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JustaServant
Guest
A lot of your questions were answerd.
Did you read them?
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Did you read them?
G
GreggAlvarez
Guest
Apology accepted.
It was a generalized question because the Church is generally hated.
Not true… Catholic Christians don’t have a “real problem” with it. They have no problem with it at all!
And we believe the Pope is inerrant when making an ex cathedra statement about faith and morals. I thought I would add to your statement just for some clarification.
There are no changes. Read other Catholics posts on here. Why is that so hard for people to do?
But you assume that your translation is an absolutely perfect translation of the original language. Nor have you taken the time to look at the arguments based on the historical context of the time. Yes, the Word of God is eternal, but the Bible was written in a point in human history. Therefore, we must study the history of those times to find out certain practices and such in order to clarify what we believe.
And we do see that it is possible that Jesus had brothers and sisters. Whether or not they are from Mary is what is debatable.
B
benedictus2
Guest
So it seems you were Catholic for 30 years and didn’t learn much. What did you do all that time?
I mean 30 years and you are so ignorant of what the Church actually teaches.
Well for one thing. How do you know that the Bible is inerrant? Who said so? Did Christ? Did the Bible say so?
Huh? The second commandment you speak is is actually part of the First.
The prohibition of idolatry is what having only the Lord as God is all about.
And pray tell where is the change?
If any change to God’s word was done, it was done by Luther.
How can any one who reads John think that Jesus has brothers and sister when none was there during His death and He actually entrusted His mother to an aspotle.
The terminology used refer to also to cousins and half-brothers.
No the Bible did not say that. No other person in the Bible was referred to as son of Mary except Jesus.
Yes indeed you are.
But it is not irreversable. Read. Think. Study.
BTW. You don’t write like you are over 30 years old. You sound very young in the way you write so I am sorry but I think you are fibbing about that one. If I am wrong, then I apologize.
J
JustaServant
Guest
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newcreation2009
Guest
I am not a ‘hit and run’ person that you think. Here’s what I sent to GreggAlvarez :
To all,
I am hardly enraged and I apologize for me coming across that way. I was wrong, on this site at least, for pointing out that I WAS Catholic for almost 30 years, BUT that I am saved because of my faith in Christ alone by the grace of God.
I think that the main problem is really in the question itself.
That’s like asking a man who you don’t know if he still beats his wife?
The question should be re-worded as such:
‘‘Why do/does _________(s) hate the Catholic church?’’
Christians who believe that the Bible is the inerrant, infallable word of God do have a real problem with the Catholic church that believes that the pope is inerrant & infallable.
Also, as I stated prior, the 2nd Commandment in Exodus 20 & Deuteronomy 5 is NOT FOUND in “The New St. Joseph Baltimore Catechism” and that is removing/changing the word of God. If my pointing that out is considered ‘‘hatred’’, then I simply don’t know the meaning of the word, and I claim ignorance.
How can anyone read 2 Timothy 3:16 - 18 and accept ANY changes to God’s word?
Also, how can anyone read Mark 6:1-3, Matthew 12:47 and 1 Corinthians 9: 3 - 6 then conclude that Jesus had NO brothers and sister? Mary, according to the inerrant, infallable WORD OF GOD had other children after Jesus. If taking the Word of God literally is considered ‘‘hatred’’, then, again, I claim ignorance.
Of course according to ''http://www.catholic.com/tracts/mary-ever-virgin", documents OTHER THAN THE BIBLE claim that Mary remained a virgin, DESPITE WHAT WE READ IN THE BIBLE (the inerrant, infallable WORD OF GOD!!) So, just as Jesus hated ‘religion’ of His time for leading people astray, many Bible believing, Jesus following folks of this time, also hate ‘religions’ that teach falsehoods that aren’t found in the Word of God.
Galatians 1:8
But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach a gospel other than the one we preached to you, let them be under God’s curse!
For God’s glory,
Tim
To all,
I am hardly enraged and I apologize for me coming across that way. I was wrong, on this site at least, for pointing out that I WAS Catholic for almost 30 years, BUT that I am saved because of my faith in Christ alone by the grace of God.
I think that the main problem is really in the question itself.
That’s like asking a man who you don’t know if he still beats his wife?
The question should be re-worded as such:
‘‘Why do/does _________(s) hate the Catholic church?’’
Christians who believe that the Bible is the inerrant, infallable word of God do have a real problem with the Catholic church that believes that the pope is inerrant & infallable.
Also, as I stated prior, the 2nd Commandment in Exodus 20 & Deuteronomy 5 is NOT FOUND in “The New St. Joseph Baltimore Catechism” and that is removing/changing the word of God. If my pointing that out is considered ‘‘hatred’’, then I simply don’t know the meaning of the word, and I claim ignorance.
How can anyone read 2 Timothy 3:16 - 18 and accept ANY changes to God’s word?
Also, how can anyone read Mark 6:1-3, Matthew 12:47 and 1 Corinthians 9: 3 - 6 then conclude that Jesus had NO brothers and sister? Mary, according to the inerrant, infallable WORD OF GOD had other children after Jesus. If taking the Word of God literally is considered ‘‘hatred’’, then, again, I claim ignorance.
Of course according to ''http://www.catholic.com/tracts/mary-ever-virgin", documents OTHER THAN THE BIBLE claim that Mary remained a virgin, DESPITE WHAT WE READ IN THE BIBLE (the inerrant, infallable WORD OF GOD!!) So, just as Jesus hated ‘religion’ of His time for leading people astray, many Bible believing, Jesus following folks of this time, also hate ‘religions’ that teach falsehoods that aren’t found in the Word of God.
Galatians 1:8
But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach a gospel other than the one we preached to you, let them be under God’s curse!
For God’s glory,
Tim
B
benedictus2
Guest
So tell me, who said that the Bible is the Word of God? Who said it is inerrant?
Do you even know that you only know of Jesus because of His Church
Do you know that every true and good thing you know about God came from the Catholic Church and every bad and ill formed theology was made up by your Church?
Now, please explain to me why the “brothers and sisters” you speak of were ordering Jesus. Do you know that only someone who is older can do that? So it seems these “brothers and sisters” are older than Jesus. But how can that be considering that Jesus is Mary’s first born Son.
Also, as I asked before, why did Jesus leave Mary to John? In that society, the family looked after each other. Where are the brothers and sisters at his death. No mention of them at the crucifixion and neither after the resurrection.
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JustaServant
Guest
Are you claiming the CC preaches another Gospel?
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JustaServant
Guest
Did you even bother to read any responses?
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Stella101
Guest
Marybeloved .
You know that saying “people fear that which they don’t know” that is what you getting ,people who do not understand the church doctrine and Faith and believe they fear that ,they do not know what to expect of us at all …
and your answer to the following
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pfaffenhoffen
Muslims are like Catholics: it is either them or us.
Hey, friend, could you please explain that sentence?
The Muslim culture and believe is foreign to alot of ppl ,but there a hand full of ppl who do not fear it and has gone out to learn more about and have learn to respect it as well if there is 2 misunderstood religions in this world it’s the Roman Catholic and the Muslim faith.
And you know what i love about our faith is that we are taught to be tolerant and forgiving …and not to jugde for only God is allow to do so .
. Blessed are you when men revile you and persecute you and utter all kinds of evil against you falsely on my account. Rejoice and be glad, for your reward is great in heaven.12
I love this part of the . THE BEATITUDES
You know that saying “people fear that which they don’t know” that is what you getting ,people who do not understand the church doctrine and Faith and believe they fear that ,they do not know what to expect of us at all …
and your answer to the following
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pfaffenhoffen
Muslims are like Catholics: it is either them or us.
Hey, friend, could you please explain that sentence?
The Muslim culture and believe is foreign to alot of ppl ,but there a hand full of ppl who do not fear it and has gone out to learn more about and have learn to respect it as well if there is 2 misunderstood religions in this world it’s the Roman Catholic and the Muslim faith.
And you know what i love about our faith is that we are taught to be tolerant and forgiving …and not to jugde for only God is allow to do so .
. Blessed are you when men revile you and persecute you and utter all kinds of evil against you falsely on my account. Rejoice and be glad, for your reward is great in heaven.12
I love this part of the . THE BEATITUDES
M
mangy_dog
Guest
Blah blah blah,
Doctrine of demons - when somone uses false premises, interspersed with lies and mis-information.
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jam070406
Guest
You’re putting forth the claim that, like the religion of His day, (which He followed) Jesus hates the Catholic Church? The Church He built?
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JustaServant
Guest
He apologizes for his earlier post…and then repeats the same.
Typical of someone lost in fundamentalim. When struck by something that destroys their illusions and they lapse into attack mode and keep their eyes wide shut.
they never take the time to really talk about the teachings of the Catholic Church. They simply make the accusations that either was told or inferred to everyone that ALL Catholics are going straight to hell, with the pope in the front row seat. Slander and ad hominum attacks are not a defense
It’s never an easy thing admitting one has believed a lie. The anger comes not so much from the lie, but that one has been gullible enough to buy into it. I suppose it is anger directed more toward oneself. Many times the people passing on the lie do not know or mean to do so, they are just too lazy to check out the truth of it.
J
jam070406
Guest
I saw a show on YouTube with 2 atheists that take calls on topics of Faith, etc. One of the things they pointed out was that when fundamentalists get challenged they usually always fall into anger.
J
JustaServant
Guest
NC, before Eric makes you go away. I ask you to please hear me out.
I am only two years older than you. I also am from Pittsburgh and attended Catholic school. I walked away from the Catholic Church for almost twenty years. I even became a preacher and spouted much of the anti-Catholic rhetoric you are stating.
Is your new found faith more about what you are against? Or what you are for? Does your new found faith create love or hate?
I can tell you that you are being lied to.
Face what you fear you will discover that the Catholic Church is not the evil institution responsible for every evil imaginable. But she is instead the most beautiful Lady Christ purchased,
Fear will be replaced by love.
Perfect love casts out fear.
I am only two years older than you. I also am from Pittsburgh and attended Catholic school. I walked away from the Catholic Church for almost twenty years. I even became a preacher and spouted much of the anti-Catholic rhetoric you are stating.
Is your new found faith more about what you are against? Or what you are for? Does your new found faith create love or hate?
I can tell you that you are being lied to.
Face what you fear you will discover that the Catholic Church is not the evil institution responsible for every evil imaginable. But she is instead the most beautiful Lady Christ purchased,
Fear will be replaced by love.
Perfect love casts out fear.
M
Mystic_Faith
Guest
This is one of the best posts I have read today!! Specificaly regarding the Protestant Church.
J
Jack_Bauer
Guest
The pope is not inerrant. Person verses teaching. Huge difference. The pope’s formal declarations from the Office [from the seat of his office as leader of the Lord’s Church on Earth] on the matters of faith and morals are considered to be infallible. Inerrant. This is often confused with impeccable. He’s just a man like you and I, only in his office, as scripture says, is holy and better in the state of celibacy compared to those who are married. We could bounce this around for a while. Most Catholics do not know their faith or the teachings of the Catholic Church. That’s why they end up leaving.
I can help you understand it more precisely. Most Protestants misinterpret this without realizing they’re trying to apply modern resources with resources available to them during that time. In fact, I thought I already explain this in part to you. And, what changes are you talking about?
SO why do you not accept or ignore the beliefes and teachings of the early Christians during the days following the lives of the apostles? It is clear that they believe Mary remained a virgin even after the birth of Jesus. You’re making up your own religion as Protestants do. This believe seems to be based on modern concepts of culture, and rudely ignores the culture of Jesus’ time. It’s kind of like scolding people in the 1800;s for not practicing birth control because they couldn’t afford the kids. During that time they believed any kind of procreation was sinful… that included the Protestants. I wish more people were required to take geography from not only economics, but also historic and culture perspectives. It would clear up a lot of this twisted thinking.
M
mangy_dog
Guest
The Catholic church is the One, True church that Christ intended to exist after His ascension into heaven and of which He left Peter as it’s first Pope…264 popes later to Pope Benedict XVI. The gates of hell have not and will not prevail against her.
There is no lie in the Catholic Faith. The fulness of truth is in the Catholic Faith. The sooner you comprehend that, the better your threads will go.
Is this simple and clear enough for you?
N
newcreation2009
Guest
So it seems you were Catholic for 30 years and didn’t learn much. What did you do all that time?
I mean 30 years and you are so ignorant of what the Church actually teaches.
RESPONSE : Thanks for the ad hominem attack.
Well for one thing. How do you know that the Bible is inerrant? Who said so? Did Christ? Did the Bible say so?
ANSWER: Uh, well, the Bible is inspired by God.(2 Tim. 3:16 - 17)
Obviously, after all of your Catholic training you forgot that God is All-Knowing and Sovereign and that NO MAN is. (To include you-know-who.)
Huh? The second commandment you speak is is actually part of the First.
ANSWER: Well, actually, according to “http://www.usccb.org/bible/exodus/20”, here’s how an educated person would read the 10 Commandments:
verse 3 is #1;
verses 4-6 are #2;
verse 7 is #3;
verses 8-11 are #4;
verse12 is #5;
verse 13 is #6;
verse 14 is #7;
verse 15 is #8;
verse 16 is #9;
and verse 17 is # 10.
The prohibition of idolatry is what having only the Lord as God is all about.
ANSWER: I agree!!
And pray tell where is the change?
ANSWER: Changes are done and have been done by many bishops, cardinals, popes. You can find these changes/differences in the catechisms and tenets, just as I did.
If any change to God’s word was done, it was done by Luther.
ANSWER/RESPONSE: Uh, Luther and others of the Reformation took the Bible, the chained Latin bible, out of the church and put it into the hands of the common man. Praise the Lord. You, my friend, would not be able to read the Bible today if the Catholic church had their way. (I know, that was ‘hateful’.)
How can any one who reads John think that Jesus has brothers and sister when none was there during His death and He actually entrusted His mother to an aspotle.
The terminology used refer to also to cousins and half-brothers.
No the Bible did not say that. No other person in the Bible was referred to as son of Mary except Jesus.
RESPONSE: O.K., you attacked my intelligence, but that’s alright, I’m man enough to take it, but really, are you going to tell me that you can honestly read Matthew 12:47, Mark 3:32, Luke 8:20 and 1 Corinthians 9:5 and ‘assume’ that Mary bore no other children after Jesus? Now I can at least admit when I might be ignorant ‘according to this site’, but you, are you intelligent enough to admit your blindness according to the infallable Word of the Almighty, Sovereign God?
For the glory of God,
Tim
I mean 30 years and you are so ignorant of what the Church actually teaches.
RESPONSE : Thanks for the ad hominem attack.
Well for one thing. How do you know that the Bible is inerrant? Who said so? Did Christ? Did the Bible say so?
ANSWER: Uh, well, the Bible is inspired by God.(2 Tim. 3:16 - 17)
Obviously, after all of your Catholic training you forgot that God is All-Knowing and Sovereign and that NO MAN is. (To include you-know-who.)
Huh? The second commandment you speak is is actually part of the First.
ANSWER: Well, actually, according to “http://www.usccb.org/bible/exodus/20”, here’s how an educated person would read the 10 Commandments:
verse 3 is #1;
verses 4-6 are #2;
verse 7 is #3;
verses 8-11 are #4;
verse12 is #5;
verse 13 is #6;
verse 14 is #7;
verse 15 is #8;
verse 16 is #9;
and verse 17 is # 10.
The prohibition of idolatry is what having only the Lord as God is all about.
ANSWER: I agree!!
And pray tell where is the change?
ANSWER: Changes are done and have been done by many bishops, cardinals, popes. You can find these changes/differences in the catechisms and tenets, just as I did.
If any change to God’s word was done, it was done by Luther.
ANSWER/RESPONSE: Uh, Luther and others of the Reformation took the Bible, the chained Latin bible, out of the church and put it into the hands of the common man. Praise the Lord. You, my friend, would not be able to read the Bible today if the Catholic church had their way. (I know, that was ‘hateful’.)
How can any one who reads John think that Jesus has brothers and sister when none was there during His death and He actually entrusted His mother to an aspotle.
The terminology used refer to also to cousins and half-brothers.
No the Bible did not say that. No other person in the Bible was referred to as son of Mary except Jesus.
RESPONSE: O.K., you attacked my intelligence, but that’s alright, I’m man enough to take it, but really, are you going to tell me that you can honestly read Matthew 12:47, Mark 3:32, Luke 8:20 and 1 Corinthians 9:5 and ‘assume’ that Mary bore no other children after Jesus? Now I can at least admit when I might be ignorant ‘according to this site’, but you, are you intelligent enough to admit your blindness according to the infallable Word of the Almighty, Sovereign God?
For the glory of God,
Tim
M
mangy_dog
Guest
Keep it simple:
Divine Revelation; Holy Scripture and the Magisterium. Fullness of Truth. Not you nor anyone outside the Catholic church will change this.
How futile. Remember the vision of St. John Bosco. You’d be better off steering your little vessel close to the Catholic Flagship.
N
newcreation2009
Guest
The pope is not inerrant. Person verses teaching. Huge difference. The pope’s formal declarations from the Office [from the seat of his office as leader of the Lord’s Church on Earth] on the matters of faith and morals are considered to be infallible. Inerrant. This is often confused with impeccable. He’s just a man like you and I, only in his office, as scripture says, is holy and better in the state of celibacy compared to those who are married. We could bounce this around for a while. Most Catholics do not know their faith or the teachings of the Catholic Church. That’s why they end up leaving.
RESPONSE: Well, who’s to blame for them leaving? Or maybe, just maybe they leave once they find out the truth?
I can help you understand it more precisely. Most Protestants misinterpret this without realizing they’re trying to apply modern resources with resources available to them during that time. In fact, I thought I already explain this in part to you. And, what changes are you talking about?
RESPONSE: I love you, bro, but how is 2 Timothy 3:16 - 17 misinterpretted or applied differently today than when it was written? See, that’s what I’m talking about, Catholics changing the inerrant, infallable Scripture of the Almighty, Sovereign God, then claimimg that Protestants are changing them to suit ‘modern resources’. Are you kidding me?
SO why do you not accept or ignore the beliefes and teachings of the early Christians during the days following the lives of the apostles? It is clear that they believe Mary remained a virgin even after the birth of Jesus. You’re making up your own religion as Protestants do. This believe seems to be based on modern concepts of culture, and rudely ignores the culture of Jesus’ time. It’s kind of like scolding people in the 1800;s for not practicing birth control because they couldn’t afford the kids. During that time they believed any kind of procreation was sinful… that included the Protestants. I wish more people were required to take geography from not only economics, but also historic and culture perspectives. It would clear up a lot of this twisted thinking.
RESPONSE: I ignore 'beliefs/teachings of early Christians…BECAUSE IT’S NOT IN THE BIBLE!!! The BIBLE is the inerrant, infallable WORD OF GOD…not some non-canonical writings.
2 Timothy 3:16-17 (straight-forward and easy to understand)
16 ALL Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness,
17 so that the servant of God may be thoroughly equipped for every good work.
RESPONSE: Well, who’s to blame for them leaving? Or maybe, just maybe they leave once they find out the truth?
I can help you understand it more precisely. Most Protestants misinterpret this without realizing they’re trying to apply modern resources with resources available to them during that time. In fact, I thought I already explain this in part to you. And, what changes are you talking about?
RESPONSE: I love you, bro, but how is 2 Timothy 3:16 - 17 misinterpretted or applied differently today than when it was written? See, that’s what I’m talking about, Catholics changing the inerrant, infallable Scripture of the Almighty, Sovereign God, then claimimg that Protestants are changing them to suit ‘modern resources’. Are you kidding me?
SO why do you not accept or ignore the beliefes and teachings of the early Christians during the days following the lives of the apostles? It is clear that they believe Mary remained a virgin even after the birth of Jesus. You’re making up your own religion as Protestants do. This believe seems to be based on modern concepts of culture, and rudely ignores the culture of Jesus’ time. It’s kind of like scolding people in the 1800;s for not practicing birth control because they couldn’t afford the kids. During that time they believed any kind of procreation was sinful… that included the Protestants. I wish more people were required to take geography from not only economics, but also historic and culture perspectives. It would clear up a lot of this twisted thinking.
RESPONSE: I ignore 'beliefs/teachings of early Christians…BECAUSE IT’S NOT IN THE BIBLE!!! The BIBLE is the inerrant, infallable WORD OF GOD…not some non-canonical writings.
2 Timothy 3:16-17 (straight-forward and easy to understand)
16 ALL Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness,
17 so that the servant of God may be thoroughly equipped for every good work.
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