Why We Fight

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Shoshana:
Code:
I wouldn’t be so proud of the fact when the Soviets, while invading Germany villages, raped every female person on site regardless of age and then crucified ALL of them.

Great world we live in…

Blessings,
Shoshana
You exagerate. That happened, but it was limited in scope. The progression into Germany by the Russians saw other atrocities and brutalities and a lot of rape. But not very many women in Germany were crucified by advancing Russians. Most rape victoms who died committed suicide.

See:
lrb.co.uk/v24/n23/asch01_.html
 
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gilliam:
You exagerate. That happened, but it was limited in scope. The progression into Germany saw other atrocities and brutalities and a lot of rape. But not very many women in Germany were crucified by advancing Russians. Most rape victoms who died committed suicide.

See:
lrb.co.uk/v24/n23/asch01_.html
Rape was considered a "weapon of war by the Russians wherever they went - when one reads the testimony of women trapped in buildings even under bombardment with street to street fighting, it is unbelievable. I never heard of the crucifixions in any one’s memoirs so I can’t say I know anything about it. But one of the reasons women feared Russians at that time was because of their practice of assault and my understanding is that the orphanages post war were glutted with children born of both liebensborn and these rapes.
 
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HagiaSophia:
Rape was considred a "weapon of war by the Russians wherever they went .
No, it was a lack of discipline. Modern, disciplined armies don’t rape, it causes delay and problems with troop moral.
 
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cestusdei:
We cured liberalism here in the US last November. Let’s elect Jeb Bush as the next President!
I don’t think there is any permanent cure—I think all you can do is “contain it”
 
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gilliam:
No, it was a lack of discipline. Modern, disciplined armies don’t rape, it causes delay and problems with troop moral.
We’re talking then - not now and it is a fact that this is what happened to women under invading Russian troops according to their own testimonies.
 
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HagiaSophia:
Rape was considered a "weapon of war by the Russians wherever they went - when one reads the testimony of women trapped in buildings even under bombardment with street to street fighting, it is unbelievable. I never heard of the crucifixions in any one’s memoirs so I can’t say I know anything about it. But one of the reasons women feared Russians at that time was because of their practice of assault and my understanding is that the orphanages post war were glutted with children born of both liebensborn and these rapes.
Rape shows a lack of discipline. A modern, disciplined army does not rape since it causes infighting amongst the troops, a general lack of discipline, spread of illness and slows down the advance.
 
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HagiaSophia:
We’re talking then - not now and it is a fact that this is what happened to women under invading Russian troops according to their own testimonies.
Code:
You are right. but not only the Russians but also the Germans. When Germans later retook the village, they invited reporters from neutral countries–Sweden, Switzerland, and Spain–to see what the Red Army had done. German theatres were soon showing a horrifying newsreel filmed in the village.

My information comes from National Geographic and I have never read anything that was close to exagerration in this magazine. It is quite scientific. From what I understand, this knowledge was not passed on to the other countries.

I reiterate that this was no exagerration.

Blessings,
Shoshana
 
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cestusdei:
Matt,
Ah so you supported Milosvic and his destruction of Muslims. Yet you object when we fight them? I suppose if someone attacked your family you would help them out rather then try and stop them? Oh and the Soviets began the war as ALLIES of Hitler. Remember Poland? Gosh you folks have such short memories. Stalin only fought when Hitler reneged on the non-aggression pact. He refused to believe Hitler had lied and let many of his troops die during the first part of the invasion. Then of course we had to counter Soviet influence in Europe till the wall came down. Please don’t hestitate to thank US for that too.
I would suggest the Holy Father probably remembers Poland better than any of us, yet he still talks of peace and peaceful coexistance. Has the Holy Father a short memory?

I notice you are beginning to claim for taking the Berlin Wall down as well, I always thought it was the people of East Germany that did that but then, they don’t have the advantage of re-writing history.

p.s. Have you thanked France yet for contributing to your War of Independance?
 
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Norwich:
Therefore anyone who disagrees with you, (Like most of the rest of the world) is irrational? Hmmmm… :confused:
Your absolutely wrong there my friend, most of the rest of the world agrees with himgilliam], why else woud the Ur-a-Peein’s be starting to jump on the bandwagon [besides the fact that the hard, expensive, crucial work is over].
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cestusdei:
Matt,
So you don’t want the Taliban or Saddam back in power. How very nice. You can express your thanks to us anytime. Yes, in WWII we did bail you out and we do expect a little appreciation. If I saved your dads life wouldn’t you feel a tad obligated? Given how Europe is acting it won’t be long before you are crying for US help again. You did in Yugoslavia, remember? Your tired kneejerk anti-Americanism is no longer a concern to us. Americans are becoming immune to the opinions of quisling Europeans. We realize you hate us no matter what we do. “The only thing that allows evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing”. Wise words from Burke. Heed them. We are not pacifists. We can fight justly and have done so. You point out how UN sanctions failed. No help there then eh? You forget though how many hundreds of thousands were killed by Saddam. Think of how many Iraqi’s are alive today because he isn’t in power. Thanks to US.
YOU GO “cestusdei”! 👍

It is a darn good thing that all you left-side, liberal pansies are the minority. Your kind of thinking gets whole nations oppressed and/or taken over. Europe is just jealous because none of its leaders have a backbone.

Peace to you all!
 
Norwich,
And what led the East Germans and West Germans to tear down the wall? Ronald Reagan. The Pope does not like war. That is no secret. We don’t either. But bin Laden loves it. He wants to kill me and YOU. When someone is trying to kill you then you have the right of self-defense. Iraq is becoming a democracy. Notice how that totally annoys the bin Ladens out there? Think about whose side you are on.
 
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cestusdei:
Norwich,
And what led the East Germans and West Germans to tear down the wall? Ronald Reagan. The Pope does not like war. That is no secret. We don’t either. But bin Laden loves it. He wants to kill me and YOU. When someone is trying to kill you then you have the right of self-defense. Iraq is becoming a democracy. Notice how that totally annoys the bin Ladens out there? Think about whose side you are on.
And I always thought Jesus said “Turn the other cheek”

Actually I know what side I’m on, GODS, the real question is do **you **know which side your on?:confused:
 
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Norwich:
And I always thought Jesus said “Turn the other cheek”

Actually I know what side I’m on, GODS, the real question is do **you **know which side your on?:confused:
I think unless one is a gnostic and purports to know through some special knowledge, just what it is God wants in this matter, one must first try and decide how one perceives the Will of God rather than using God to support one’s own political agenda.
 
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Norwich:
p.s. Have you thanked France yet for contributing to your War of Independance?
Yes as I recall during WWI an officer telling the French - “Lafayette, we are here” and yes, we have the cemeteries and the white crosses to prove it. We said thanks, more than once, and as I recall they were called WWI and II in case you missed those chapters in your revised history courses.
 
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cestusdei:
Norwich,
The Pope does not like war. That is no secret. We don’t either…
It is not just that the Holy Father is against war. He is against this war. If you say opponents of the war are supporters of al Qaeda then your are saying that the Pope is a supporter of al Qaeda.

If you cannot tell the difference between people who, using their God given powers of reasoning and thought, come to different conclusions from, American conservatives and say so and people who fly hi-jacked aeroplanes into buildings then you need to learn more about democracy. Guilt by association where you link everyone who disagrees with you into one undifferentiated mass and treat them all as enemies does not build peace. It builds hatred. The world needs less hatred not more.
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When someone is trying to kill you then you have the right of self-defense. Think about whose side you are on.
People tried to kill Our Lord Jesus Christ. He had the right to defend himself. His power could not be doubted. He chose to die a criminals painful death on the cross rather than exercise his right of self defence. His side I most definitely am on.
 
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HagiaSophia:
Yes as I recall during WWI an officer telling the French - “Lafayette, we are here” and yes, we have the cemeteries and the white crosses to prove it. We said thanks, more than once, and as I recall they were called WWI and II in case you missed those chapters in your revised history courses.
How do you propose we show our gratitude to the 8 500 000 Red Army dead?

Or for that matter the 36 000 Indians who died, the 250 000 Greeks, the 200 000 Dutch, the 29 000 Australians, 39 000 Canadians users.erols.com/mwhite28/ww2stats.htm , 35 000 Irish soldiers joined the British army and died in combat, despite the neutrality of their country irishcultureandcustoms.com/ACalend/VetsWW1.html
how should we show our gratitude to them?

It is absurd to suppose that because of the part played by the USA in the 1939-1945 war every European should always support every aspect of US foreign policy forever. Of course if you elected more Presidents like FDR and fewer like GWB then we might.
:blessyou:
 
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Matt25:
How do you propose we show our gratitude to the 8 500 000 Red Army dead?

Or for that matter the 36 000 Indians who died, the 250 000 Greeks, the 200 000 Dutch, the 29 000 Australians, 39 000 Canadians users.erols.com/mwhite28/ww2stats.htm , 35 000 Irish soldiers joined the British army and died in combat, despite the neutrality of their country irishcultureandcustoms.com/ACalend/VetsWW1.html
how should we show our gratitude to them?

It is absurd to suppose that because of the part played by the USA in the 1939-1945 war every European should always support every aspect of US foreign policy forever. Of course if you elected more Presidents like FDR and fewer like GWB then we might.
:blessyou:
Up to the usual sidewinding I see - your question was have we ever thanked France - I gave you an answer so spare me the index card talkng points from the latest march or rally. Good grief the Scots finaly got a council/government house of their own a couple of years back and already they are telling us how to run our government.
 
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Matt25:
I always thought no one was beyond redemption, but hey I’m just an old fashioned Catholic. Talking of which did the Pope support the invasion of Afghanistan? Just asking.

I have been to battle, and Matt25 I would not want to go into a battle with you, if you rteally believe what you have writen on this thread. I cpuldn’t trust you. You get an urge to “go peaceful” suddenly. But you will sit back here and enjoys the safety our militarty affords you.
 
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Matt25:
I always thought no one was beyond redemption, but hey I’m just an old fashioned Catholic. Talking of which did the Pope support the invasion of Afghanistan? Just asking.

Yes, but you like to enjoy the fruits of our military, you are safe aren’t you. I wouldn’t want to go into a battle with you, I don’t trust you.
 
Exporter said:
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I have been to battle, and Matt25 I would not want to go into a battle with you, if you rteally believe what you have writen on this thread. I cpuldn’t trust you. You get an urge to “go peaceful” suddenly. But you will sit back here and enjoys the safety our militarty affords you.

“Good people sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf.”
–George Orwell
 
Exporter said:
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Yes, but you like to enjoy the fruits of our military, you are safe aren’t you. I wouldn’t want to go into a battle with you, I don’t trust you.

Ah… the famous cry of the military man, “I can’t rely on pacifists, I need a strong man next to me”.

Now, if you are really a military man you will know that many so called pacifists did serve in the services and many of them were decorated for bravery. They were medics, doctors, nurses, ambulance drivers helicopter rescue personel, ad infunitum. So lets dispense with the implied cowardice rubbish. There were many of them got themselves killed on war zones, often more so, they had such a love for their fellow man they often considerd their own lives expendable for others, INCLUDING THE ENEMY.

And before you get carried away, yes, I’m ex military; yes, I have been shot at, I have shot at, and I have been scared ****less. I have fought in various so called “Wars” I have even had the dubious privilage of training American Special Forces (that was fun) and it because of that that I totally agree with Matt, War is the biggest waste of man and time and a total rejection of God. Simple really.

Might be worth remembering the Mass dismassal,

GO IN PEACE TO LOVE AND SERVE THE LORD
 
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