St Veronica & the Falls Of Jesus Removed From Way of Sorrows

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JKirkLVNV said:
But I admit it’s subjective opinion, Caesar! 😃 Still, if you were to bet (and I’m not encouraging that in one who may someday be a priest!), what would you wager? He’s already called the Great by several rather infulential people, including his successor.
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I can see it as being an immediate reaction to his Papacy. His reign was very long for a Pope, he was a media star, very popular, and known around the world. When he died people (understandably) focused on the good things that he had done- especialy his own personal holiness. But some of his decisions and actions in the Church are slowly coming to fuller realization. He was a good and holy man, very devoted to Our Lady and very strong willed, but he made some terrible decisions that will have far-reaching consequences. History reflects outcomes and consquences, and so I do not believe that history will see him as Great.
 
Caesar said:
I can see it as being an immediate reaction to his Papacy. His reign was very long for a Pope, he was a media star, very popular, and known around the world. When he died people (understandably) focused on the good things that he had done- especialy his own personal holiness. But some of his decisions and actions in the Church are slowly coming to fuller realization. He was a good and holy man, very devoted to Our Lady and very strong willed, but he made some terrible decisions that will have far-reaching consequences. History reflects outcomes and consquences, and so I do not believe that history will see him as Great.
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He was GREAT at attracting huge crowds of people to outdoor events, like Masses and rock concerts (and often both at once)…but after he left, the churches still remained empty.
 
Cor_Jesu said:
Not only does his successor think so (and he would know, he was on Pius XII’s heresy blacklist), but there’s a rumor such influential people as Bob Dylan agree. And if influential people think so, Vegas, they must be onto something.
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Well, you let me know what you think when the Cardinals elect YOU to the office (so many of us are so put OUT that it’s not US, stepping out onto the loggia of St. Peter’s, dressed in white, the crowd calling out for us). Because until you’ve carried the cross of that office, I wouldn’t be so quick with my judgments.
 
Balance said:
If I visit your blog, will I find more little snarky comments, more little digs, little smug juxtapostions, like this one, Caesar?
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And to think, Caesar, there are some who claim the Novus Ordo has NO artistic merit! The nerve!
 
Caesar said:
I can see it as being an immediate reaction to his Papacy. His reign was very long for a Pope, he was a media star, very popular, and known around the world. When he died people (understandably) focused on the good things that he had done- especialy his own personal holiness. But some of his decisions and actions in the Church are slowly coming to fuller realization. He was a good and holy man, very devoted to Our Lady and very strong willed, but he made some terrible decisions that will have far-reaching consequences. History reflects outcomes and consquences, and so I do not believe that history will see him as Great.
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Again, terrible decisions like what? As your post stands, it reads more like slander than reasoned argument.
 
Balance said:
If I visit your blog, will I find more little snarky comments, more little digs, little smug juxtapostions, like this one, Caesar?
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I don’t see any comment there at all. BTW, a blog is a personal journal, so you have no control over what Caesar posts on his own blog.
 
Balance said:
“Our blessed mother’s perfect rosary”?

That makes it sound like she handed it down on a stone tablet. As you know, that’s not how the Rosary came to us, is it?

Like the Way of the Cross, it developed over time.
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But usualy change comes about because of a problem, or an abuse. Where were the problems with the Rosary before 2002? Were there complaints? Abuses?
 
JKirkLVNV said:
Well, you let me know what you think when the Cardinals elect YOU to the office (so many of us are so put OUT that it’s not US, stepping out onto the loggia of St. Peter’s, dressed in white, the crowd calling out for us). Because until you’ve carried the cross of that office, I wouldn’t be so quick with my judgments.
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You have a point, Vegas. Every Pope has struggled with the temptation to bring pop and rock stars into the Vatican and add new “mysteries” to the rosary.
 
Balance said:
Again, terrible decisions like what? As your post stands, it reads more like slander than reasoned argument.
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How is that slander? I am saying that though many see him as Great now, history is likely to say differant. Was is slanderous to say that a mortal man made mistakes?
 
Caesar said:
How is that slander? I am saying that though many see him as Great now, history is likely to say differant. Was is slanderous to say that a mortal man made mistakes?
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There is nothing slanderous in your post Caesar. You are entitled to your opinion, and you worded it well.
 
Caesar said:
I can see it as being an immediate reaction to his Papacy. His reign was very long for a Pope, he was a media star, very popular, and known around the world. When he died people (understandably) focused on the good things that he had done- especialy his own personal holiness. But some of his decisions and actions in the Church are slowly coming to fuller realization. He was a good and holy man, very devoted to Our Lady and very strong willed, but he made some terrible decisions that will have far-reaching consequences. History reflects outcomes and consquences, and so I do not believe that history will see him as Great.
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But, Caesar, do you really think it’s YOU they’re going to ask? I’m not asking that hatefully, I promise you. They aren’t asking me, either! The overwhelming “sense,” though, where do you think that lies?

And I have to say, if you think it was a matter of being a media “star,” those last few years, with his face frozen in that Parkinson’s mask, with the drool running down the side of his face, that palsied hand, you’re gravely mistaken. It wasn’t stardom. It was because, no matter what, he didn’t falter. He followed Christ right straight up Calvary. I think his sainthood is a forgone conclusion, but that’s also the reason he’ll be (and is now) called the Great.
 
paramedicgirl said:
I don’t see any comment there at all. BTW, a blog is a personal journal, so you have no control over what Caesar posts on his own blog.
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No, it didn’t come up in my post - go back and have a look at Caesar’s post. The “comment” is there in the relation between the quote he posted and the picture.

BTW, I’m not asking to have control over his blog. I’m just wondering if there’s anything of value in it.
 
Caesar said:
But usualy change comes about because of a problem, or an abuse. Where were the problems with the Rosary before 2002? Were there complaints? Abuses?
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Not necessarily. Change ALSO can be a result of “Let’s consider this.”
 
Cor_Jesu said:
You have a point, Vegas. Every Pope has struggled with the temptation to bring pop and rock stars into the Vatican and add new “mysteries” to the rosary.
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Well, other popes have changed the mass and for “rock stars,” every age has had them…they just might not have played rock music.
 
JKirkLVNV said:
But, Caesar, do you really think it’s YOU they’re going to ask? I’m not asking that hatefully, I promise you. They aren’t asking me, either! The overwhelming “sense,” though, where do you think that lies?

And I have to say, if you think it was a matter of being a media “star,” those last few years, with his face frozen in that Parkinson’s mask, with the drool running down the side of his face, that palsied hand, you’re gravely mistaken. It wasn’t stardom. It was because, no matter what, he didn’t falter. He followed Christ right straight up Calvary. I think his sainthood is a forgone conclusion, but that’s also the reason he’ll be (and is now) called the Great.
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But that reflects his personal holiness- something that I will not argue. He was a very holy man. He was a very strong man. But like I said, history rarely reflects such things on leaders- rather it reflects the outcomes and consequences of their decisions. And, with all due respect to him, some of his decisions were very damaging.
 
JKirkLVNV said:
But, Caesar, do you really think it’s YOU they’re going to ask? I’m not asking that hatefully, I promise you. They aren’t asking me, either! The overwhelming “sense,” though, where do you think that lies?

And I have to say, if you think it was a matter of being a media “star,” those last few years, with his face frozen in that Parkinson’s mask, with the drool running down the side of his face, that palsied hand, you’re gravely mistaken. It wasn’t stardom. It was because, no matter what, he didn’t falter. He followed Christ right straight up Calvary. I think his sainthood is a forgone conclusion, but that’s also the reason he’ll be (and is now) called the Great.
Click to expand...
But that reflects his personal holiness- something that I will not argue. He was a very holy man. He was a very strong man. But like I said, history rarely reflects such things on leaders- rather it reflects the outcomes and consequences of their decisions. And, with all due respect to him, some of his decisions were very damaging.
 
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