St Veronica & the Falls Of Jesus Removed From Way of Sorrows

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Cor_Jesu said:
Wow, JP2 already tampered with the Holy Rosary, and now come to find out the Stations of the Cross! Is there ANY aspect of our religion JP2 left alone without putting his own spin on? He will certainly be remembered for promoting novelty and being innovative.
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He “tampered with the Holy Rosary”?

Good grief. What does that mean?
 
Balance said:
Come again? What do you actually mean?
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I think he means that the modernist-influenced Vatican has already skewered our holy faith beyond recognition, especially the Mass. Now they have to make sure they reinvent EVERY other thing we hold dear as well. It appears that John Paul the Great for whatever reason felt the need to put his mark on every practice of our religion.
 
TNT said:
I like that…adding the RESURRECTION to the Way of Sorrows… Yes indeed.
Keep stirrin them metaphors.
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By your logic, wouldn’t Veronica wiping Christ’s face, giving him comfort, or Christ meeting his mother, presumably getting comfort from that too, be out of place in a Way of Sorrows?
 
Balance said:
He “tampered with the Holy Rosary”?

Good grief. What does that mean?
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It means that Our Lady and her children were already perfectly happy with the 15-decade rosary SHE personally approved of many times. WHO would have the gall to change such a cherished devotion? (Oh wait, I know who…) It was already perfect as it was, if it ain’t broke, don’t fix it! So much for the rosary being “Mary’s Psalter” (there are 150 Psalms…not 200). In all her apparitions where she asked men to pray the rosary did she ever ONCE suggest it needed new mysteries? NO! Sheesh, the Great One couldn’t even heed her request to consecrate Russia exactly as she asked but had to do it HIS way!
 
Balance said:
Come again? What do you actually mean?
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Well, and I do not wish to answer for St Isidore but only give my own opinion, there has been more change and novelty in the traditions of the Church in the last 40 years then in the last 2000, and it is not likely that this trend will stop anytime soon.

While John Paul II, may he rest in peace, was often very firm on matters of morality and ethics, he was a promoter of novelties and change in the traditions of the Church. It would have been far better for his novelties to go to the grave with him.

While I am not reffering to Apostolic Tradition like the Assumption or the like, there is no reason why the Church must lose Her ancient traditions and disciplines whenever the modern, secular world challenges the Holy Faith. It is times like these when we need to hang onto our traditions more then ever,
 
Caesar said:
While John Paul II, may he rest in peace, was often very firm on matters of morality and ethics, he was a promoter of novelties and change in the traditions of the Church. It would have been far better for his novelties to go to the grave with him.
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We need to pray for him. His fans (and I use that word for a reason) are too busy roaring “SANTO SUBITO! SANTO SUBITO!” to stop and say a prayer for his soul. :signofcross:
 
Cor_Jesu said:
I think he means that the modernist-influenced Vatican has already skewered our holy faith beyond recognition, especially the Mass. Now they have to make sure they reinvent EVERY other thing we hold dear as well. It appears that John Paul the Great for whatever reason felt the need to put his mark on every practice of our religion.
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“The modernist-influenced Vatican”? This would be the Vatican that leads the Church in the 21st Century, not the tenth or fifteenth or even twentieth? This is the Pope who speaks often against modernist errors, and the particular trials of life in the twenty-first century?

I can accept someone saying, “I don’t think it’s helpful to rework/revise the Way of the Cross” but don’t accept this jump form that to “There is a conspiracy afoot and the Pope is part of it and they are tearing down the Church.”

I mean, come on.

“Skewered our holy faith”?

This would be the holy faith that accepts the leadership of the Pope as Christ’s representative on Earth? Or is a holy faith that exists only in your own head?
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Cor_Jesu said:
Wow, JP2 already tampered with the Holy Rosary, and now come to find out the Stations of the Cross! Is there ANY aspect of our religion JP2 left alone without putting his own spin on? He will certainly be remembered for promoting novelty and being innovative.
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Perhaps, he thought his additions to the Rosary were required or that something was misplaced, I am not sure 🤷
As everyone can see the tampering and spin is continuing to occur.:hypno:
 
Cor_Jesu said:
Wow, JP2 already tampered with the Holy Rosary, and now come to find out the Stations of the Cross! Is there ANY aspect of our religion JP2 left alone without putting his own spin on? He will certainly be remembered for promoting novelty and being innovative.
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Have you read the history of the stations of the Cross that have been posted here. They have been somewhat fluid. Also, John Paul II didn’t propose any changes for the stations of the Cross for the whole Church. As for the Luminous Mysteries, let’s see, first, there was the “Zoroastrian-Masonic Initiation of the Lord”…oh, wait, no, no it was “The BAPTISM of the Lord.” But of course, there was the “Lesbian Committment Ceremony at Cana,” no, no, I’ve got that wrong, oh yes, it was “The Wedding Feast at Cana.” Hmmm, then there was the “Establishment of the Worker’s Proletariat.” Um, sorry, I mean the “Proclamation of the Kingdom.” Lessee, fourth would be the “The Divine Metamorphasis”, whoops, the “Transfiguration.” The last one, of course, is the “Wine and Cibata Bread Social.” Except that it was the “Institution of the Eucharist.”

Yeah, that John Paul, asking us to ponder such non-Catholic things.
 
Cor_Jesu said:
We need to pray for him. His fans (and I use that word for a reason) are too busy roaring “SANTO SUBITO! SANTO SUBITO!” to stop and say a prayer for his soul. :signofcross:
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I have no doubt that personally he was a very holy man, but he did much that has harmed tradition by way of promoting novelty and encouraging rapid, unrestrained change.
 
Cor_Jesu said:
We need to pray for him. His fans (and I use that word for a reason) are too busy roaring “SANTO SUBITO! SANTO SUBITO!” to stop and say a prayer for his soul. :signofcross:
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I pray for the repose of the Holy Father’s soul every night. And, as we were bidden by the current pope, I also pray for his canonization.
 
Caesar said:
I have no doubt that personally he was a very holy man, but he did much that has harmed tradition by way of promoting novelty and encouraging rapid, unrestrained change.
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Again, Caesar, that’s subjective. We’ll see what the Church and history have to say.
 
JKirkLVNV said:
Have you read the history of the stations of the Cross that have been posted here. They have been somewhat fluid. Also, John Paul II didn’t propose any changes for the stations of the Cross for the whole Church. As for the Luminous Mysteries, let’s see, first, there was the “Zoroastrian-Masonic Initiation of the Lord”…oh, wait, no, no it was “The BAPTISM of the Lord.” But of course, there was the “Lesbian Committment Ceremony at Cana,” no, no, I’ve got that wrong, oh yes, it was “The Wedding Feast at Cana.” Hmmm, then there was the “Establishment of the Worker’s Proletariat.” Um, sorry, I mean the “Proclamation of the Kingdom.” Lessee, fourth would be the “The Divine Metamorphasis”, whoops, the “Transfiguration.” The last one, of course, is the “Wine and Cibata Bread Social.” Except that it was the “Institution of the Eucharist.”

Yeah, that John Paul, asking us to ponder such non-Catholic things.
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Puh-leez. How about inventing a new mystery based on every story from the Bible? :rolleyes:
 
JKirkLVNV said:
Again, Caesar, that’s subjective. We’ll see what the Church and history have to say.
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Let’s just look at Church history for the answer, Vegas. It isn’t so subjective. Believe it or not, Church documents used to be pretty straightforward…they weren’t all so ambiguous and subjective like the V2 documents, JP2 encyclicals, and the all-knowing CCC would have you believe.
 
Cor_Jesu said:
Puh-leez. How about inventing a new mystery based on every story from the Bible? :rolleyes:
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Didn’t happen. It was just five. That’s 1,2,3,4,5. My 2 year-old nephew can manage the number, I assume the difficulties won’t be insurmountable for others.
 
Balance said:
“The modernist-influenced Vatican”? This would be the Vatican that leads the Church in the 21st Century, not the tenth or fifteenth or even twentieth? This is the Pope who speaks often against modernist errors, and the particular trials of life in the twenty-first century?
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WHICH Pope speaks against modernist errors?? :confused:
 
Cor_Jesu said:
Let’s just look at Church history for the answer, Vegas. It isn’t so subjective. Believe it or not, Church documents used to be pretty straightforward…they weren’t all so ambiguous and subjective like the V2 documents, JP2 encyclicals, and the all-knowing CCC would have you believe.
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As I said, “Cor” Jesu :rolleyes: , we’ll let history and the Church decide. I’m betting that John Paul will be elevated to the honors of the altar and remembered as “the Great” long after our great-grandchildren have lost track of our names.
 
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