Time and Starlight

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Hodos said:
Personally, as I get older I have made peace with a six day creation because, heck, its God, and when it comes down to it, I absolutely believe what the Bible says about Christ, about the salvation of man, and the redemption of the creation. I don’t believe you have to check your brain at the door though to be in any denomination. I hope that helps.
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That’s what I was beginning to think, too, until I came here with this question. Now I’m leaning back toward my original position.
 
Hope1960 said:
That’s what I was beginning to think, too, until I came here with this question. Now I’m leaning back toward my original position.
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Back and forth I go. When you’ve got some time can you watch the video I linked to in Post# 21?

I tried to take notes on it last night but I don’t think my notes do the video justice. My notes are in posts # 48 and #50.
 
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I think the better and more important question has nothing to do with those particular beliefs, and is rather why you keep going back and forth. Especially when boredom with Mass–“nothing except Communion”–is a factor. This is not a problem of head knowledge, but heart knowledge. Why the restlessness?

-Fr ACEGC
 
edward_george1 said:
This is not a problem of head knowledge, but heart knowledge. Why the restlessness?
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Honestly? Because I LOVE this new church but was swayed back to my original thoughts about an old earth by the opinions on science of those here.
 
No, what I’m getting at is why you went there to begin with. Why would you pass up the Eucharist, the Body and Blood of Jesus Christ, to go somewhere more exciting to the emotions? Why the change?
 
I’m just not interested anymore. And haven’t been for months.
 
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Hope1960 said:
That’s what I was beginning to think, too, until I came here with this question. Now I’m leaning back toward my original position.
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I do the same. Ultimately, I don’t need to know all the answers. I need to know Christ. I am good with that.
 
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The Lord is there waiting for you. His presence is with his Church whether you are interested or not. I pray that you may find healing from whatever is keeping you. This is very distressing. We seem to hear from you with some regularity that you’ve gotten bored and left the Church. You come here and seek validation for your new beliefs, and end up confused or right back where you started.

What’s really behind that though? Why aren’t you interested? And why the back and forth? Again, I’m extremely concerned for you. I hope and pray that you find peace in the truth.
 
Hope1960 said:
I’m just not interested anymore. And haven’t been for months.
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Why do you think your own interest level is the important factor? The way you talk about churches you’d think you were discussing which movie to see. “Oh, that one looks kinda boring. Let’s see the one with all the CGI special effects.”

Whether you are entertained is not really the right criteria. If you want to be entertained, that’s fine. Go see a movie or go to a concert. But it’s just the wrong way to pick a church. This fundamentally isn’t about whether the music is trendy or the pastor is a great speaker or whatever.

Why do you crave novelty so much? Why does something being familiar make you lose interest? You mentioned being married, so I assume you don’t feel “bored” by your husband just because he’s the same guy he was yesterday. Hopefully you wouldn’t leave him because some sexier, more exciting new guy came along and offered a lot of empty song and dance.

This would be way less troubling if you just said “I’m leaving Catholicism because I’ve become convinced Lutheranism is true.” Id disagree with you, but at least that’s a real reason. You’re just saying Lutheranism is more entertaining. That’s a fine criteria when you’re deciding which tv show to watch, but not when you’re trying to understand your own relation to God.
 
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No offense but wouldn’t that be enough what could possibly be better then that.
 
Hodos said:
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HopkinsReb:
He was not stating what Lutherans believe they have. He was stating what Lutherans have.
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No he wasn’t. The fact of the matter is that the efficacy of the Eucharist is not dependent upon the one administering it. The entire claim of how only the Roman Catholic Church receives the real body and blood of Christ is based on a facetious reading of Ignatius Epistle to the Church in Smyna to begin with. As Paul demonstrates in 1 Corinthians, if you administer the sacrament even in an unworthy manner, you have still received the sacrament. Christ remains faithful to his promise even if we don’t. This understanding of the sacraments was confirmed during the Donatist and Novatianist periods. That being said, we celebrate the Eucharist, and Christ is truly present.
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Then let me rephrase: the Catholic priest on this Catholic forum was stating the Catholic view of the what the Lutherans have, not the Lutheran view of what the Lutherans have.

I’m sorry if you’re bothered by that. But you did choose to be a member of a Catholic forum, so it should neither surprise nor offend you to find people here claiming that a church that lacks apostolic succession lacks the Eucharist.
 
Hope1960 said:
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Hope1960:
That’s what I was beginning to think, too, until I came here with this question. Now I’m leaning back toward my original position.
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Back and forth I go. When you’ve got some time can you watch the video I linked to in Post# 21?

I tried to take notes on it last night but I don’t think my notes do the video justice. My notes are in posts # 48 and #50.
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I don’t watch AIG videos because, as has been said, they have been debunked so many times I really don’t need to waste my time listening to their nonsense every time someone posts a link. You really don’t need to listen to every flat earth video or an interview with someone who has been abducted by aliens ‘just in case’. Spend enough time investigating them and you reach a point where you know what’s coming and it it’s always the same ol’ same ol’.

But I watched a few minutes of your link. And gee, whaddyaknow. It’s the same ol’ same ol’.

Not eight minutes in, the guy gives a few premises which we must accept before he continues. And the second one is that God created the universe supernaturally. Hang on…wasn’t that the reason for the investigation? To see if there was some proof that it WAS created by supernatural means? And we have to accept the conclusion BEFORE we start the investigation?

Thanks. But no thanks.
 
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AiG has been eating its own tail for about a quarter century now. I remember in my early heady days on Usenet some scientists put a considerable amount of effort in to debunking most of the main claims. I’m disappointed to see any Lutheran organization using them as some sort of authority on anything, other than as an example of stupidity and dishonesty.
 
I’m not convinced Lutheranism is true but I think it’s a possibility. Also, consubstantiation (I don’t think Lutherans call it that anymore) has often made more sense to me than Transubstantiation.
 
Fair enough. Let’s imagine you become fully convinced of the truth of Lutheranism, but then one day your Lutheran Church seems dull. It’s not the exciting new thing anymore, now it’s just the same thing, week after week. Do you leave, chasing the high of the shiny new thing, forever?

My point is if your goal is “entertainment” then this cycle never ends. I don’t care if you think a certain movie is the greatest film ever made; once you’ve seen it 500 times, it will become boring.

Just chase truth, even if that truth isn’t the flashiest thing around. If you find yourself bored and distracted, accept that as your cross to bear in that moment. You’ll waste your life chasing that feeling of “newness.”
 
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I don’t think I’ll get bored. It just suits me better. I left Catholicism for about 24 years once before and never really checked out many other options during that time
 
Hope1960 said:
For those who believe in a young earth, how do you explain starlight that we can see, being described by astronomers as millions of light years away?

I’ve read several explanations that were problematic and one by Barry Setterfield that could be promising but that went way over my head. Thoughts?
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The most tenable explanation for YEC is that God purposely created the universe in a way to make it look like it was billions of years old when it actually isn’t. So everything from starlight to fossils to geography to our DNA is made to look like it has origins going very far back in time when really it isn’t.

There are no coherent explanations using any sort of investigative tools because the movement is silly.
 
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