Where are all the large Catholic families?

[fpt]

For understanding the different situations between OM (OF) and EM (EF), we need to take in consideration the very different points of view concerning:

The ends of marriage and the hierarchy of those ends with the effects;
The interpretation of Humanae Vitae on NFP and on the responsible procreation;
The definition of serious or grave reasons for avoiding a baby or spacing pregnancy;
The roles of wife in the family;
The point of view on the conjugal debt (the right on the body): the unilateral refusal of marital act.

These topics are important for understanding where are the large family.

 

[babochka]

I know this wasn’t directed at me, but I’m gonna answer anyway. There is a daily EF Mass available about 20 min drive away from our parish church in a beautiful church with marble pillars, altar rails, the whole shebang. That doesn’t change the fact that there are still plenty of larger families at this non-traditionalist parish, so its not just a matter that they don’t have a more traditional Mass/Church available to them.

I didn’t mean to imply that large (or small) faithful Catholic families would all flock to a traditionalist parish, if only they had the opportunity. As a Byzantine rite Catholic, I don’t really consider myself a “traditionalist” as it is commonly understood. As a homeschooling mom in a community with a vibrant FSSP parish, I have noticed that many large families are attracted to the FSSP parish because of the other large and like-minded families. The same is true of the OF parish with the school that is staffed by the Sisters of Mary, Mother of the Eucharist. I’ve seen it over and over. A newly married couple with one or two or three children will start at at their local parish. As their family grows, they find themselves more and more gravitating toward one of these two parishes because their large family is normal and the parish events are kid-friendly and the expectation is that you’ve got a whole bunch of little ones running around. It is so much easier to have a large family when you are surrounded by other large families.

 

[thewanderer]

I didn’t mean to imply that large (or small) faithful Catholic families would all flock to a traditionalist parish, if only they had the opportunity. As a Byzantine rite Catholic, I don’t really consider myself a “traditionalist” as it is commonly understood. As a homeschooling mom in a community with a vibrant FSSP parish, I have noticed that many large families are attracted to the FSSP parish because of the other large and like-minded families. The same is true of the OF parish with the school that is staffed by the Sisters of Mary, Mother of the Eucharist. I’ve seen it over and over. A newly married couple with one or two or three children will start at at their local parish. As their family grows, they find themselves more and more gravitating toward one of these two parishes because their large family is normal and the parish events are kid-friendly and the expectation is that you’ve got a whole bunch of little ones running around. It is so much easier to have a large family when you are surrounded by other large families.

I see what you are saying, yes, it makes sense that the larger families would all start moving to the parish nearby with other large families, leaving the rest of the parishes with few such families. That definately makes sense to me.

 

[hwriggles4]

I do attend Mass in the OF, and my parish has a good pastor and a newly ordained parochial vicar who are outstanding. The liturgy is pretty good, and the tabernacle is inside the sanctuary. We have a fairly active Respect Life Committee, a school, a Knights of Columbus Council, a Boy Scout Troop, etc. Both priests do good jobs on preaching that include catechesis, and both these priests are “manly”. Family size varies (we don’t know people’s situations as I discussed earlier), but I will say quite a few families with parents under 45 have 3 or more children.

For the record, a good friend of mine and his wife have 2 children on earth, and 4 more in heaven. Again, we don’t know people’s situations, so don’t assume families with only two children are contracepting.

The lines for confession on Thursday nights and Saturday mornings are fairly long too at my parish. Thursday nights go at least 90 minutes, and Saturday morning Mass is well attended.

The point is: Today’s Catholics tend to shop to find a parish. Sometimes the differences between parishes are like “night and day”. I would say shopping for a parish is easier in a larger city. Parish boundaries are either gone or ignored.

In addition, many of our Protestant bretheren “church shop”. I have a Baptist friend who changed churches because he and his wife wanted to be around younger families, and I have a Methodist friend who changed churches because the one he was attending kept asking for money. I have a non-denominational co-worker who attends a church where she and her husband have a core group of young adults. Catholics go where they feel comfortable too.

I would also say thatI have been impressed with many of the newly ordained priests over the last 10 years too. That’s part of the JPII influence. I’m also impressed with several of the “later vocations” and converts.

 

[Crescentinus]

That’s easy.
Go east, and there you will find them.

 

[maryjk]

I see what you are saying, yes, it makes sense that the larger families would all start moving to the parish nearby with other large families, leaving the rest of the parishes with few such families. That definately makes sense to me.

Could be.

Our parish is literally the only one in town. So people aren’t shopping for one that has large families. It is basically, if you live here, you go here.

 

[thewanderer]

Could be.

Our parish is literally the only one in town. So people aren’t shopping for one that has large families. It is basically, if you live here, you go here.

I’m not claiming it always happens, just saying that I could see that being the case in some places. Its not really true where I am either, there are some large families that go to the Church 20 min. down the road, whether for EF or OF (it offers both), and some stay at the local parish.

 

[sainthumbert]

That’s easy.
Go east, and there you will find them.

Crescentinus - Can you tell us more about why so many Catholic families in the Philippines choose to have large families? Is it fidelity to Church teachings, cultural love of family, or something else? Do those families who do not practice the faith also generally have large families? Thanks.

 

[aaronlgates]

Sadly they seem to be in the non denominational evangelical churches. We are expecting #8 in January and #1 turned 13 a few weeks ago. We feel like freaks in ANY Catholic parish we attend in this area(we’ve attended a dozen or so in a 50 mile radius)… Even the SSPX chapel. We’re converts and we are pretty confused by now.

 

[mummymac]

We have 4 kids and to be honest I am terrified of having more, I know we are so blessed as everything has always went so well with pregnancy and labour. We have the most children out of all our friends and we always feel like we are being judged. My husband works so hard and I have the ultimate honour of being a stay at home mum We both want more children and our kids want more siblings, we want to put all our faith in God and whatever he has in store for us but struggle with society judging us. We live in Scotland, UK and no matter what Chaple we attend we always have the largest family which is so sad, as we have found generally its because they think they couldn’t cope. Our children are our pride and joy! We are only 29 so God willingly we WILL have more

 

[Crescentinus]

Crescentinus - Can you tell us more about why so many Catholic families in the Philippines choose to have large families? Is it fidelity to Church teachings, cultural love of family, or something else? Do those families who do not practice the faith also generally have large families? Thanks.

I think it’s due to all both factors as you had said above. Even non-Catholic families do have large families because of my people’s cultural love of family. That is something which is almost gone now in the West and in certain parts of the Far East.

 

[St_Donatus]

We have 4 kids and to be honest I am terrified of having more, I know we are so blessed as everything has always went so well with pregnancy and labour. We have the most children out of all our friends and we always feel like we are being judged. My husband works so hard and I have the ultimate honour of being a stay at home mum We both want more children and our kids want more siblings, we want to put all our faith in God and whatever he has in store for us but struggle with society judging us. We live in Scotland, UK and no matter what Chaple we attend we always have the largest family which is so sad, as we have found generally its because they think they couldn’t cope. Our children are our pride and joy! We are only 29 so God willingly we WILL have more

Good for you. You and your husband are a shining star and example. Remember that it seems that whenever we are doing what is right, the devil is there to try to trip you up. Do you ever tell your friends that you would rather do things the way God wants you to do them than the way the devil does? I know that sounds harsh but they need to realize that they are the ones doing the wrong thing. Jesus Christ even told us that if the world loves you, you are doing something wrong. He said that we need to be no part of the world. This is an example of why. As the world drifts farther and farther from God, we need to shun the worlds practices and attitude even more.

As far as the influence of society judging you, I feel for you. Thankfully, I belong to a Latin mass church and the pressure is the other way. Everyone looks up to those that have large families. Thankfully, we don’t look down on those that don’t have children or have small families since we all know how difficult it is to have children these days. So many women are unable to get pregnant today.

Anyway, I hope you find a Catholic church that is more Godly. Yes, I said more Godly. God and the Catholic Church require us to allow his will to determine how many children you have. It is our desire for possessions and recreation that cause the less spiritual to stop God’s desires, that block his joining of just the right ingredients to make that unique and wonderful child.

But in my mind, this attitude that you keep getting from others about having four children is an evil attitude. I see this type of attitude in many US Catholics and they wonder why their children don’t stay in the Church. Could it be that they are following the example of their parents? I witnessed a perfect example of this attitude this weekend. We had a ‘Chain of Life’ event at the local Abortion Clinic. Basically, we were asked by the Bishop to all take part in this event that only takes an hour and a half. We all had signs promoting LIFE and condemning abortion. There are two parishes in the city where my parish is. One is the regular Catholic parish with the mass in English and one is our Latin Mass parish. Our Latin Mass Parish has about 400 members. The English mass parish has about 5,000 members. At the event, we had 70 taking part in the anti-abortion event while the English mass parish had only about 20 taking part. Yes, 20% of our parish took part and less than .5% of the other took part. This tells something about the spirituality of the members of the two parishes. Our parish honors God and the life he gives us in every way.

It really concerns me how so many Catholics are become molded by the society around them. The devils influence surrounds us. It is in the media, our friends, the government, business, everywhere. True Christians are become more and more isolated and looked down upon, even by other Christians. It seems as if it is becoming like the days of the early Christians. But remember that God blesses us for following his will. He blessed the early Christians and Saints with spiritual contentment. While the society was falling apart around them, they were contented in the fact that God was blessing them both spiritually and mentally.

May God bless you as you do Gods will.

 

[Denise1957]

Sadly they seem to be in the non denominational evangelical churches. We are expecting #8 in January and #1 turned 13 a few weeks ago. We feel like freaks in ANY Catholic parish we attend in this area(we’ve attended a dozen or so in a 50 mile radius)… Even the SSPX chapel. We’re converts and we are pretty confused by now.

God bless you for being open to life in having so many children. I’m sorry to hear that you feel like freaks in all the churches you’ve attended, even the SSPX chapel (they, too, should know better, but attitudes do vary in SSPX chapels).

There should be some sort of support group for large Catholic families.

I found this article, which may offer a little support for your situation, though maybe its been posted already on this thread. It’s about a large Catholic family, and the parents are converts.

catholicworldreport.com/Item/1525/The_Blessing_of_Big_Families.aspxly

It’s looks like the above link isn’t working, so try this one instead:

oldtimecatholic.com/category/uncategorized/

 

[Elisabeth51]

Now, my wife and I have 8 children and in our (very traditional) parish that is about the average. For every family with less than 8 children there is one with more than 8. There’s even a few with 10, 11, 12 +etc.

(And yes I’m talking about a SSPX parish, but I really don’t want to start another SSPX fight)

However, outside the parish when people ask about my family they are amazed, some even horrified, at the number of children we have, even Catholics. And to be honest I am a bit surprised by the reaction from other Catholics. Quite often it is “well I’m a Catholic too but my 2, or 3, children are more than enough for me”. Often they will tell me that they are one of 5 or 6 siblings themselves, or their parents were one of 8 or 9 siblings, but they only have the one child, or 2, or 3.

So, where are all the traditionally large Catholic families? What is happening with the “modern” Catholic family? Have they disobeyed the Church’s teachings on contraception? Is there a reluctance to accept God’s will when it comes to the number of children He gives us? Or have they just become super experts on natural family planning?

I’ve been curious about this for awhile now. In a way I feel it is a bit sad as it seems yet another way that Catholics are losing their identity.

Any thoughts or comments, or am I mostly mistaken? How are things where you live?

I’d be happy to have a large family, but that would require a husband and I’ve never even had a boyfriend, so for me, the problem is lack of single Catholic men who are willing to think about someone other than themselves, allow themselves to be loved…or something, stop being afraid of relationships??? I’ve always been happily willing to be a wife and mom to as many kids as God wants me to have.

All I hear in intercessions during the week or on the weekend is prayer for vocations to priesthood and religious life----wonderful things, for sure! and God let me know that was not my path, but how about some prayer for vocation to marriage and family life and hearts and minds open to God’s will even if it looks different from what they think it should be? At my age, I hear a lot of people acting like there’s a magic cut off–45 you’re dead and can’t possibly marry…my oldest sister married the first time at 50, God’s plan happens when He wants, not when “you” think it should, so it would be nice if people were more open minded, I don’t think that because I’m over 35 I should just sit here and go, oh well, can’t get married and have kids now, one foot in the grave, just hang it up…it would be super to hear more prayers for the vocation to marriage and family life!!!

 

[Walking_Home]

Originally Posted by sainthumbert
Crescentinus - Can you tell us more about why so many Catholic families in the Philippines choose to have large families? Is it fidelity to Church teachings, cultural love of family, or something else? Do those families who do not practice the faith also generally have large families? Thanks.

---

I believe I read somewhere – that in Philippine culture --machismo is still prevalent --and the large families is the result of men showing off – how “virile” they are. Also many, many children and women – end up in the streets and the sex trade.

 

[Crescentinus]

I believe I read somewhere – that in Philippine culture --machismo is still prevalent --and the large families is the result of men showing off – how “virile” they are. Also many, many children and women – end up in the streets and the sex trade.

So what are you trying to insinuate?

 

[Walking_Home]

Walking_Home:

I believe I read somewhere – that in Philippine culture --machismo is still prevalent --and the large families is the result of men showing off – how “virile” they are. Also many, many children and women – end up in the streets and the sex trade.

So what are you trying to insinuate?

---

I’m saying – large families are not necessarily an indicator of a healthy culture for children and women.

 

[Crescentinus]

I’m saying – large families are not necessarily an indicator of a healthy culture for children and women.

Now, we’re clear.
And here’s my response to this:
Oh boy, not this type of reason again…

I am not amused whenever I read this type of generalization. There are many factors which can lead to a happy or unhappy family. To blame it on large families alone is hardly a good thing to do.

 

[Walking_Home]

Now, we’re clear.
And here’s my response to this:
Oh boy, not this type of reason again…

I am not amused whenever I read this type of generalization. There are many factors which can lead to a happy or unhappy family. To blame it on large families alone is hardly a good thing to do.

---

I am not amused either – when the health and welfare of children and women are at stake.

 

[Crescentinus]

I am not amused either – when the health and welfare of children and women are at stake.

This, I can agree with.
However, it’s not an excuse for population control.