Time and Starlight

  • Thread starter Thread starter Hope1960
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
Hope1960 said:
40.png
HopkinsReb:
Ok. So, again, why would the niceness of the Lutheran pastor factor into your decision regarding whether to accept or reject the scientific consensus on the age of the universe?
Click to expand...
I thought that he (and another guy on staff) might be right and that maybe I’ve been wrong all along.
Click to expand...
But why does their being nice lead you to that conclusion? If Jimmy the really nice organist came up to me and told me that the world sprung into being twenty minutes before I was born, should I take that claim seriously?
 
I guess it’s bettertostop going to the LCMS rather than have to always explain my beliefs.
 
Oh, well. I should totally ignore anything they write even though some of it is true? Some of it is verifiable? I do research as part of my job. I can’t afford to add unverifiable information to anything.

I pay no money to read ICR and AIG. So, it’s not about money or that I believe every word. Like some fringe subjects I study, some provide information I see nowhere else that can be verified. I can’t tell you how many times history has been revised using good information.
 
HopkinsReb said:
But why does their being nice lead you to that conclusion? If Jimmy the really nice organist came up to me and told me that the world sprung into being twenty minutes before I was born, should I take that claim seriously?
Click to expand...
No, but I do know that Lutheran pastors have a lot of education, and I assume he’s smart.
 
It’s better to figure out why it is you keep church-hopping and changing your beliefs so much. What’s the underlying cause? To discuss creationism or exciting sermons or any of that is all peripheral. This isn’t a theological issue. You need to figure out what’s going on within you that makes you keep jumping around.

-Fr ACEGC
 
What is true exactly? The whole stated aim of both groups is to basically throw out any science that disagrees with their literal interpretation of Genesis.
 
Hope1960 said:
40.png
HopkinsReb:
But why does their being nice lead you to that conclusion? If Jimmy the really nice organist came up to me and told me that the world sprung into being twenty minutes before I was born, should I take that claim seriously?
Click to expand...
No, but I do know that Lutheran pastors have a lot of education, and I assume he’s smart.
Click to expand...
That seems, on the face of it, to be an unwarranted assumption.
 
Hope1960 said:
I guess it’s bettertostop going to the LCMS rather than have to always explain my beliefs.
Click to expand...
I’m curious, since you have brought it up. It doesn’t seem like the theology of these churches is the primary reason you are considering them. I mean, you said you are looking at an LCMS church, and a UCC church. Although both are probably technically “mainstream” christian sects, they are pretty far apart in their teachings. So it seems you are mostly looking for a community, and not as concerned about the theological underpinnings. Is that right? If so, how much does the YEC thing matter to you?

Even so, I think you could find a church that provides a good community without having to accept things you don’t believe. And if you are really just looking for a better community, there are plenty of Catholic parishes that can provide that, just saying.
 
And what? Scientific research automatically stops? There is a list of religions in this country and a summary of what they believe. I can only say that some have odd beliefs. There is a Creation Museum. I watched a video as some unidentified people stood outside and shook their heads, followed by a few non-specific remarks like “This is not good.” One specific remark was “If this gets into the schools, I’ll sue.” So, what is the issue?
 
TMC said:
I’m curious, since you have brought it up. It doesn’t seem like the theology of these churches is the primary reason you are considering them. I mean, you said you are looking at an LCMS church, and a UCC church. Although both are probably technically “mainstream” christian sects, they are pretty far apart in their teachings. So it seems you are mostly looking for a community, and not as concerned about the theological underpinnings. Is that right? If so, how much does the YEC thing matter to you?

Even so, I think you could find a church that provides a good community without having to accept things you don’t believe. And if you are really just looking for a better community, there are plenty of Catholic parishes that can provide that, just saying.
Click to expand...
No, I do want a church that believes what I believe (old earth, theistic evolution) but a better community and a church that holds my attention. The last two are absent from every Catholic Church I tried, with the exception of one, but I don’t like it, it looks like a funeral parlor.
 
I would disagree. They have done enough research to tell me about science and where it may have gone astray. And it’s not just about quoting the Bible.
 
They haven’t done any research. Quote mining and creating a series of boiler plate nonsense articles is not research, not in the scientific sense. You seem to like them, so bravo, but what they do is not science.
 
edwest said:
In the book, Benedict reflected on a 1996 comment of his predecessor, John Paul II, who said that Charles Darwin’s theories on evolution were sound, as long as they took into account that creation was the work of God, and that Darwin’s theory of evolution was “more than a hypothesis.”
Click to expand...
Exactly right. A+
edwest said:
“The pope (John Paul) had his reasons for saying this,” Benedict said. “But it is also true that the theory of evolution is not a complete, scientifically proven theory.”
Click to expand...
Exactly right. A+
edwest said:
Benedict added that the immense time span that evolution covers made it impossible to conduct experiments in a controlled environment to finally verify or disprove the theory.
Click to expand...
Not even wrong as you well know. Please see me after class.
 
Hope1960 said:
but a better community and a church that holds my attention. The last two are absent from every Catholic Church I tried, with the exception of one, but I don’t like it, it looks like a funeral parlor.
Click to expand...
Which, again, is the whole point. None of this has anything to do with beliefs, and it has everything to do with things quite peripheral to faith.

What if you found a Catholic Church that had these things? Would that satisfy you? If so, then your priorities vis-a-vis faith are a bit backward. We should seek the truth, and not what excites us or makes us feel good. I say Mass every day. Rarely is it exciting, rarely does it move my emotions. It’s simply what I must do. And yet it satisfies me on a far deeper level than anything more exciting emotionally could.

So again, what is keeping you from seeing it in these terms? If you find God himself, who is truth, and the truth that he has revealed, then it shouldn’t matter how good a community or how engaging the sermons are. Still less should it matter if people line up with your beliefs (or validate them, as you constantly seem to be seeking on here)–your beliefs will rather line up with the truth, which is how it’s supposed to be.

I might sound a bit harsh, but I really am very concerned, and I think the endless discussion of issues quite peripheral to what’s really going on is not going to help you, Hope. I really think you need to examine why you keep searching, endlessly, in this way, and not settling on what’s really true. Everything you’ve brought up is about you and your feelings and what agrees with you. Did you not think it might be the other way around?

I am praying for your healing. I really hope you find some peace. I think everyone else would do well to stop feeding this discussion, since it’s not truly helpful. The real problem here has nothing to do with creationism or any other belief.

-Fr ACEGC
 
edward_george1 said:
It’s better to figure out why it is you keep church-hopping and changing your beliefs so much. What’s the underlying cause? To discuss creationism or exciting sermons or any of that is all peripheral. This isn’t a theological issue. You need to figure out what’s going on within you that makes you keep jumping around
Click to expand...
I don’t really keep church hopping. Been Catholic for 13 years, and 24 years after that, with a bunch of time (years) not going to church at all.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top