Pro Choice/Abortion “Catholics”

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It depends on if you can still be Catholic while holding heretical beliefs.
 
According to the RCC the answer to that is an unequivocal YES. Once Catholic, Always Catholic. Or so I’m repeatedly told.
 
Annie said:
Currently, if I were to tell a doctor that I was planning to kill someone,
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In regards to the unborn, in a secular system of laws and ethics, this statement is matter of belief and is very difficult to legislate. I’m not arguing that it isn’t a very immoral thing to do or that somebody isn’t being killed; i am simply stating the reality of the situation. Secular states that have approved pro-choice are very unlikely to return to anti-abortion laws because it would involve an invasion of privacy based on beliefs, and forcing women to full term will never be accepted.
 
IWantGod said:
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Annie:
Currently, if I were to tell a doctor that I was planning to kill someone,
Click to expand...
In regards to the unborn, in a secular system of laws and ethics, this statement is matter of belief and is very difficult to legislate. I’m not arguing that it isn’t a very immoral thing to do or that somebody isn’t being killed; i am simply stating the reality of the situation. Secular states that have approved pro-choice are very unlikely to return to anti-abortion laws because it would involve an invasion of privacy based on beliefs, and forcing women to full term will never be accepted.
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The laws will fall where they will, true. But the assertion of privacy is a deception. As the poster pointed out the assertion of privacy is a quicksand of a-moral thought. It simply means nothing.
 
It would be better not to throw the term heretic around. It has a specific legal definition and so it doesn’t help much in this context.
 
That’s the definition of heresy. You called actual people heretics.

Can you see the difference?
 
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And the point is, you are not qualified to pronounce someone a heretic. That’s just a fact. And so it’s counterproductive to do so. It’s rhetorical posturing.
 
A “heretic” by definition is someone who commits heresy.

If you define someone’s utterances as a heresy, you are calling them a heretic
 
I’m not judging you, I’m pointing out that you are using the term “heretic” in an anti ecclesial way.
Serves no purpose.
 
Yes. Anti ecclesial can mean to speak outside the mind of the Church, or in a way that Church does not speak, or outside one’s own authority and competence.
Thanks for asking.
 
If you are qualified to pronounce someone a heretic, then get this over with and provide your credentials. You are wasting valuable time.

Again: there is a difference between recognizing what heresy is, and pronouncing someone a heretic.
 
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Oh I’m so sorry, Cardinal Burke. :roll_eyes:
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Yes it is dull, and annoying. No one cares whether you think they are heretics, cause you don’t have the authority to use the term in regard to anyone, and it doesn’t serve good communication.
It’s the knee jerk of a shallow argument. There are many good pro life arguments that are slam dunk and convincing. Calling people heretics is not one of them.
 
goout said:
The laws will fall where they will, true. But the assertion of privacy is a deception.
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That as it may be, we are all aware as Catholic’s that the whole world is drowning in deception. You can’t always fight fire with fire. There are some wars that can only be fought and won with God’s love.
 
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You don’t need authority to recognize when someone is holding a heretical belief.
 
IWantGod said:
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goout:
The laws will fall where they will, true. But the assertion of privacy is a deception.
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That as it may be, we are all aware as Catholic’s that the whole world is drowning in deception. You can’t always fight fire with fire. There are some wars that can only be fought and won with God’s love.
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Not sure what point you are addressing. Of course, God is love. What does that love look like when innocent life is at stake?
Is God’s love silent in the face of injustice? Is mercy only for the powerful?
 
SeriousQuestion said:
You don’t need authority to recognize when someone is holding a heretical belief.
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Please read. There is a difference between recognizing what heresy is and it’s definition, and pronouncing someone a heretic.

Those are related yet different things.
 
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So where do you draw that line since you’re advocating being an arbiter of who gets to call themselves Catholic or Christian?
 
goout said:
Not sure what point you are addressing. Of course, God is love. What does that love look like when innocent life is at stake?
Is God’s love silent in the face of injustice? Is mercy only for the powerful?
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The point is, some wars can only be fought with a specific kind of weapon. If you walk into a room full of delusional people and start enforcing rules and crying out that laws ought to reflect God’s rule, it will be unlikely that you will garner much support and they will rebel against you. In their eyes you will be the tyrant, the evil one even though you’re the one in the right. But if you show them what love is, and inspire love in their hearts, there is an opportunity for God to work in them and change them. It’s not easy, but i just don’t think that using the weapons of the system will get us very far in convincing people that abortion is the same thing as killing a living breathing human with a personal soul. Until they are convinced of this, the law will not change.
 
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LateCatholic said:
The facts is that you CANNOT have a free society if you force/control a woman’s body. Period.
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Yet what about the body of the little child who is killed by abortion? Is it OK to force control over his or her body to to point of snuffing out his or her little life if the mother so decides?

A free society should not include the freedom to kill others, even (especially) if those others are so vulnerable that they depend on you to support their life.
 
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