterium to the last of the laity, according to St. Augustine. The Dogmatic Constitution on the Church (Lumen Gentium) issued at Vatican II said this about sensus fidelium in section 12:

“The holy people of God shares also in Christ’s prophetic office; it spreads abroad a living witness to Him, especially by means of a life of faith and charity and by offering to God a sacrifice of praise, the tribute of lips which give praise to His name (cf. Heb. 13:15). The entire body of the faithful, anointed as they are by the Holy One, (cf. 1 Jn. 2:20, 27) cannot err in matters of belief. They manifest this special property by means of the whole peoples’ supernatural discernment in matters of faith when from the Bishops down to the last of the lay faithful they show universal agreement in matters of faith and morals. That discernment in matters of faith is aroused and sustained by the Spirit of truth. It is exercised under the guidance of the sacred teaching authority, in faithful and respectful obedience to which the people of God accepts that which is not just the word of men but truly the word of God (cf. 1 Th. 2:13).”

catholic.org/national/national_story.php?id=39217

Peace
 
IMPORTANT READ!!!

The Holy Father said nothing different than his predecessors in this interview. Pope Benedict said almost exactly the same thing!

This appeared on another message board, and is essential reading for those who have become unnecessarily demoralized by the interview.

from Benedict XVI’s Adress to Swiss Bishops, 2006:

I remember, when I used to go to Germany in the 1980s and '90s, that I was asked to give interviews and I always knew the questions in advance. They concerned the ordination of women, contraception, abortion and other such constantly recurring problems.
If we let ourselves be drawn into these discussions, the Church is then identified with certain commandments or prohibitions; we give the impression that we are moralists with a few somewhat antiquated convictions, and not even a hint of the true greatness of the faith appears. I therefore consider it essential always to highlight the greatness of our faith - a commitment from which we must not allow such situations to divert us."

Pope Francis does not depart from what Pope Benedict said.
“…we must not allow such situations to divert us.”

Constantly reacting to these issues gives off the wrong impression, that we are just a bunch of pharisaical people obsessed with rules and prohibitions. It is a false impression, but one to be aware of.

We don’t always need to be “drawn into these discussions.”
It’s enough to indicate that the truth will not change in regard to these things, that we adhere to it…so…let’s talk now about Jesus Christ!

Praised be Jesus Christ!
 
Lormar said:
Hahahaha! Hope he doesn’t call in the middle of the night! :eek:

What is his address? And what assurance do I have he will actually get it? Do I have to put “Conscience Material” on the envelope? :confused:
Click to expand...
Use Fed X signature required. But you know this already. 😉

Vatican City State 00120 Italy. 👍

Good Luck
 
I don’t understand words like endorse are used instead of grace. And other concerned with reparation and how God sends his kind mercy.
 
opus101 said:
The Holy Father said nothing different than his predecessors in this interview. Pope Benedict said almost exactly the same thing!

This appeared on another message board, and is essential reading for those who have become unnecessarily demoralized by the interview.

from Benedict XVI’s Adress to Swiss Bishops, 2006:

I remember, when I used to go to Germany in the 1980s and '90s, that I was asked to give interviews and I always knew the questions in advance. They concerned the ordination of women, contraception, abortion and other such constantly recurring problems.
If we let ourselves be drawn into these discussions, the Church is then identified with certain commandments or prohibitions; we give the impression that we are moralists with a few somewhat antiquated convictions, and not even a hint of the true greatness of the faith appears. I therefore consider it essential always to highlight the greatness of our faith - a commitment from which we must not allow such situations to divert us."

Pope Francis does not depart from what Pope Benedict said.
“…we must not allow such situations to divert us.”

Constantly reacting to these issues gives off the wrong impression, that we are just a bunch of pharisaical people obsessed with rules and prohibitions. It is a false impression, but one to be aware of.

We don’t always need to be “drawn into these discussion.”
It’s enough to indicate that the truth will not change in regard to these things, that we adhere to it…so…let’s talk now about Jesus Christ!

Praised be Jesus Christ!
Click to expand...
Excellent piece of digging and a very salient point indeed.
 
TMC said:
I think it is: “God loves you, and so do I. You and I are both sinners, but God loves us and I love you. Let’s work together to try to be better people, despite both our sins.” That message is true, honest and resonates with people.
Click to expand...
SSM and abortion are no longer recognized as sins in post-Christian culture. Catholics who say to the contrary are seen as the sinners, so that message of the pope is coming through loud and clear.
 
L_Reynolds said:
It is not what I understand in any way whatsoever. And is not how I understand God, Gods kind mercy and the whole thing, no.
Click to expand...
Sounds like you have Salvation all figured out, why are you here? BTW which congregation do you attend? Or is this when you say its none of your business because your ashamed to discuss it?
 
hazcompat said:
Sensus fidelium literally means “sense of the faithful.” The term originated with the early Church Fathers, and refers to unerring truth sensed or recognized by the entire body of the faithful-from the Magisterium to the last of the laity, according to St. Augustine. The Dogmatic Constitution on the Church (Lumen Gentium) issued at Vatican II said this about sensus fidelium in section 12:

“The holy people of God shares also in Christ’s prophetic office; it spreads abroad a living witness to Him, especially by means of a life of faith and charity and by offering to God a sacrifice of praise, the tribute of lips which give praise to His name (cf. Heb. 13:15). The entire body of the faithful, anointed as they are by the Holy One, (cf. 1 Jn. 2:20, 27) cannot err in matters of belief. They manifest this special property by means of the whole peoples’ supernatural discernment in matters of faith when from the Bishops down to the last of the lay faithful they show universal agreement in matters of faith and morals. That discernment in matters of faith is aroused and sustained by the Spirit of truth. It is exercised under the guidance of the sacred teaching authority, in faithful and respectful obedience to which the people of God accepts that which is not just the word of men but truly the word of God (cf. 1 Th. 2:13).”

catholic.org/national/national_story.php?id=39217

Peace
Click to expand...
Haz, thank you! I went to the link you so graciously provided and I am including a couple of snippets from it for the benefit of others:
Any of the baptized who dissent from the faith of the Church-which Vatican II emphatically reaffirmed as the faith authoritatively taught by the Magisterium-have separated themselves from “the faithful.”
Click to expand...
Concurrently, it is important to understand that sensus fidelium does not mean that universal consent of the faithful is necessary for a doctrine to be true, or that doctrine becomes true by virtue of such consensus. It means that universal consent is possible because the doctrine is true in the first place. Truth emanates from God and comes to the faithful-not the other way around. When the entire body of the faithful recognizes the truth through “supernatural discernment”-not by human reason alone-sensus fidelium becomes the prophetic witness spoken of in Lumen Gentium.
Click to expand...
 
DlandFan06 said:
What does that mean though? Does that mean “I love you, now sin freely?” This will be misinterpreted by people that they can continue sinning because God loves them. There are right and wrongs, you can’t dance around that.
Click to expand...
You and I believe that not attending Mass on Sunday is a mortal sin. You could run around public parks on Sunday warning people that they are going to hell if they don’t go to church – you could even promote a law to force people to go to Mass on Sunday for the good of their immortal soul – and they would stare at you as if you were crazy.

A good life springs from faith. Faith is the predecessor to everything.First, preach that God loves everyone. Then, after they are converted [back] to faith, you can begin on what is required by that faith. As I said in a previous post:
jimcintosh said:
Rules about morality have brought few to faith; faith has brought many to living a moral life.
Click to expand...
 
opus101 said:
from Benedict XVI’s Adress to Swiss Bishops, 2006:

I remember, when I used to go to Germany in the 1980s and '90s, that I was asked to give interviews and I always knew the questions in advance. They concerned the ordination of women, contraception, abortion and other such constantly recurring problems.
If we let ourselves be drawn into these discussions, the Church is then identified with certain commandments or prohibitions; we give the impression that we are moralists with a few somewhat antiquated convictions, and not even a hint of the true greatness of the faith appears. I therefore consider it essential always to highlight the greatness of our faith - a commitment from which we must not allow such situations to divert us."
Click to expand...
Exactly! Francis has just said it in a way more people will understand.
 
In matters of belief rather than governance, Pope Francis said that the pope and bishops share authority with the laity.
Click to expand...
“The church is the people of God on the journey through history,” he said. “Thinking with the church, therefore, is my way of being a part of this people. And all the faithful, considered as a whole, are infallible in matters of belief.”
Click to expand...
The pope quickly added that "we must be very careful not to think that this ‘infallibilitas’ of all the faithful I am talking about in the light of Vatican II is a form of populism. No; it is the experience of ‘holy mother the hierarchical church,’ as St. Ignatius called it, the church as the people of God, pastors and people together
Click to expand...
it appears to me that this is a change and a dramatic one
catholicnews.com/data/stories/cns/1303971.htm
 
Cider said:
I just don’t understand where he is coming from with the idea, that there is too much emphasis on these very important moral issues when they are rarely if ever discussed in the homilies I’ve heard. I don’t think I’ve ever heard a priest mention homosexuality and abortion has maybe been mentioned when there a local pro life event happening.
Click to expand...
Is isn’t from the pulpits that we hear all this obsessiveness about these issues. The place to look is these forums. Just look at the nature of the threads. How many of them are (perhaps obsessively) about homosexuality, masturbation, abortion, contraception? Some people on these boards just love to be the “doctrine police” on these boards, ready to POUNCE on anyone who isn’t orthodox.
 
GaryTaylor said:
Sounds like you have Salvation all figured out, why are you here? BTW which congregation do you attend? Or is this when you say its none of your business because your ashamed to discuss it?
Click to expand...
I was raised and baptized Catholic. Learned all the latin for the mass at 6 years old and was able to skip alter boy school.

Served mass until very late teens including walking a very long distance to a hospital routinely to serve and voluteer at the hospital.

When I first became an alter boy I was short , have blonde hair and blue eyes and no one could barely see me walking up the isle with the priest. My parents went crazy and called me the little angel.

I got a job and paid for all my catholic private schooling and books and gym equipment with my own earned money.

Thats my up bringing and now I enjoy reading Nihil Obstat for relaxing, how about yourself?

and good to meet your acquaintance to be sure 👍 ( Im in the arts and come from RCC family many generations in depth…
 
TheAdvocate said:
Is isn’t from the pulpits that we hear all this obsessiveness about these issues. The place to look is these forums. Just look at the nature of the threads. How many of them are (perhaps obsessively) about homosexuality, masturbation, abortion, contraception? Some people on these boards just love to be the “doctrine police” on these boards, ready to POUNCE on anyone who isn’t orthodox.
Click to expand...
Well, the opposite of orthodox is heterodox… yes there are lots of threads on these topics, but I see no pouncing. I see correction when people willfully misinterpret the Church’s teachings (which have not changed.)
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top