I do apologise for misinterpreting your question’s intent. I have become overly sensitive to some types of questions because of the kind of bullying that goes on in some threads, and which have caused great confusion, anger and sorrow. So no hostility: I am so sorry.Wow, it is obvious that you think I am replying with hostility. That is the problem with these sorts of forums, you don’t get to hear the tone of ones’ voice, reasonable enough. And just to clear one thing up, absolutely not, do I believe or have never, ever stated that someone is an apostate for asking questions about the catholic faith. I have asked them myself! Many of the same questions you have asked. so I do apologize for any misunderstanding, but not for asking the question, or for my responses. God Bless you on your journey.
Than why not come home?I have not read “everything” that The Catholic church has to say on this subject, but attended Catholic grammar and Catholic High School, and have read many Catholic papers and documents stating that heaven is only available to those in The Catholic church. All the priests and nuns that I have posed that question to have agreed with this teaching.
God Bless,
Robert
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Eph 5:20 “Test all things, hold fast what is good.”
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I really appreciate your apparently sincere invitation. I just find so many doctrinal issues within the Catholic church that seem to contradict scripture, specifically in The Book of Acts and The Gospels.Than why not come home?
I am really trying hard to understand what you are saying here but this makes little sense to me. As I asked before, exactly what do you mean by SEE, in what meaning of the word see do Catholics see God?Ah it’s the old physical/ spiritual debate! Let’s see if you’ll answer my question to you…How does one see Christ in other religious denominations aside from the catholic church. I’ll bet I know the answer!!!
The Catholic Faith is the one founded by Jesus Christ. It is the Church which declared the Canon of the New Testament.Hi
I am looking for a few good reasons why Catholics believe that their Religion is true.
For example I realize that historical evidence from scriptures is generally used as an argument for it being true. However, since all Religions have some sort of historical grounding of their scriptures, this is not enough. I am looking for those two or three key aspects that make the Catholic Church stand out clearly as the only true Religion.
Thanks
Slowly, I have just checked out your public profile, you state you are of no religion. I assumed you would know the difference between what Catholics believe of the Holy Eucharist, and what other christian denominations believe about the Eucharist, I apologize for assuming, you know what they say about assuming:bigyikes: , I believe as a catholic christian that Christ is truly present in the Eucharist. Body soul and divinity. I do not see the Eucharist(bread, host) as merely a symbol of Christ. It is Christ. I see Christ each and everytime I receive Holy Communion, each time I fall onto my knees in Adoration. Does that explain it any better?I am really trying hard to understand what you are saying here but this makes little sense to me. As I asked before, exactly what do you mean by SEE, in what meaning of the word see do Catholics see God?
Also, I am not Protestant and do not know how other denominations see God either.
Because all truth come from God. History cannot contradict God. We know historically speaking that Jesus is a real person. We know from other sources outside Scripture from the writings of Pagan historians, and Josephus, a Jewish historian at the time.I have been reading with interest this thread. I too am asking in a similar thread how one finds truth. Many of the arguments use logic, history, or reasoning which I don’t understand how these can be used as the primary source of truth when it comes to God and religion.
A church is true because God himself declares that it is his church. God is the source of truth and knowledge. All other reasoning and facts will only strengthen the answer you have already received from God.
I know that there is a God and that he loves us. If you ask him sincerely in prayer he will let you know which religion is true. One does not need to look anywhere else or any further.
I don’t understand how you come up with this conclusion, Robert. How does Peter being the first pope mean that all the apostles did not share in Christ’s commission? Are you saying that, if all were given Keys, then Peter’s set of keys is not valid?Ephesians 2:20 “having been built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ Himself being the chief cornerstone.” God means what He says and says what He means , and He said apostles, and He meant apostles. Peter is only one apostle, so he can’t singularly be the foundation of the church. This fact cannot be dismissed. But if one is to believe that The Apostle peter was the first pope, Gods plural use of the word apostle must be ignored. For me I will never ignore God’s word, no matter what anyone tells me.
God Bless
Robert
Actually I do know what Catholics believe about the Eucharist. However what confused me was your use of the word SEE. I would have expected you to use the word EAT or TASTE but as far as I understand you don’t really literally SEE Christ with you eyes do you? You do see the bread but so do other denominations. As far as I understand this teaching of transubstantiation all attempts to literally see the flesh of Christ (after you put the bread in your mouth) will fail. Correct me if I am wrong here.Slowly, I have just checked out your public profile, you state you are of no religion. I assumed you would know the difference between what Catholics believe of the Holy Eucharist, and what other christian denominations believe about the Eucharist, I apologize for assuming, you know what they say about assuming:bigyikes: , I believe as a catholic christian that Christ is truly present in the Eucharist. Body soul and divinity. I do not see the Eucharist(bread, host) as merely a symbol of Christ. It is Christ. I see Christ each and everytime I receive Holy Communion, each time I fall onto my knees in Adoration. Does that explain it any better?
The church is built on the apostleI don’t understand how you come up with this conclusion, Robert. How does Peter being the first pope mean that all the apostles did not share in Christ’s commission? Are you saying that, if all were given Keys, then Peter’s set of keys is not valid?
I have explained in previous posts why even this procedure for finding the truth does not appear to be particularly reliable to me. People from various Religions seem to get different answers to this question. I have no doubt that amongst most Religions there are people that sincerely have asked this question of God and then got different answers.…
I know that there is a God and that he loves us. If you ask him sincerely in prayer he will let you know which religion is true. One does not need to look anywhere else or any further.
How so?I really appreciate your apparently sincere invitation. I just find so many doctrinal issues within the Catholic church that seem to contradict scripture, specifically in The Book of Acts and The Gospels.
God Bless,
Robert
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God commands us to “test all things.” Eph 5:20
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I think the doctrine of “transubstantiation” did not come along for centuries. Transubstantiation is a word used in an attempt to express what Jesus was saying:Most Christian denominations perform the “Eucharist” although they may call it by another name. I gather you are referring to the doctrine of transubstantiation. Except what confuses me is that I thought it was impossible to really see the blood and body of Jesus. Any scientific test even to test whether transubstantiation took place will fail and so I gather any visual inspection will also fail. So I am not sure exactly how you use the word “SEE” in this context.
You are contradicting yourself, Robert. If Holy Mother Church teaches that there are non-Catholic people in heaven, then how can there be no salvation outside the church?Actually Christianity falls into that catagory. John 6:44 “no one can come to Me unless the Father who sent Me draws him; and I will raise him up at the last day.” John 6:47 “Most assuredly I say to you he who believes in me has eternal life.” So for all those religions who don’t believe in Jesus Christ as Lord, they will not have eternal life.
It is only the Holy Mother Church that understands and teaches that everyone in Heaven is not Catholic. A truly compassionate and just God looks at what we have been exposed to and the knowledge we have learned in this life to judge us. Our faith is inclusive no exclusive.
Vatican ll’s document lumen gentium reaffirmed the dogma, and the document humanea teaches that Catholicism is the only true religion. The Catholic church clearly teaches that if you are not a Catholic, you are out of God’s will, and consequently headed for hell. So actually your faith is exclusive, not inclusive.
God Bless,
Robert
The Eucharist is Christ, it is not a symbol of Him. He is truly present, body, soul and divinity. Put it this way, You look at me, I have a body, you can see it. Brown hair, Green eyes. Do you see my soul? You must, it is not a seperate entity from me. it is part of me. Just as Christ was fully human and fully divine, you can not seperate the two. It is Christ that I behold each time I look upon the Eucharist, with my body and my soul. We are both body and spirit. You state"you see the bread but so do other denominations", and I say “No, I do not see bread I see Jesus”. And you state that you understand" all attempts to literally see the flesh of Christ (after you put the bread in your mouth)will fail. We do not as catholics “put the bread in our mouths” we literally are taking and eating Christ. It is what he commanded us to do. the Eucharist is a unique and miraculous, reality in which we consume the entirety of the LIVING Christ-although His natural condition is veiled by the Sacrament.Actually I do know what Catholics believe about the Eucharist. However what confused me was your use of the word SEE. I would have expected you to use the word EAT or TASTE but as far as I understand you don’t really literally SEE Christ with you eyes do you? You do see the bread but so do other denominations. As far as I understand this teaching of transubstantiation all attempts to literally see the flesh of Christ (after you put the bread in your mouth) will fail. Correct me if I am wrong here.
For starters…what must I do to go to heaven?How so?
So when other people see “bread” Catholics see “Christ” instead? When you and I look at exactly the same piece of bread at exactly the same time, I would see a piece of bread and you would literally see Christ?…
We do not as catholics “put the bread in our mouths” we literally are taking and eating Christ. It is what he commanded us to do. the Eucharist is a unique and miraculous, reality in which we consume the entirety of the LIVING Christ-although His natural condition is veiled by the Sacrament.
If you don’ t see your need, Robert why are you participating in this discussion?Without seeming presumptious, why would someone need the Catholic church, if what Jesus said is true.
This is an erroneous conclusion, based on an erroneous understanding of the facts. What we read in Matt. 16:18 was written many years after the Church was founded by Christ. The teachings were handed down by the Apostles to the early church orally and with traditions. The writings of the Apostles were committed into writing, and these writings form what we now call the New Testament. What is written is for instruction, and training in righteousness. Not all the teachings are written, but only those sufficient to bring one to belief and study. The bible came from the church, not the other way around. The church is what gives authenticity to the scripture:Catholic dogma states that the Apostle Peter was the first Pope. Is the entire basis for this belief found in Matthew 16:18? And if this is true, then it would seem logical to conclude that the Bible preceded the Catholic church.
Perhaps the bible you are reading is missing some parts? Perhaps you are just skipping over the parts that don’t agree with your opinion?God’s grace, and my faith is all that is needed for salvation according to the Bible.
Perhaps this answers the question I posed above, about why you are here. IF you are so certain that the answer to your questions are in the pages of that book, then why are you here having discussion on a Catholic forum? “who needs it”?Slowly is searching for the true church, as am I. According to the Bible, Jesus is the head of the church, and the elect (the true believers) are the body. So the church is comprised of Jesus and the believers…according to the Bible.
I think you have been corrected about this before, but I will withold my suspicious thoughts that you are deliberately trying to be contentious. Jesus is the head of His body, the church. The bishop of Rome is a symbol of the unity of all the bishops (shepherds) in God;s church. Jesus is the chief shepherd, and has ordained that those He has appointed will share in his ministry as shepherd.In Catholicism the Pope is the head of the Catholic church. Who then who is the head of the church? Is God’s church the Catholic church? Or is it Jesus and the elect? Or both?
No. What complicates things is refusing the truth. If you cling to your erroneous beliefs of what the Catholic church is, and what you were erroneously told or taught, it complicates matters. It might be easier if you could approach this with the attitude that maybe, just maybe, you were misinformed.I agree with slowly, is it really this complicated?
This last part was addressed already in another thread, and is off topic here. I suggest you search the words thief on cross and read up on it there.If so, how did the thief on the cross make it to heaven? All he did was believe, he wasn’t a Catholic…and wasn’t even baptised!
God Bless,
Robert
Christianity is not about a “religion”, it is about a relationship. You will have a hard time developing a relationship unless you talk to the other person. This quest of yours to “find the true religion” seems pretty tedious and unnecesary to me. You seem to think you will find “truth” in some sort of historical exploration. Whereas, Jesus said “I am the way, the truth, and the life”. It seems to me that you could save yourself a lot of time and effort going to the Person, rather than trying to “prove” by way of tenents what is the “right” religion.Regarding the use of “prayer” as a way to find the truth of Catholocism, is this generally accepted by Catholics as an appropriate way? I am asking because I know the Reborn Christians also say this about their Religion.