Scriptural evidence for "pre-mortal existence". Is there any?

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rmcmullan said:
The whole point of the sower parable is the seeds. If you can create perfect seeds, why mess with all the imperfect ones. Unless they were there and you wanted to help them. If you can create perfect seeds and make strong beautiful plants, why would you raise up an orchard of twsited olive trees?
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As I stated in Post #583, which you have ignored, and as others have also stated, this has nothing to do with the seeds, mcmullen, it has to do with whether or not our faith is deep and rich enough for the seeds to grow. I’m not sure why you are ignoring this plain meaning, but it remains whether or not you wish to ackowledge it. As I also stated before, I think you need to read the parable again. Apparently you have not.
 
rmcmullan said:
The whole point of the sower parable is the seeds. If you can create perfect seeds, why mess with all the imperfect ones. Unless they were there and you wanted to help them. If you can create perfect seeds and make strong beautiful plants, why would you raise up an orchard of twsited olive trees?
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Where do you get the idea that it is about the seeds??
 
You guys are confusing my parable with the original one. Note the differences!
 
rmcmullan said:
You guys are confusing my parable with the original one. Note the differences!
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And you have hit the nail on the head. We listen to Jesus, you and JOseph keep using things that sound almost like the Bible, but are different. We choose to follow the Bible. You can follow the false prophets
 
ParkerD said:
Nicea325,

I think you completely misunderstood what was being asked about Catholic beliefs. That was the discussion point, so if you answer the question you ask here from the standpoint of a Catholic getting asked that question, then you’ll have your answer.
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ParkerD,

With all due respect, you did not answer the question. You are merely side-step the question. So I’ll ask again:

Does God tempt us? YES?..or… NO?
 
TexanKnight said:
And you have hit the nail on the head. We listen to Jesus, you and JOseph keep using things that sound almost like the Bible, but are different. We choose to follow the Bible. You can follow the false prophets
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TexanKnight:

I guess some folks completely ignore the scriptural verses where Jesus warned us about false prophets? 🤷
 
Nicea325 said:
ParkerD,

With all due respect, you did not answer the question. You are merely side-step the question. So I’ll ask again:

Does God tempt us? YES?..or… NO?
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Nicea325,

I guess I thought the answer was too obvious to warrant needing a reply, but here you go:

NO.

(But He does give free will choice, even using the Bible.) He does not force, at all. (Sometimes I think that becomes confusing to some people, who expect that the Bible is forcing their behavior in some way. That would be contrary to God’s purposes.)

A wish of peace to you and all readers.
 
ParkerD said:
Nicea325,

I guess I thought the answer was too obvious to warrant needing a reply, but here you go:

NO.

(But He does give free will choice, even using the Bible.) He does not force, at all. (Sometimes I think that becomes confusing to some people, who expect that the Bible is forcing their behavior in some way. That would be contrary to God’s purposes.)

A wish of peace to you and all readers.
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Thank you for replying,which is all I asked from you.
 
There was a Protestant minister who came on here within the past 10 days and said he spent some time professionally studying Mormonism…and it ended up as here…there really is no base standard.

The Mormon books are used…and Scripture phrases are used, out of context…some blatantly so…to support Mormon beliefs…
 
Se post #580. I said:

I was thinking of the parable of the sower. In that, there was a variety of seed and some grew and flourished and some did not. But the sower has to pick his seed from what’s available. If he could create the seed, he would create nothing but the best.
 
rmcmullan said:
Se post #580. I said:

I was thinking of the parable of the sower. In that, there was a variety of seed and some grew and flourished and some did not. But the sower has to pick his seed from what’s available. If he could create the seed, he would create nothing but the best.
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Matthew 13

The Parable of the Sower

1 That same day Jesus went out of the house and sat by the lake. 2 Such large crowds gathered around him that he got into a boat and sat in it, while all the people stood on the shore. 3 Then he told them many things in parables, saying: “A farmer went out to sow his seed. 4 As he was scattering the seed, some fell along the path, and the birds came and ate it up. 5 Some fell on rocky places, where it did not have much soil. It sprang up quickly, because the soil was shallow. 6 But when the sun came up, the plants were scorched, and they withered because they had no root. 7 Other seed fell among thorns, which grew up and choked the plants. 8 Still other seed fell on good soil, where it produced a crop—a hundred, sixty or thirty times what was sown. 9 Whoever has ears, let them hear.”

It’s the same seed. It’s good seed. Read the passage. Nowhere is it speaking of different seeds but instead it is speaking of different soil. That would be you and me and everybody else.

Some of us are good soil, some rocky, some shallow. Do you understand what I mean?
 
Yes, I know. I understand the parable, it’s been around for a long time. I don’t think anyone *wants *to understand my retelling of it. I’m making a different point. I guess it’s my fault, trying to use parables to explain something here on the Catholic Forums. That’s not what parables are for.

…because they seeing see not; and hearing they hear not, neither do they understand.

So no more parables.
 
Miriam1947, I am talking about the pre-existence here and asking if God is getting his seed or creating them. God getting His seed is an analogy for the pre-existence. God creating His seed is my extension of the parable.

The point I am trying to make is that God didn’t create our spirit or disposition, it is eternal. Otherwise he would have to take the blame for all the evil. In other words if He can create Peter, James & John as well as Hitler and Stalin, why wouldn’t He just stick with the good seed?
 
God is not getting his seed.

The seed comes from our parents…nowadays it is called DNA.

It was God Who willed us into existence by giving us spirit (soul) and life.

I willl add that in the Book of Job, there are plenty of references regarding the will of God and His mysterious ways.

In the Book of Genesis, it is said that God made woman from man…so Eve began by God after Adam’s creation. Before that, there were no humans.
 
rmcmullan said:
Miriam1947, I am talking about the pre-existence here and asking if God is getting his seed or creating them. God getting His seed is an analogy for the pre-existence. God creating His seed is my extension of the parable.

The point I am trying to make is that God didn’t create our spirit or disposition, it is eternal. Otherwise he would have to take the blame for all the evil. In other words if He can create Peter, James & John as well as Hitler and Stalin, why wouldn’t He just stick with the good seed?
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No part of us is eternal. ***Only God is eternal. *** We have an immortal soul that was created by God.

I am so not getting what you are talking about with the seeds. It’s about Jesus and his teachings. It’s a parable.

par·a·ble   [par-uh-buhl]
noun
1.
a short allegorical story designed to illustrate or teach some truth, religious principle, or moral lesson.
2.
a statement or comment that conveys a meaning indirectly by the use of comparison, analogy, or the like.
 
KathleenGee, merely stating something doesn’t make it true.

And if DNA made Peter James & John saints and apostles while Hitler and Stalin were made psychopathic mass murders by their DNA, who is to hold them to blame? They have no control over their DNA.

There can be no free will without an eternal identity.
 
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