Ukraine

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M-Dent said:
With your experience – what’s your opinion of the below quote (not sure if it’s by John Pike or someone else) at Globalsecurity.org?

“Russia without the Ukraine is a country; Russia with Ukraine is an empire.”
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Russia without Ukraine is still an empire. There are dozens, it not over 100, non-Russian ethnic groups within the borders of post-USSR Russia.
 
Are you going back to pre Norman? I was speaking generally of post John Redmond, of whom I am a neice. Of couse they voted for home rule. Ireland for the Irish. And if you are ethnically English in their borders, you choose where your home is. WwI upset the applecart.

This may be a new thread or a PM because that goes on a tangent away from the current events in Ukraine.
 
So you think the movement whose goal it is to move closer to Europe, join NATO, etc. is really a fascist movement? Are you saying you support the Russian invasion of Ukraine?

Ishii
 
ishii said:
So you think the movement whose goal it is to move closer to Europe, join NATO, etc. is really a fascist movement? Are you saying you support the Russian invasion of Ukraine?

Ishii
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When did Russia invade Ukraine?
 
I edited my post and would welcome a new thread our PM to continue this.

As it stands, the parallels of imperialism stay the same: stock the pond with your own fish,.and when the native fish revolt, take away their pond.
 
Uh, it was the scenario we planned for during the cold war. ( I’m speaking of the first film. Not the sham filmed here in Detroit)

Coming from a small nation who never aspired to be anything more than free. You should feel some empathy for the Ukrainians.

ATB
 
From The Guardian

Merkel to Putin: Russia breached international law

Russia’s president, Vladimir Putin, has accepted a proposal by the German chancellor, Angel Merkel, to set up a “fact-finding mission” that would pave the way for some form of political dialogue in the crisis.

That’s according to a spokesperson for the German government, who has been giving Germany’s account of a conversation earlier between the two leaders.

The mission would possibly to be led by the Organisation for Security and Co-operation in Europe. Merkel is also said to have accused Putin of an “unacceptable Russian intervention” and of breaching international law.

Medvedev: Russia 'ready to develop ties with Ukraine’

Russia’s Prime Minister, Dmitry Medvedev, says that Russia is ready to develop ties with Ukraine, “but not with those who seized power through bloodshed”.

Medvedev also said that Viktor Yanukovych - who fled to Russia last week after being ousted as Ukraine’s president last week, although Yanukovych maintains that he was “ousted” - is Ukraine’s legitimate head of state under the country’s constitution.

That said, Medvedev added that Yanukovych’s authority is “practically non-existent”. This is coming through from the Russian Interfax new agency.

Russian PM: Kiev government will fall in "new revolution"

The rule of Ukraine’s new leaders will “end with a new revolution” amid more bloodshed, Russia’s Prime Minister Dimitry Medvedev has predicted.

In a Facebook post, he accused the new government in Kiev of “seizing power”, adding that while Viktor Yanukovich had practically no authority, he remained the legitimate head of state according the constitution.
Medvedev said:
If he is guilty before Ukraine - hold an impeachment procedure … and try him. Everything else is lawlessness. The seizure of power, and that means such order will be extremely unstable. It will end in a new revolution. New blood.
 
Poland is moving military units to border with Ukraine. Polish Defense Minister Tomasz Siemoniak: Troop movements in Poland routine, not related to Russia invasion of Crimea. Remember, Russia did the same right before it invaded, so this is significant.
 
This is not much of an “invasion” if Russia is sticking to the Crimea and most the people there support Russia’s actions
 
British Foreign Secretary William Hague who is in Kiev today: “Have met a wide range of Ukrainian political leaders in Kyiv tonight. Violation of Ukraine’s sovereignty unacceptable”
Discussed with UN Sec General need for a peaceful diplomatic process to prevent escalation of Ukraine crisis. UN has important role to play." (twitter feed)

David Cameron: Because of the serious situation in Ukraine, William Hague & I believe it would be wrong for UK Ministers to attend the Sochi Paralympics. (twitter feed)
 
So Gilliam I am sure you also opposed the US invasion of Afghanistan and Iraq, right?

right?
 
JordanJD said:
So Gilliam I am sure you also opposed the US invasion of Afghanistan and Iraq, right?

right?
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Apples and Oranges. Did Ukraine’s government ally with terrorists who attacked Russia killing thousands? Afghanistan’s govt. did.

Ishii
 
ishii said:
Apples and Oranges. Did Ukraine’s government ally with terrorists who attacked Russia killing thousands? Afghanistan’s govt. did.

Ishii
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Afghanistan had zero control over Al-Qeda, the Taliban govt. even at it’s peak controlled only half the country.

So Russia isn’t allowed to deal with problems on it’s own border yet for some reason it’s OK for the US to invade and occupy the whole country of Iraq on the other side of the world under totally false pretenses.

No wonder Putin is giving western hypocrites the middle finger
 
Also US government officials have admitted two things: That Russia’s presence in Crimea has been uncontested and that all military units there are only in self-defense posture. But I guess these facts won’t stop the minority fascist thugs in Kiev from sending out “Our whole country is now being invaded by Russia” telegrams to which the sheepish progressive western media will blindly keep shoving in all our faces on every news outlet
 
theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/mar/02/not-too-late-for-ukraine-nato-should-back-off

*"Nato should refrain from interfering in Ukraine by word or deed. The fact that it insists on getting engaged reveals the elephant in the room: underlying the crisis in Crimea and Russia’s fierce resistance to potential changes is Nato’s undisguised ambition to continue two decades of expansion into what used to be called “post-Soviet space”, led by Bill Clinton and taken up by successive administrations in Washington.

At the back of Pentagon minds, no doubt, is the dream that a US navy will one day replace the Russian Black Sea fleet in the Crimean ports of Sevastopol and Balaclava."*
 
Dissolving NATO would be a good first step towards peace with Russia.
 
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