Should I marry a non-catholic or be single forever?

[RolandThompsonGunner]

I just think calling someone “rigid” is such a lazy response.

I didn’t realize I was going to strike such a nerve. For the record, I meant “rigid” in terms of “awkward social interaction” not “rigid” the way it’s sometimes used to describe religious conservatives. Probably the wrong word choice.

Lol. I just want my future spouse to be free to marry in the church and not expect me to commit a mortal sin before or after we’re married! I’m so rigid

To be clear, that’s not what I was implying.

“Rigid” was probably the wrong word. What I’m trying to articulate is this: you seem to believe that A) there is a “right” sort of Catholic and B) you can tell whether a guy is the “right sort” without actually spending time with him one on one. I’m fine with A. I think it’s totally reasonable for you to want to be with someone who shares your values (although realistically no two people are ever going to agree on literally everything.) I’m more skeptical of B. These “big questions” are usually naturally explored over the course of dating. The first few dates are more about getting to know the person on a very basic level and establishing if there is physical attraction and seeing if your personalities click. If so, and you continue spending time with this person, these deeper conversations will naturally come up. Giving guys a litmus test right off the bat just strikes me as a bad approach. You get to know people gradually.

The phrase you keep using “love the Church and defends her teaching” makes me think you expect that the guy would be very publicly opinionated on various moral/theological questions, or you’re hitting him with some heavy questions right out of the gate. Otherwise, how do you know if he “defends Church teaching” without taking some time to really get to know him?

For example, let’s say I was single and there was a girl I saw at Mass I was attracted to. I approach her after Mass, introduce myself, and suggest we get coffee. If she said, “Sure, but just fyi I don’t believe in premarital sex and you better not either.” I would be really turned off. NOT because I disagree with the sentiment (I agree, sex should be in the context of marriage) but because that’s a really weird conversation to have before we’ve even done the “so, where are you from?” type stuff. It would make me wonder if she was not the most socially aware person.

I don’t think you’re wrong to have standards, or that you should date just anyone who comes along. I also don’t think it’s wrong to have some immediate dealbreakers (you can safely turn down the guy with the “Hail Satan” neck tattoo). I do think maybe you should be more open to the idea that you need to get to know someone a little bit before you can fairly assess their faith and morals. That’s all I’m saying.

 

[RolandThompsonGunner]

btw, you didn’t include a link in your last post

Oh, I don’t have any suggestions on dating sites. I’m no longer looking. I’ve heard Catholic Match is hit of miss. You know they’re Catholic, but it also has a lot of oddballs. Just what I’ve heard secondhand, though.

Where is your parish? And do you find that the “mixed” couples continue to attend church after they are married?

For what it’s worth, I’m a Catholic man in a mixed marriage. Hasn’t been an issue at all. My wife comes to Mass with me only occasionally, but she’s never tried to stop me from taking our daughters, or educating them about the faith, or baptizing them, etc. Obviously, we discussed this before we got married.

It’s a hurdle, but it’s not an insurmountable one.

 

[RolandThompsonGunner]

I can’t fault men on this one. Ain’t nobody got time to treat every women like she’s something special.

Well, no, not “every woman”. The one you’re trying to date

 

[EnglishTeacher]

Where is your parish? And do you find that the “mixed” couples continue to attend church after they are married?

The parish is in the Midwest (U.S.).

It’s difficult to fully answer the next question because for various reasons (location being one of them) the parish got a lot of requests for weddings from people who were lived in other cities and were not parishioners, and the priest accommodated most of them. So it’s hard to “track” what became of many of the couples, since they did not remain in the area. From what I could tell, many couples were not very active in practicing their faith anyway but had enough connection to their Catholic roots to want a church wedding. For those that did stick around in the parish, I would say we saw at least a somewhat higher level of attendance and participation when both spouses were Catholic.

On a purely anecdotal note: My husband was raised Catholic. His mom was an extremely devout Catholic, and his dad was Protestant (who became Catholic many years later). His dad was fully on board with raising the children Catholic, and he attended Mass with the rest of the family and was active in the parish. However, despite his dad being fully supportive of his Catholic upbringing, my husband said that having parents of different faith traditions created some dissonance in his mind because Catholicism was “Mom’s thing.” He drifted away from attending Mass for several years in young adulthood, but interestingly returned to practicing around the time his dad became Catholic. It wasn’t the sole reason for his return, but it influenced him, even as an adult.

So everyone’s mileage varies with the mixed-marriage issue, but for me it was a non-negotiable , as it sounds like it is for you.

 

[RolandThompsonGunner]

But the one you’re trying to date could be any one of many. And anyway, we’re talking before a date has even occurred, we’re talking the starting point. The guy is being asked to treat her as something special before he even asks her out.

Which is not only time-wasting, it is usually counter productive. The men who are most successful in dating tend to be the men who don’t put any woman on a pedestal.

Yes and no. I agree, if you’re buying flowers and writing cheesy sonnets to every woman you see, you’re going to look desperate and weird.

But “special” can be as little as just how much time you spend talking to her. If there is a woman you’re interested in, and she notices that you’re flirting with every girl in sight, she’s probably going to assume you’re not really into her, you’re just trolling for anyone with a pulse.

 

[DivineMercy01]

For the record, I meant “rigid” in terms of “awkward social interaction” not “rigid” the way it’s sometimes used to describe religious conservatives. Probably the wrong word choice.

I am never publicly opinionated about my faith unless a man shows direct interest in me. And for the record, I’ve made the mistake of not being up front about it in the past which has led to a lot of wasted time on both my part and the lukewarm Catholic party’s. Best to be up front about who I am to weed out the lukewarms, atheists, etc. Of course I don’t go around saying “I’m Catholic.” It only comes up if a man shows romantic interest in me. I have found many non-Catholics and lukewarm Catholics think that my faith is like a hobby-it’s something they can just tolerate.

B. These “big questions” are usually naturally explored over the course of dating. The first few dates are more about getting to know the person on a very basic level and establishing if there is physical attraction and seeing if your personalities click. If so, and you continue spending time with this person, these deeper conversations will naturally come up. Giving guys a litmus test right off the bat just strikes me as a bad approach. You get to know people gradually.

I think you can tell after one casual conversation if someone is deeply committed to his faith. You are correct about personalities/attraction coming later. I personally would rather weed out those who are theologically different from me right out of the gate, but to each his own. And I agree that there are 'Big questions" that come over the course of dating (i.e. I would not directly ask someone on a first date how he feels about fornication or contraception). But if I was on a first date with someone, I would have already determined that he was a practicing Catholic deeply committed to his faith.

Maybe when you were single you were open to more “casual dating.”

 

[DivineMercy01]

Sure, but just fyi I don’t believe in premarital sex and you better not either.” I would be really turned off. NOT because I disagree with the sentiment (I agree, sex should be in the context of marriage) but because that’s a really weird conversation to have before we’ve even done the “so, where are you from?”

I’m not suggesting I would do that. However, when asked on a date NOT at church, I have said “do you have a religion or spiritual practice.” Then I explain that I’m a practicing Catholic, I go to mass every day if I can, and everything I read/listen to is spiritual. That usually makes the unsuitable matches run for the hills And I know from experience, for me personally, it is far better to make them run for the hills immediately than to waste months of each other’s time only to find out that you don’t have the same idea of marriage.

As I keep saying, to each their own. I am a very goal-oriented (choleric) woman, I don’t like to waste time, and I’m not in a season of life where I think “casual” dating is a very good use of my time.

But, I understand why someone who is younger than myself, or maybe someone who hasn’t dated a lot might be more interested in “Casual” dating. So to each their own!

 

[RolandThompsonGunner]

So to each their own!

Sure. I hope it’s clear that none of my quibbling was meant in an unfriendly way. Just trying to be helpful.

By the way, do you really only read or listen to spiritual stuff? I mean you do you, but…that sounds pretty rough to me. Again, just my two cents.

 

[DivineMercy01]

By the way, do you really only read or listen to spiritual stuff? I mean you do you, but…that sounds pretty rough to me. Again, just my two cents.

No, but about 90% of what I read or listen to in my free time is spiritual. I would say that to a non-Catholic who expressed romantic interest in me to make it clear that spirituality is a huge part of my life. I have found that if I just say “I’m Catholic” the message doesn’t come across (probably because of the 93% of self-identified Catholics who don’t even attend mass and misrepresent the rest of us by not clarifying that they are not practicing their faith).

 

[RolandThompsonGunner]

Yeah, I get it. It’s hard to make it clear when you say “I’m Catholic” you mean practicing Catholic, not nominal or cultural Catholic.

 

[DivineMercy01]

To add to the list of reasons I’m not comfortable with online dating: it is nearly impossible to make it clear on the internet that you are a practicing Catholic, even on sites where you can “search” people by religion. I had an account on a secular platform once, but made it very clear in my profile that I loved the Lord and He was the center of my life.

I went on 15 first dates in a span of 3 weeks. 14 of them had not read my profile, as evidenced by the questions like “Is it going to be a deal-breaker that I’m not that religious?”

 

[RolandThompsonGunner]

I went on 15 first dates in a span of 3 weeks. 14 of them had not read my profile, as evidenced by the questions like “Is it going to be a deal-breaker that I’m not that religious?

Yeah, doesn’t speak well of their reading comprehension. I’m sure that was frustrating.

 

[AdamP88]

It’s a hurdle, but it’s not an insurmountable one.

At least you admit that it’s a hurdle. Some people on this thread would have you believe that there could be no issues.

 

[AdamP88]

But the one you’re trying to date could be any one of many. And anyway, we’re talking before a date has even occurred, we’re talking the starting point. The guy is being asked to treat her as something special before he even asks her out.

Which is not only time-wasting, it is usually counter productive. The men who are most successful in dating tend to be the men who don’t put any woman on a pedestal.

I think you’re misunderstanding what I was saying with that point. I don’t mean guys should treat every girl as special (well no more than any other human being is special). But I have heard of guys who are part of a group (friend group, youth group etc.) and just ask every girl out. Like using a cannon to kill a fly. It’s made very obvious that the only motivation these guys have is to find a girl to get married to. The impression given is that the only two things that matter are:
She’s alive.
She professes to be Catholic.

The men who are most successful in dating tend to be the men who don’t put any woman on a pedestal.

Don’t know where you get that from. It certainly doesn’t sound too romantic.
“Yo biatch, come on a date with me! We’ll go to my kitchen where you can make me food and then if you’re lucky I’ll drive you home”.

 

[RolandThompsonGunner]

Don’t know where you get that from. It certainly doesn’t sound too romantic.

I do get what he’s trying to say (I think, anyway.) Some guys have absorbed from movies that the way to get a girl interested is to shower her with gifts, flowers, and generally fawn all over her before you’ve even been on a date. While it’s true you should treat women (and people generally) with respect and kindness, if you come on too strong out of the gate, you just look desperate.

 

[AdamP88]

Place in life is critical. I would argue even more important than age.

I agree. I dated my wife for about six months before I proposed. And we were in different countries. I knew what I wanted though so I wasn’t interested in stalling. I think the marriage-minded mentality is very important. A lot of people don’t really get that until they hit thirty. There’s a feeling of FOMO that you’ll miss out on some cool experiences if you tie yourself down too early. People certainly expressed that to me when I was getting married at 28. And when they heard my wife-to-be was 22 they sometimes nearly fell over. “Ah you are too young to get married.” was a common statement.

Funny thing is, I feel like I’ve only started living since I got married. My career is going very well, I have developed more in my hobbies than I had in the past 28 years. We’ve traveled together all over the place. And she’s forced me to mature and develop as a person. When you lose the fear of missing out and are eager to be married, that makes a big difference.

 

[AdamP88]

I do get what he’s trying to say (I think, anyway.) Some guys have absorbed from movies that the way to get a girl interested is to shower her with gifts, flowers, and generally fawn all over her before you’ve even been on a date. While it’s true you should treat women (and people generally) with respect and kindness, if you come on too strong out of the gate, you just look desperate.

You only look desperate if she’s not interested. Though I would partially agree. The time to shower her with gifts is when you’re married.

And if you’re spending all your dating money on gifts…you won’t have enough for the engagement ring.

 

[DivineMercy01]

Yes. You can show a girl she is special by treating her differently. When you flirt with every girl who appears to be single and Catholic you become that guy.

 

[CathoRick]

For example, let’s say I was single and there was a girl I saw at Mass I was attracted to. I approach her after Mass, introduce myself, and suggest we get coffee. If she said, “Sure, but just fyi I don’t believe in premarital sex and you better not either.” I would be really turned off.

I’d let out a sigh of relief and be all the more excited to have that coffee.

 

[TheLittleLady]

More Catholic men marrying non-Catholic brides.