The Insidious Creeping of the Gay Movement

[Elric]

I try and lives by the teachings of OUR Catholic Church, for starters.

By definition it deviates from the norm, so it is deviant behavior.

How can you know think it is deviant behavior? Don’t infer angst or hatred here simply because we are accurately labeling things.

I wasnt infering anything like that at all, I was aksing a question.

 

[Elric]

Becuase it is…

CCC 2357 Homosexuality refers to relations between men or between women who experience an exclusive or predominant sexual attraction toward persons of the same sex. It has taken a great variety of forms through the centuries and in different cultures. Its psychological genesis remains largely unexplained. Basing itself on Sacred Scripture, which presents homosexual acts as acts of grave depravity,141 tradition has always declared that "homosexual acts are intrinsically disordered."142 They are contrary to the natural law. They close the sexual act to the gift of life. They do not proceed from a genuine affective and sexual complementarity. Under no circumstances can they be approved.

I guess that tradition is always a good thing to base something on. What interperation of sacred scripture does this refer to?

 

[wifeandmomoftwo]

I guess that tradition is always a good thing to base something on. What interperation of sacred scripture does this refer to?

141 Cf. Gen 191-29; Rom 124-27; 1 Cor 6:10; 1 Tim 1:10.
142 CDF, Persona humana 8.

 

[mattyc4]

It simply amazes me the lack of personal accountability and responsibility some show. “Oh, I am allowed to discriminate and look down upon someone else’s lifestyle and I will because someone else told me to.” I am told it is immoral, so I can continue to deprive people of basic rights. Discrimination is not allowing others the same basic rights you have. You can wrap it up in soft terms if you like–but make no mistake what it really is.

What a weak argument for continued discrimination and hatred towards those who do not agree with mainstream christianity.
For a faith that has love thy neighbor as a major tenet, there seems to be extremely little effort to not belittle others whose lifestyle one might find questionable.

Out of all of Chrisitanity’s teachings, I believe this one will be the most polarizing for years to come.
Matt

 

[Sailor_Kenshin]

It simply amazes me the lack of personal accountability and responsibility some show. “Oh, I am allowed to discriminate and look down upon someone else’s lifestyle and I will because someone else told me to.” I am told it is immoral, so I can continue to deprive people of basic rights. Discrimination is not allowing others the same basic rights you have. You can wrap it up in soft terms if you like–but make no mistake what it really is.

What a weak argument for continued discrimination and hatred towards those who do not agree with mainstream christianity.
For a faith that has love thy neighbor as a major tenet, there seems to be extremely little effort to not belittle others whose lifestyle one might find questionable.

Out of all of Chrisitanity’s teachings, I believe this one will be the most polarizing for years to come.
Matt

Discrimination? Hatred?

So I take it you don’t believe that homosexuals have souls worth saving.

 

[wifeandmomoftwo]

It simply amazes me the lack of personal accountability and responsibility some show. **This goes both ways **

“Oh, I am allowed to discriminate and look down upon someone else’s lifestyle and I will because someone else told me to.” Who told me that homsexual acts are wrong/disorded…GOD. The church does not call for discrimination of gays…i have pointed that out to you. why do you ignore that fact??
I am told it is immoral, so I can continue to deprive people of basic rights. **what basic rights? Do you not have the right to life, shelter, food, clothing, medical care? No one is depriving you of basic rights. What you want are “special rights”.
** Discrimination is not allowing others the same basic rights you have.So you dont have the same basic rights as me? the basic rights and freedoms to which all humans are entitled, often held to include the right to life and liberty, freedom of thought and expression, and equality before the law You can wrap it up in soft terms if you like–but make no mistake what it really is. **What is it really? becuase as I have pointed out the Church and Catholics as directed by the church do not discriminate against gays. And as I have also pointed out you have the same “basic rights” as me. **

What a weak argument for continued discrimination and hatred towards those who do not agree with mainstream christianity.
For a faith that has love thy neighbor as a major tenet, there seems to be extremely little effort to not belittle others whose lifestyle one might find questionable. **Once again we love the sinner just not the sin. But that is not good enough for you I guess…you want us to embrace the sin too! Not gonna happen with this Catholic!
**

Out of all of Chrisitanity’s teachings, I believe this one will be the most polarizing for years to come. Your probably right!
Matt

 

[mattyc4]

Discrimination? Hatred?

So I take it you don’t believe that homosexuals have souls worth saving.

Did you understand what I wrote or did you just jump to conclusions?

I did not say anything about homosexuals not having souls worth saving. I simply believe that homosexuality is not a sin and you should stop using shoddy justification to shrug off personal accountability for your actions, thoughts, and beliefs.

Matt

 

[wifeandmomoftwo]

I did not say anything about homosexuals not having souls worth saving. I simply believe that homosexuality is not a sin and** you should stop using shoddy justification to shrug off personal accountability for your actions, thoughts, and beliefs.**

Matt

WOW Matt.
The Bible, the Catechism of the Catholic Church, are shoddy, WOW!

Matt,
If you dont like our documentation or beliefs why are you on a Catholic Forum?

 

[Sailor_Kenshin]

Did you understand what I wrote or did you just jump to conclusions?

I did not say anything about homosexuals not having souls worth saving. I simply believe that homosexuality is not a sin and you should stop using shoddy justification to shrug off personal accountability for your actions, thoughts, and beliefs.

Matt

Riiiiiiiiiiight. Shoddy justification as found in the Bible. So stupid of me!

 

[wifeandmomoftwo]

Riiiiiiiiiiight. Shoddy justification as found in the Bible. So stupid of me!

No Sailor you are mistaken it is not only you that is stupid but the whole Catholic, Orthodox Jewish, Muslim community!

 

[mattyc4]

wifeandmomoftwo:
Actually, your translation of the Bible told you that…not God. Basic rights include the right to marry, the right to hold hands in public without scorn, the right to visit your partner in the hospital. Those are the rights I speak of.
They are not special rights. They are equal rights. Yes, they can marry a member of the opposite gender, but that is equivalent to saying: You can wear jeans, provided they are size 32. it is the exact same reasoning behind each statement. They are not special rights, they are equal. You could marry a member of the same gender too, if same sex marriage was allowed, so it would apply to everyone; its not a special right.

Also, they do not have the right to freedom of expression. That would include the expression of love. Do they have the full ability to life, liberty, and a pursuit of happiness? No. Therefore, they do not have all the same rights that you do.

Regardless of whether you believe homosexuality as a sin or not, you should at least give them the respect to treat it with tolerance.

Matt

 

[mattyc4]

No Sailor you are mistaken it is not only you that is stupid but the whole Catholic, Orthodox Jewish, Muslim community!

At least you restrain yourselves from executing homosexuals. That is one point in Chrisitanity’s favor.
Not the whole catholic community either, there are many dissenting priests. etc.

Matt

 

[wifeandmomoftwo]

Actually, your translation of the Bible told you that…not God.Told me what? And whose message do you think is in the Bible, Satans? ** Basic rights include the right to marry, the right to hold hands in public without scorn, the right to visit your partner in the hospital. really? silly me I dont know where I got the idea that the basic rights were the basic rights and freedoms to which all humans are entitled, often held to include the right to life and liberty, freedom of thought and expression, and equality before the law** Those are the rights I speak of. You cant hold hands with your boyfriend? since when? You cant visit your boyfriend in the hospital? since when did hospitals do away with visiting hours?
They are not special rights. They are equal rights.** Well you said you wanted basic rights…so what is it? ** Yes, they can marry a member of the opposite gender, but that is equivalent to saying: You can wear jeans, provided they are size 32. it is the exact same reasoning behind each statement. They are not special rights, they are equal. You could marry a member of the same gender too, if same sex marriage was allowed, so it would apply to everyone; its not a special right.

Also, they do not have the right to freedom of expression. That would include the expression of love.** Really? ?
Do they have the full ability to life, liberty, and a pursuit of happiness? No. Therefore, they do not have all the same rights that you do. Sure they do…sorry that you dont see it.**

Regardless of whether you believe homosexuality as a sin or not, you should at least give them the respect to treat it with tolerance.** I dont have to tolerate a sin…**

Matt

 

[wifeandmomoftwo]

At least you restrain yourselves from executing homosexuals.** Was that called for Matty??**
That is one point in Chrisitanity’s favor.
Not the whole catholic community either, there are many dissenting priests. etc.

Matt

 

[J_G]

Wisconsin is not the US. Furthermore, and I think it’s most important: What is the Catholic Church doing to it’s part in being a Good Samaritan with Gay people? I think that is most relevant to us. This is not “Wisconsin Forums”, this is Catholic Forums. What has the Vatican ever done to defend gays? Where was the Vatican when gays have been bashed, killed and kicked around in the last 100 years? I know many Catholics have done a lot, but they’re called “liberals” and “cafeteria Catholics”. I find they’re acting more upon disgust and hatred than love. If you want them to be celibate, that’s great, but what if they don’t want to? Don’t let them participate in the Church, but why kick them out of society? Why “look the other way” or even fight against them when they don’t want to get fired etc?

Homophobe Catholics fail on the supreme Christian commandment, instead of trying to be role models in the one thing that distinguishes Christianity: Love!

Where is the Vatican doing this??? Where are those who tear their garment at gays doing this? The Catholics who do love gay people are doing their part for the kingdom of God ALONE.

Food for thought.

You’re right that Wisconsin isn’t the US. Wisconsin was the first one to pass anti-discrimination laws for gays; however, WI also passed a same-sex marriage-ban amendment in their constitution.
Hate the sin but love the sinner. No true Christian can hate a homosexual, murderer, or a thief, but they can hate the sin. And like the Samaritan, we must love our enemies because Christ says so, but we cannot help them to sin (sin by being accessory to another’s sin, by being silent and by defense of the ill done).

 

[mattyc4]

wifeandmomoftwo:
Hey, that was a compliment. Also, for the record, I am not gay, but I do not consider it an insult that you said I was.

Matt

 

[mattyc4]

wifeandmomoftwo:
You have the correct rights, yet gays do not get the full use of them. Only immediate family is, in some circumstances, allowed to visit the patient. The partner would not count. That is a right gays do not have. How do gays have equality before the law? It is still legal in some places to be fired for being gay. You cannot marry your loved one.

I expect you to love your neighbor, whether you disagree with his benevolent lifestyle or not.

Matt

 

[Elric]

WOW Matt.
The Bible, the Catechism of the Catholic Church, are shoddy, WOW!

I wouldnt be as quick to say that if I were you. The bible may not actually support what you think it does (I will repy to your other post soon, if you want me to).

Matt,
If you dont like our documentation or beliefs why are you on a Catholic Forum?

Because it is an open forum that invites non-chathloics to join and take part?

 

[Tim_Kirchoff]

Actually, your translation of the Bible told you that…not God. Basic rights include the right to marry, the right to hold hands in public without scorn, the right to visit your partner in the hospital. Those are the rights I speak of.
They are not special rights. They are equal rights. Yes, they can marry a member of the opposite gender, but that is equivalent to saying: You can wear jeans, provided they are size 32. it is the exact same reasoning behind each statement. They are not special rights, they are equal. You could marry a member of the same gender too, if same sex marriage was allowed, so it would apply to everyone; its not a special right.

Also, they do not have the right to freedom of expression. That would include the expression of love. Do they have the full ability to life, liberty, and a pursuit of happiness? No. Therefore, they do not have all the same rights that you do.

Regardless of whether you believe homosexuality as a sin or not, you should at least give them the respect to treat it with tolerance.

Matt

NO! I proved this wrong some time ago. Walking around without pants on is not socially acceptable-- being single is! Revise the analogy!

Maybe something that doesn’t have to do with pants!

(And people can survive without wearing jeans- there are slacks, kilts )

 

[jssaxon]

GrassTopsUSA Exclusive Commentary
By Rosemary Scheetz
12-01-07

For all of the talk about “Gay Pride,” the Gay Movement has a very insidious, snake-like method of gaining, or in fact, forcing, acceptance and “equal rights.”

It seems that they are unable to take on their opponents in a direct and fair way, so they attack with sneaky, underhanded methods. They don’t come out in the open and discuss their issues, they choose to use threats of lawsuits and other means to try and scare possible opponents into submission.

A recent example was at Georgetown University, where they finally forced the university, which is run by Jesuits, to fully fund a center for lesbian, gay, bisexual, transgender, and students seeking to discover their sexual orientation.

grasstopsusa.com/rs120107.html

You call this “insidious”? I would, rather, term it “overt”. The Gays are rich and they are trying to strong arm the rest of us into accepting them. They are rich and powerful and have tons of influence and clout.