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Maxirad
Guest
Would any CAF members agree with Ms. Venker?
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Suzanne Venker: "To be Catholic and vote for Democrats in 2020 is just wrong"
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Jesuslover
Guest
I agree. Abortion is by far the gravest injustice in this country that must be remedied. What could possibly be worse or demand more attention than the murder of hundreds of thousands of children every year? As such, I believe that Catholics are obliged to vote for the party that has the best hope of decreasing and limiting abortion as much as possible. While the Republican party does still support abortion in some cases, they want to restrict abortion and ban late-term abortion, which is a stark constrast to the Democrats’ unrestriced abortion platform.
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Elizabeth3
Guest
I agree with her.
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Martin_Davis
Guest
The biggest issues of the day are income inequality and racism. If you check the facts - not Republican propaganda - you’ll see that the Abortion rate was declining, but since Trump cut many social program budgets that helped the poor, Abortions are increasing in women below the poverty line. The Republicans are for the rich - check the facts please…
Making Abortion illegal will not fix the moral condition of the country - that will take social action and influence that can only come through compassionate care of mothers and their babies. Don’t vote on one issue. The Republican party had the majority of the government control since 1974 (check the history) they did not reduce the Abortion rate during this time. It actually declined under Obama…again, check the facts!!!
Making Abortion illegal will not fix the moral condition of the country - that will take social action and influence that can only come through compassionate care of mothers and their babies. Don’t vote on one issue. The Republican party had the majority of the government control since 1974 (check the history) they did not reduce the Abortion rate during this time. It actually declined under Obama…again, check the facts!!!
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Poet
Guest
Yes, I agree with her. The Democrats are the party of killing unborn children, promiscuity, gay ‘marriage,’ and much more that is against the Catholic faith.
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FiveLinden
Guest
What is the evidence that laws against abortion that could, in practice, be expected to be made in the US, will lead to a decrease in the number of abortions given the availability of inter-state and inter-national travel, and medical abortion drugs that are no more likely to be restricted then any other drug?
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FiveLinden
Guest
Not really ‘evidence’.
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otjm
Guest
In 1964 I was old enough to vote, and I registered with the Democratic Party. It was not the party of abortion; it wa the party of small businessmen and labor.
It has long since become a party my grandfather (who was my influence) would not be able to recognize. Four years before, it was the party which had the first Catholic President, and Catholics felt a surge of pride and of recognition as approaching legitimacy within the body politic which had largely been the playing field of the Protestants. Anti Catholicism was still a real issue, but much less so than previously. JFK was a hero martyr, and his brother Bobby a hero also martyred, according to many.
Today the Democratic Party wants little or nothing to do with the Catholics or the Protestants (with perhaps the complicity of the mainline Protestant churches which have bought into the secularism, particularly in the area of sexual morality). we are lumped into the rhetoric of those whose love is for their Bbile and their guns, into the basket of deplorables, women haters who demand they carry their unwanted fetuses to birth, - and all the rest of the tripe which has been said in the last two elections. It is the party which has a hair trigger to anything they can accuse the other side of by pasting the label “racist” when they cannot even respond to the vile comments of some of their freshmen politicians who openly speak hate of Israel. They have embraced secularism as the new religion with a vengeance and have openly worked to demand the Christians who have deep seated religious and theological grounding simply cast that aside under the guise of “equality”. They are in complete disdain for significant parts of the Amendments to the Constitution and do so openly, and make a hero of the Supreme Court Justice who has openly and repeatedly indicated - and outright said - that the Constitution “needs to be re-written.”
In several States they have proposed bills which would strip the Church of a significant part of at least one sacrament.
And at this I will get off my soapbox.
It has long since become a party my grandfather (who was my influence) would not be able to recognize. Four years before, it was the party which had the first Catholic President, and Catholics felt a surge of pride and of recognition as approaching legitimacy within the body politic which had largely been the playing field of the Protestants. Anti Catholicism was still a real issue, but much less so than previously. JFK was a hero martyr, and his brother Bobby a hero also martyred, according to many.
Today the Democratic Party wants little or nothing to do with the Catholics or the Protestants (with perhaps the complicity of the mainline Protestant churches which have bought into the secularism, particularly in the area of sexual morality). we are lumped into the rhetoric of those whose love is for their Bbile and their guns, into the basket of deplorables, women haters who demand they carry their unwanted fetuses to birth, - and all the rest of the tripe which has been said in the last two elections. It is the party which has a hair trigger to anything they can accuse the other side of by pasting the label “racist” when they cannot even respond to the vile comments of some of their freshmen politicians who openly speak hate of Israel. They have embraced secularism as the new religion with a vengeance and have openly worked to demand the Christians who have deep seated religious and theological grounding simply cast that aside under the guise of “equality”. They are in complete disdain for significant parts of the Amendments to the Constitution and do so openly, and make a hero of the Supreme Court Justice who has openly and repeatedly indicated - and outright said - that the Constitution “needs to be re-written.”
In several States they have proposed bills which would strip the Church of a significant part of at least one sacrament.
And at this I will get off my soapbox.
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puer.dei
Guest
So, it’s not the innocent lives lost that concerns you, but losing a white majority.
I’ve got some really bad news for you – there’s no such thing.
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Camehome4john6
Guest
The problem is babies are being murdered. Full stop.
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redal
Guest
Some will, and some won’t.
Bigger question for Ms. Venker might be, “Is being Catholic and judging the salvation of others for anything just wrong?”
I think it is, but maybe that’s just me.
Tis_Bearself
Patron
As a Catholic adult with a conscience, I’m quite capable of deciding who I want to vote for without Ms. Venker or anybody else telling me what to do.
Crusader13
New member
Are you serious right now?!?!? How does that even factor in to the discussion? Since when did this become an issue of race!!
Crusader13
New member
The article was pretty insightful and I agree with the premise. I think over the last several decades both parties have come to embrace different ideologies as they relate to Christian morality.
Unfortunately, the Democratic Party has shown themselves to be opposed to those Christian ideals, with the exception of advocating for the poor. This they often fly under the banner of social justice and it becomes an umbrella of sorts, where they can mask all of their true agendas.
That’s why they try to spin the narrative by claiming they aren’t advocating for abortion, but instead they call it women’s rights. Unfortunately some Catholics buy into the social justice aspect and will claim that their conscience is clear because they are voting to help the poor and downtrodden, not necessarily for the right to choose.
Unfortunately, the Democratic Party has shown themselves to be opposed to those Christian ideals, with the exception of advocating for the poor. This they often fly under the banner of social justice and it becomes an umbrella of sorts, where they can mask all of their true agendas.
That’s why they try to spin the narrative by claiming they aren’t advocating for abortion, but instead they call it women’s rights. Unfortunately some Catholics buy into the social justice aspect and will claim that their conscience is clear because they are voting to help the poor and downtrodden, not necessarily for the right to choose.
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Tis_Bearself
Patron
Guys, RadTrad88 has started another very questionable topic on the forum, so best to just ignore/ flag inappropriate post and wait for the moderator to take action.
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JoeShlabotnik
Guest
So, because most of the Democratic Party candidates are in favor of letting women choose whether or not they will have an abortion, we should vote for candidates who are against social security, medicare, medicaid, affordable health care, a higher minimum wage, tax cuts for the middle and working class, sensible gun control laws, protecting our environment, etc.?
I am a Catholic. I am against abortion. But I will not vote for the party that only seems to care about white, rich, and well to do people, as opposed to the rest of us.
I am a Catholic. I am against abortion. But I will not vote for the party that only seems to care about white, rich, and well to do people, as opposed to the rest of us.
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pnewton
Guest
Proof-texting? Really. That Scripture has nothing to do with abortion. Luke 10:9-10
The really funny thing is the only possible political topic here is healthcare! But that is still not the point. It is the rejection of the Gospel, not abortion, that brings this judgement in this verse.
Oh, and the article? It is just a political ad. I never pay much attention to anyone who does not understand ecclesiology better than she does. The Church is not a political machine.
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Peeps
Guest
You are probably right–making abortion illegal will not stop abortion, any more than traffic laws stop people from speeding, or drug laws stop people from using drugs, or drunk-driving laws stop people from driving drunk.
So why don’t we get rid of all laws and just let people’s consciences direct their behavior?
Obviously that’s ridiculous.
Because we have a law that allows the killing of unborn people, our nation, the United States of America, is under God’s WRATH, and the only thing that is keeping our nation in existence is the prayers of millions of Christians and Jews who plead with God to have mercy on us.
Read the Old Testament and study what happened to nations who deliberately disobeyed God’s Ten Commandments–they were conquered and nothing remains but broken pottery covered with yards of sand. Their people are gone, and if they have any descendants, they are hidden among the polyglot of nationalities in the world today.
I’m 62, not old enough to be wise, but old enough to be worried. I honestly don’t think that God will wait forever for Americans to repent and make the heinous crime of abortion ILLEGAL. Yes, people will still have abortions, but at least they will no longer have the blessing and protection of law, and the fee paid by taxpayers who have, ironically, lost the “right to choose” to refuse to pay for murder of innocents.
Pray for us, Mary, Mother of God! All angels and saints, pray for the United States of America! Have mercy on us, Lord God.
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Peeps
Guest
No evidence is needed to support the establishment of a good and just law.
Abortion is evil, pure evil, and the nation that makes it legal and commands that taxpayers pay for it is evil.
Drunk driving is evil and selfish and in some cases, leads to the death of innocent people. It is currently illegal to drive drunk. But many people do it anyway–does this mean that the law should not exist, since people, even smart people who have the ability to call and pay for a cab or Uber, continue to drive under the influence?
Of course not. The law is just, whether people obey it or not.
The same goes for abortion laws–they should exist whether people obey them or not.
A person killed by a drunk driver has only the voice of law to speak for them and seek justice for those deprived of their loved one.
Likewise, making abortion illegal would give the unborn a voice that tells people, “I am a human being just like you, and this lawbreaker had me killed. There is no justice, but at least, there is recognition of my humanity and remembrance that for a short time, only a few weeks or months, I lived among my fellow human beings, hidden in a womb, but very much alive and very much human. Don’t forget about me, and please allow other unborn human beings to live and be born and reside among you.”
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Peeps
Guest
Boy, have you fallen for the Democratic line! Wow.
I don’t know where to start, and this isn’t the thread for it. I don’t think you would listen anyway.
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